Suppressor Problems

sniper20

FNG
Joined
Aug 8, 2024
Messages
80
Location
South Dakota
Hey guys, wondering if I might be able to get a little help here. I did a search and didn't find anyone with the problems I am having.

I currently have a 24" 6.5 Grendel in the AR-15 platform. I have run this rifle un-suppressed for years and haven't had issues with it. I decided to get a suppressor for my hunting and target shooting hobbies, and of course, this got it thrown on there too.

The suppressor is a Daniel Defense (KGM Tech) with a "flow through" design hybrid. I run this on my 5.56 AR's (with a thread adapter), 300BO (supers and subs) and my hunting rifles. I don't have an issue with any of them (the above mentioned have a standard gas block on them... I can tell it adds gas, but they don't malfunction and it's not much more gas).

However, the 6.5 Grendel started giving me fits. Again, it's a 24" barrel, Type 1 chamber and bolt, rifle length gas system, full auto bolt carrier, standard A2 buffer and buffer spring. It had a standard gas block, but I recently switched it out for an Aero Precision adjustable gas block. I use them on a few of my rifles and they work well. I adjusted the gas block so it would hold the bolt open on the last round, then added 3 more clicks (25 total adjustable clicks, this is right at 14 clicks with the added 3) for reliability, same as my other rifles.

The issue I'm having hasn't gone away... The brass will eject at the 4 o'clock position for 85% of the time. But every now and then, brass will shoot up to the 12-1 o'clock position (it's not an M1A... not sure why). But the jams I get are very strange. Some will just have the brass sitting on top of the next round, but half of the ones that don't eject will ejected in an upward movement... The grass head will stay on the bolt and the mouth will actually get caught on the charging handle. Those are a bear to clear and I have to get a tool to grab the BCG and pull it backwards. Obviously if I use the charging handle, it just pulls the brass backwards.

I checked the bolt to ensure the ejector and extractor were not the issue. These Type 1 chambers are supposedly known to have extractor problems. Both have proper spring pressure and grip the case as they should.

I'm at a loss as to what the issue would be. I had adjusted the gas block up and down, but the problem persists. I seem to get excessive soot build up in the magazine, more so than my other rifles.

The only thing I can think to look at now would be an extra weight buffer/buffer spring maybe? The ammunition are my reloads, which are not max/min charge and have worked perfect in the un-suppressed rifle. Any help would be appreciated.
 
Nobody has any input or a place to start? I have looked at the heavy buffer stuff, but can't say I really wanna spend over $100 on something that may or may not be the problem...
 
I don't have a lot of experience tinkering with ARs but my 6 ARC I put in a BCM MK2 buffer system and use the same Aero adjustable block without issues. Any chance your gas block needs cleaning?
 
So after you started suppressing it, it was running fine, then you added an adjustable gas block, dialed it, then you started having issues?
 
I don't have a lot of experience tinkering with ARs but my 6 ARC I put in a BCM MK2 buffer system and use the same Aero adjustable block without issues. Any chance your gas block needs cleaning?
No, brand new adjustable was just installed.

So after you started suppressing it, it was running fine, then you added an adjustable gas block, dialed it, then you started having issues?
It ran fine unsuppressed. Once a suppressor was added, issues came up. No matter what I adjust the gas block to, issue remains.
 
You stated that you added 3 extra clicks "for reliability" when adjusting the gas block. I assume you mean clicks open. If so, put those clicks back in. It sounds like you are overgassed when using the suppressor. When you see an ejection at 12 or 1, what you are actually seeing is the brass comes out so quick and hits the brass deflector such that it is sent "back from whence it came". This would also explain how the case mouth can get caught on the charging handle if it doesn't hit the brass deflector straight on.

Ultimately, if you are using an adjustable gas block, you need to adjust it with the suppressor on. Even though your suppressor is a flow-though, there is still a lot more gas backpressure when using it than when shooting unsuppressed.

You also didn't state if this is factory ammo or handloads. It may not matter, but if it is handloads and you are running close to max, you may want to back your powder charge down some to account for heat and bullet seating variables.
 
You stated that you added 3 extra clicks "for reliability" when adjusting the gas block. I assume you mean clicks open. If so, put those clicks back in. It sounds like you are overgassed when using the suppressor. When you see an ejection at 12 or 1, what you are actually seeing is the brass comes out so quick and hits the brass deflector such that it is sent "back from whence it came". This would also explain how the case mouth can get caught on the charging handle if it doesn't hit the brass deflector straight on.

Ultimately, if you are using an adjustable gas block, you need to adjust it with the suppressor on. Even though your suppressor is a flow-though, there is still a lot more gas backpressure when using it than when shooting unsuppressed.

You also didn't state if this is factory ammo or handloads. It may not matter, but if it is handloads and you are running close to max, you may want to back your powder charge down some to account for heat and bullet seating variables.

I would agree it appears to still be overgassed, but when I started, I had the gas block shut off completely, opened up a little bit and kept working until it would fire one round and hold open on the empty mag. After that, I opened it up 3 more clicks, so I might try to adjust it down again.

I have only shot it with the suppressor since getting the the suppressor, and I don't plan on shooting without it.

These are handloads, but not at max. I prefer accuracy and longevity for my rifles...haha.

Inspected the gas rings and barrel gas port?
I didn't specifically look at gas rings, but if they were aligned (improperly) it should allow all the gas to flow through and not cycle... Gas port was inspected and cleaned when I put the new gas block on.
 
I think before doing much of any surgery on it I'd open that gas block up all the way and shoot unsuppressed just to rule out issues there. Maybe it's faulty or misaligned? Just spitballing but it'd only cost a little bit of ammo to test that out and see if it runs as it should or not.
 
I would agree it appears to still be overgassed, but when I started, I had the gas block shut off completely, opened up a little bit and kept working until it would fire one round and hold open on the empty mag. After that, I opened it up 3 more clicks, so I might try to adjust it down again.

Put those three clicks back into it and you should be better.
 
Reopening this thread:
AR10 full rifle build kit from DPMS (it was assigned to me, not my choice) in 308. Mk5 Bravo(?)
Mid-length gas system.
Assembled as per instructions using 100% supplied parts. Using Federal Premium 168 grain SMK ammo out of the box.
Fires but won't cycle. BCG isn't even moving enough to open the dust cover upon firing. I get the same result with gas system all the way open, all the way closed, and at a dozen points in between.
Double checked everything that I can think to check and no dice. This rifle is brand new using only the supplied parts in the kit so I have to assume that the gas system parts, the buffer system springs and weights, etc. all match up for this rifle. HELP!
The ammo and magazines that I am using function just fine in the Sig 762 sitting in my safe so I don't suspect them as being the source of the problem. I am about ready to toss this rifle into my pond for my own mental health.
-Doc
 
Reopening this thread:
AR10 full rifle build kit from DPMS (it was assigned to me, not my choice) in 308. Mk5 Bravo(?)
Mid-length gas system.
Assembled as per instructions using 100% supplied parts. Using Federal Premium 168 grain SMK ammo out of the box.
Fires but won't cycle. BCG isn't even moving enough to open the dust cover upon firing. I get the same result with gas system all the way open, all the way closed, and at a dozen points in between.
Double checked everything that I can think to check and no dice. This rifle is brand new using only the supplied parts in the kit so I have to assume that the gas system parts, the buffer system springs and weights, etc. all match up for this rifle. HELP!
The ammo and magazines that I am using function just fine in the Sig 762 sitting in my safe so I don't suspect them as being the source of the problem. I am about ready to toss this rifle into my pond for my own mental health.
-Doc

Is your gas block lined up correctly to the gas port?
 
As far as I can tell, yes it is.


You want to check it. Take the upper off, put an empty case in the chamber and hold it there, put a finger over the gas tube, and blow into the muzzle. You should be able to blow and feel air coming out of the gas tube, and when you close off the gas tube with your finger you should not be able to blow any air at all down the barrel.
 
Ok, removed handguard and gas tube/block.
Used brass in chamber - blow into muzzle and as expected I can feel air movement via gas block/muzzle hole.
Gas block reinstalled after indexing.
gas screw fully open - no air flow.
gas screw fully the other direction - no air flow.
individually I can blow through the gas tube and gas block without issue, but once assembled it is greatly reduced (like 90% reduction of air flow).
What is next on the troubleshooting checklist?
Thanks for taking the time to help me out during my moment of frustration.
-Doc
 
Hey guys, wondering if I might be able to get a little help here. I did a search and didn't find anyone with the problems I am having.

I currently have a 24" 6.5 Grendel in the AR-15 platform. I have run this rifle un-suppressed for years and haven't had issues with it. I decided to get a suppressor for my hunting and target shooting hobbies, and of course, this got it thrown on there too.

The suppressor is a Daniel Defense (KGM Tech) with a "flow through" design hybrid. I run this on my 5.56 AR's (with a thread adapter), 300BO (supers and subs) and my hunting rifles. I don't have an issue with any of them (the above mentioned have a standard gas block on them... I can tell it adds gas, but they don't malfunction and it's not much more gas).

However, the 6.5 Grendel started giving me fits. Again, it's a 24" barrel, Type 1 chamber and bolt, rifle length gas system, full auto bolt carrier, standard A2 buffer and buffer spring. It had a standard gas block, but I recently switched it out for an Aero Precision adjustable gas block. I use them on a few of my rifles and they work well. I adjusted the gas block so it would hold the bolt open on the last round, then added 3 more clicks (25 total adjustable clicks, this is right at 14 clicks with the added 3) for reliability, same as my other rifles.

The issue I'm having hasn't gone away... The brass will eject at the 4 o'clock position for 85% of the time. But every now and then, brass will shoot up to the 12-1 o'clock position (it's not an M1A... not sure why). But the jams I get are very strange. Some will just have the brass sitting on top of the next round, but half of the ones that don't eject will ejected in an upward movement... The grass head will stay on the bolt and the mouth will actually get caught on the charging handle. Those are a bear to clear and I have to get a tool to grab the BCG and pull it backwards. Obviously if I use the charging handle, it just pulls the brass backwards.

I checked the bolt to ensure the ejector and extractor were not the issue. These Type 1 chambers are supposedly known to have extractor problems. Both have proper spring pressure and grip the case as they should.

I'm at a loss as to what the issue would be. I had adjusted the gas block up and down, but the problem persists. I seem to get excessive soot build up in the magazine, more so than my other rifles.

The only thing I can think to look at now would be an extra weight buffer/buffer spring maybe? The ammunition are my reloads, which are not max/min charge and have worked perfect in the un-suppressed rifle. Any help would be appreciated.

I was having similar issues with my 6.5 Grendel and 22arc. I switched to kak 20position adj gas block, h2 buffer, and Tubb flat wire spring and it fixed my issues. How many oz is your a2 buffer?
 
It's got the index divot 180 degrees below the gas port to align the gas port, so I THINK that it is in the right spot. I also measured and found/marked TDC.
@ACHILLES - I haven't weight it yet as the entire thing came as a kit, so I have no reason to think that the parts are mismatched or wrong for the build.
On the other hand, if anyone ever met my first wife I have zero evidence to say that I am not a first-class moron so...
 
Back
Top