How is the testing going and when is the release date in 2026?
The Argali Clothing Project
- Thread starter Brad@Argali
- Start date
OP
OP
Great question. For tops, there are a variety of reasons. I'm a big fan of synthetic insulation and active insulation, but I wanted to start with a piece that was simple, approachable, and could fit in any backcountry hunters layering kit. While there are a lot of midweight fleeces out there, finding one that I can actually wear while hiking has been a chore as I've found they are often too warm or not warm enough. To me our Guide Air Fleece threads the needle as the kind of midlayer you can take on almost any hunt.
I've found that in anything but cold weather hunts, evolve and alpha in any of the weights are warm to wear while hiking, and for me, too warm, unless it's naked alpha. But naked alpha has it's own issues that I don't think are ideal for hunting (i.e. snagging on everything). So, I like alpha and evolve, but until I'm hunting in colder weather, I use them to keep warm while glassing or hanging out at camp.
On the pants, It's hard to describe in the abstract, but a great pair of pants has to have great fabric, excellent fit, and the right amount of functionality and features. My approach is simplicity above all else. Proper fit, simple feature set, durable, QUIET fabrics with the right amount of stretch, and the right cut for the pants (i.e. tapered not straight leg). I'm going to share some photos from a recent moose hunt I just did showing some photos of the Torex just to show how we're testing and what I'm finding.
Also, I do have a jacket I am nearly done with that uses Evolve that I absolutely love that I'll be talking more about here soon. I'm a big fan of synthetic, active insulation in the right pieces and we will absolutely be making some of those pieces.
Well awesome where’s my pair to try? Lol
RWT
WKR
- Joined
- Jul 4, 2022
- Messages
- 926
I am in on this. I really appreciate well made purpose driven clothing. I now only buy Hart Schaefer suits. Why. I still have the one I was married in from 2006 and it still looks great. Fits well and although not in style with the skinny Jean flat fronts, it is classic and I remind the youngsters. I am a MAN. I have MAN parts and those parts need to be taken care of with room to move.
Still have my Rivers West original fleece jacket and pant. They have been on many hunts and are by far the warmest jacket I own. That set is 18 years old. Does not breath at all, but very warm. It’s a shame they suck at marketing or new design.
Make a great product and they will still be using it 20 years later.
Still have my Rivers West original fleece jacket and pant. They have been on many hunts and are by far the warmest jacket I own. That set is 18 years old. Does not breath at all, but very warm. It’s a shame they suck at marketing or new design.
Make a great product and they will still be using it 20 years later.
That being said tough enough for the Africa bush? I’m headed over next year to chase buf.
OP
OP
No idea. I've never been so don't know what the vegetation is like. Our Vesper pants aren't designed to be brush busting pants. Even though they are durable and I have personally used them a lot in a wide variety of environments and had 0 issues, everything has a breaking point. If you're looking for brush busting pants specifically to crawl through thorns, these aren't them. I'd look for something with a heavier front fabric that has cordura in it.
Clothing, as with any product, is all about tradeoffs. You can't have lightweight and the most durable fabric. For an early season pant like our Vesper, It's about finding the right balance between being lightweight and durable, which I fully believe we have done. However, if anyone that makes clothing is being honest, lightweight clothing, especially pants, are not impervious to destruction.
OP
OP
I spent 12 days in Alaska in September hunting for moose and using/testing our clothing and gear, and wanted to give you all an update on that trip and how the gear performed. This trip had the full AK experience-- bad weather, high winds, bugs that could carry you away, etc. On the bright side, hunts that suck can be great gear-testing trips, and this was a fantastic trip to test the limits of our equipment.
Every hunt has its challenges, but this one was particularly rough. It rained most of the trip, and the winds were incredibly high for a few days (45-50 mph sustained). And when the winds weren’t blowing, the bugs were the worst I’ve ever experienced.
After not seeing a moose for 10 days, on the 11th day, in the last hour of our last morning of hunting, we called in a legal bull, and my good friend Charlie shot it. We hustled to get it back to camp in time to catch our bush flight out. It’s a good reminder to hunt until the bitter end, even when things seem desperate.
Clothing We Tested
On this trip, all three of us wore the Torex Pant and the Guide Air Fleece. Temperatures ranged from the low 20s at night to highs near 60. The Guide Air Fleece stayed on us day and night, and we all wore one pair of pants the entire trip.
Even though I design our products, I’m our biggest skeptic and harshest critic. With our clothing, my expectations are borderline unrealistic for performance. Here’s what I noticed that stood out about the clothing on this trip:
P.S. If you look closely you'll see an early prototype of a jacket we're working on for down the road.
Every hunt has its challenges, but this one was particularly rough. It rained most of the trip, and the winds were incredibly high for a few days (45-50 mph sustained). And when the winds weren’t blowing, the bugs were the worst I’ve ever experienced.
After not seeing a moose for 10 days, on the 11th day, in the last hour of our last morning of hunting, we called in a legal bull, and my good friend Charlie shot it. We hustled to get it back to camp in time to catch our bush flight out. It’s a good reminder to hunt until the bitter end, even when things seem desperate.
Clothing We Tested
On this trip, all three of us wore the Torex Pant and the Guide Air Fleece. Temperatures ranged from the low 20s at night to highs near 60. The Guide Air Fleece stayed on us day and night, and we all wore one pair of pants the entire trip.
Even though I design our products, I’m our biggest skeptic and harshest critic. With our clothing, my expectations are borderline unrealistic for performance. Here’s what I noticed that stood out about the clothing on this trip:
- The Torex pants didn’t “bag out” after multiple days of use and remained comfortable, even after repeatedly getting wet and drying (That’s the advantage of a polyester fabric over a nylon).
- The fit of the waist remained constant throughout the trip and didn't stretch out even after sitting under a sweaty pack hip belt every day. (We have a special liner inside our waistband that helps prevent too much stretch, but I wasn’t sure how it would perform in the real world).
- Durability was on point. The Torex Pants held up to abuse in the brush, and nobody had any snags or tears.
- The side zips provided ample air flow when it got warm out, and the mesh liners kept all debris and bugs out.
- The thigh pocket volume and positioning on the leg were great.
- The Guide Air Fleece was comfortable and performed flawlessly. The thumb holes on the sleeves were particularly useful on this trip, as the bugs were atrocious.
P.S. If you look closely you'll see an early prototype of a jacket we're working on for down the road.
Agreed everything has a trade off. I’d rather have quiet than super tough and durable and loud. I’ll try them over there and we will see. Hell half the ph’s hunt in shorts lol
OP
OP
I forgot to answer your question on timing…January ‘26 we will have the presale with product shipping March or April.
Back_country_blacktail
Lil-Rokslider
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2019
- Messages
- 132
Is there going to be an option for tall skinny people for the pants? 32x36?
OP
OP
We will have a tall size eventually but not in the first run. Our inseam length though runs a little long at 33” for the 32 waist. That plus our slightly longer rise make for a slightly longer pant than most standard 32 waisted pants. We have a tester that typically wears a 35” inseam that is wearing them and likes the length.
Is that going to be the only inseam? I am a 30" inseam and most hunting brands usually dont cater to us with shorter inseams.
OP
OP
The inseam length varies by waist size. I don't have a size chart built yet, but will share once I do. But we won't have tall and short sizing right away. You can always hem the pants if you want.
For the record I'm here too - going standard length 33" is kinda messy for a lot of people. Yes you can hem them - but that does not address where the knee darts fall on your leg, or the leg opening being slightly larger (even with a taper leg). Although a PITA having 31" and 33" (standard) would go a long way on fit. Even if they are the best pants ever, I can tell you I'm not buying and having a couple inches hemmed out of a pant, for better or worse - it's turned out poor enough for me enough times that I'm over that approach. Probably the minority there, but you're listening so I'm saying it.
BTW - waists - when OV released a true 33" waist and didn't go 32-34, made my day, because there's such a huge difference getting fit perfect. Something to consider....
I’m 33” waist as well and agree it’s a big advantage having a 33” waist vs 32 or 34.
My go to pants for a long time were the Sitka Ascents; they discontinued them and replaced with the Mercury pant—similar pant, but no more 33 or 35.
My go to pants for a long time were the Sitka Ascents; they discontinued them and replaced with the Mercury pant—similar pant, but no more 33 or 35.
OP
OP
Hey Matt,
Yes, I understand the issues with sizing and how the knees, legs, rise, hips, etc. need to function across size ranges and lengths. I have been obsessed with sizing and getting it right for the past 2 years. I could write a few pages on leg sizing across size grades and the amount of time we have spend on it to make sure the fit is correct across those sizes, but I do think our sizing works quite well across all of our size ranges for a wide variety of heights and waist sizes. Our testers, which have run the size gammut range from short, tall, big, skinny, not so skinny, etc. have found the fit to be great in the waist and legs across our pants. Hemming is a last resort if you are in an uncommon size category like 38x30. I wouldn't want to hem anything I buy either, and I don't think 99% of people will have to.
Would be great to hear from the two rokslide testers what their waist/inseam is normally and how the fit is for them on their pants.
Our waist size runs true to size (we aren't doing vanity sizing).
Last thing I'll say is you can always try it out, and if the sizing doesn't suit you, you can always return them. There is only so much information to be gleaned in the abstract without trying them on.
@Brad@Argali inseam options on puffy pants and rain pants wound be great to offer a short option as you can’t really hem those due to the insulation and zippers down the legs. Also if you’re going to scale inseam by waist size please don’t mess it up like firstlite did years ago, I would have needed a 48 waist to get a 34 inseam.
WCT3
Lil-Rokslider
- Joined
- Apr 30, 2022
- Messages
- 215
I know there was some discussion about this earlier but I didn't see any answers. Have any of the testers here tried the Argali pants compared to the OV pants?
Brad I'm a 33" waist; the 34" fits pretty well, but a 33" would fit better—not sure if I could have squeezed into a 32 or not?
There is some bagginess at the waist area w/ the 34 for me (this is w/ the Vesper, hasn't been cool enough to try the Torex yet).
OP
OP
Good feedback. Pretty much every company I know of scales waist and length on things like rain pants and down pants if you're doing S, M, L, XL, etc. unless they also offer short and/or tall sizing.
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