Spotting your shot, most import factors.

Agree, infinite adjustments of a chassis are unnecessary for one person.

I am 6’2” and long arms, so I am nearly to ape status. Getting into normal peoples rifles requires contorting too much. My neck is also a bit stiff.

I couldn’t get quite comfortable behind @mxgsfmdpx Rokstock but could shoot @NSI Peak 44 Bastion. They are smaller, but I won’t comment on their relative sizes, lol.😂

And, I carry one of my Mini Ultralight bags to stuff behind the butt to add an inch so I get better eye relief when shooting their stuff, being more ostrich like than them.
You’re maybe an inch taller at best and I’m fatter than you think 😂

I’m 6’1” or maybe a bit taller and currently a festive 215 or so I’d guess.

January lifting is going to suck haha.

You shot the rokstok with no spacers. All mine now have 3 spacers and the scope moved back a touch. Try it again next time we shoot 👍🏻
 
Ive researched the other threads on this, and cannot quite find a satisfying answer. I'm mostly an archery guy so my apologies if I overlooked something.

I understand spotting your shots in field conditions can be difficult but I believe setting up a rifle that can spot shots has multiple ancillary benefits I.E. remaining on target for follow up shots, keeping eyes on primary target so you dont accidentally shoot the wrong animal on a follow up, potentially seeing the wound placement, and it assumes excellent recoil management so its likely more forgiving to shoot in general, etc.

I want to set up some initial parameters/factors so that the information isnt as subjective.

This is for a hunting rig (assume around 9lbs or less) and we're not always going to be able to shoot with a loaded bipod, prone. Some shots will be off the backpack, tripod, or trekking poles, etc.

Factors:

- Form/Fundamentals (if so, please clarify or provide content on what specific form changes helped you)

-Caliber (whats the maximum caliber you find to be able to spot shots with a 9# suppressed rifle, all other things being dialed in)

- Supression/Braked Supressors ( what is your recommendation on a suppressor for recoil reduction)

- Stock Design (this one really interests me the most) there are very few designs out there with a negative comb and near flat toe line/fore end.

- Something i missed.

Overall, if you were building a hunting rig, in what order would you rank these or what is your current setup that allows you to spot your shots!?

Im going back and fourth on if I should buy a Tikka/Rokstock combo or get a Seekins PH3 so I can shoot like a .223 for practice and switch over to my hunting round with a fairly cheap extra barrel/bolt face.

My primary hunting rifles recently have been a Tikka 6.5 CM and a FN Mauser .25-06. My practice rifle is a Tikka .223. I’ve also done a lot of shooting with a CZ 527 in 6.5mm Grendel.

The Tikka 6.5 has a 20” barrel, AB Raptor 8 w/ 3” reflex (13.3 oz), wooden RokStok, and SWFA 6x. It weighs about 9.8#. I currently use Hornady 140-grain ELDM factory ammo. I have low rings on it. I plan on putting my OG 6.5 on it this offseason and sighting it in for that. That should get it down closer to 9.4#.
4b3030c897f8d2ba4da5a5dc2818dee1.jpg


The .25-06 has a 24” heavy barrel, OG 6.5 (7.5 oz.), very short traditional rifle stock (the previous owner was 5’6” 140#, I am 5’10” 180#), and SWFA 10x. It weighs about 10.8#. I use Federal Premium 117-grain factory ammo. It has medium rings on it. I use it because I love it. Although the stock is technically too short for me, I prefer it to traditional stocks that “should” fit me better.
88a56f9dbbad01e47eaf72490612d3b4.jpg


The .223 is awaiting a Rokstok. It has a 16” barrel, factory wooden stock, SWFA 6x, and AB Raptor 10 w/ 5” reflex (16.3 oz). It’s a bit heavy (around 9# iirc). Low rings.
71c09f770c2e599df088e95deea07916.jpg


I don’t have all the particulars memorized on the CZ 527. But it is light and short with a Trijicon 3-9x AccuPoint, 18” barrel, and a Scythe Ti on it. High rings.
bd0e2313c91912b73a5c0e32217a67e0.jpg


With the Tikka 6.5, I can spot impacts at close range (100 yards or less) from any position, including offhand. I haven’t tried it offhand at more than 100-yards (I am not good enough for that on 8” targets, yet). I haven’t had any issues spotting impacts from seated or prone (with or without support) as far out as I have shot it (450 yards). In a hunting situation, about 60% of my shots come from a hasty seated position.

With the .25-06, I can’t spot impacts at close range offhand. The muzzle jumps too much for that. I can usually spot them seated or prone, with or without support, out to 450. I’ve also spotted impacts at 200 yards standing, using the truck door for support. But it’s not nearly as consistent as the Tikka.

The .223 is easy to shoot, but I am really looking forward to having the wooden RokStok for it. I also plan to get a shorter, lighter suppressor for it.

The CZ is great to carry, but my least favorite rifle to shoot. It has a lot of muzzle jump. It’s very accurate, but if I had any chance of getting what I put into it back, I would sell it in a heartbeat.

Recoil: I rate this the second most important factor. Grok tells me that the 9.8# 6.5 has 31.6 ft-lbf of free recoil energy, while the 10.8# .25-06 has 40.3 ft-lbf (using their respective ammo). That is undoubtedly a factor in the experience, but I don’t have an apples to apples comparison. On this point, I like the 6.5 CM, but in hindsight I made the wrong cartridge choice. I got a deal on the 6.5, but I should have held out for the .243 I really wanted. That would be 26.9 ft-lbf. I have recently corrected that error and given myself a new Tikka .243 for Christmas.

Stock design: I think the stock design is the most important factor in all this. The RokStok drives straight back into my shoulder. The .25-06 is more muzzle heavy than the Tikka, but it still jumps more. The .223 doesn’t jump, but it’s not as steady.

Scope power: The 10x is the largest scope I have on a hunting rifle. I don’t think switching to a 6x would make any difference for the .25-06. When shooting offhand, most of the time the muzzle jumps so high that no scope would stay on target. The CZ jumps a lot too, even on 3x I don’t always stay on target. Under 10x, I think scope power is the third most important factor.

Fit: not very important for me.

Ring height: not very important to me, but I could be wrong. I typically get the lowest rings I can get and still work the bolt and safety with ease. But it’s possible that an expert might watch me shoot and tell me to use higher rings.

Finally, practice is critical. I’d estimate that I fired 250 center fire cartridges for each shot I took at an animal this year, with 90% of those in field positions.
 
My primary hunting rifles recently have been a Tikka 6.5 CM and a FN Mauser .25-06. My practice rifle is a Tikka .223. I’ve also done a lot of shooting with a CZ 527 in 6.5mm Grendel.

The Tikka 6.5 has a 20” barrel, AB Raptor 8 w/ 3” reflex (13.3 oz), wooden RokStok, and SWFA 6x. It weighs about 9.8#. I currently use Hornady 140-grain ELDM factory ammo. I have low rings on it. I plan on putting my OG 6.5 on it this offseason and sighting it in for that. That should get it down closer to 9.4#.
4b3030c897f8d2ba4da5a5dc2818dee1.jpg


The .25-06 has a 24” heavy barrel, OG 6.5 (7.5 oz.), very short traditional rifle stock (the previous owner was 5’6” 140#, I am 5’10” 180#), and SWFA 10x. It weighs about 10.8#. I use Federal Premium 117-grain factory ammo. It has medium rings on it. I use it because I love it. Although the stock is technically too short for me, I prefer it to traditional stocks that “should” fit me better.
88a56f9dbbad01e47eaf72490612d3b4.jpg


The .223 is awaiting a Rokstok. It has a 16” barrel, factory wooden stock, SWFA 6x, and AB Raptor 10 w/ 5” reflex (16.3 oz). It’s a bit heavy (around 9# iirc). Low rings.
71c09f770c2e599df088e95deea07916.jpg


I don’t have all the particulars memorized on the CZ 527. But it is light and short with a Trijicon 3-9x AccuPoint, 18” barrel, and a Scythe Ti on it. High rings.
bd0e2313c91912b73a5c0e32217a67e0.jpg


With the Tikka 6.5, I can spot impacts at close range (100 yards or less) from any position, including offhand. I haven’t tried it offhand at more than 100-yards (I am not good enough for that on 8” targets, yet). I haven’t had any issues spotting impacts from seated or prone (with or without support) as far out as I have shot it (450 yards). In a hunting situation, about 60% of my shots come from a hasty seated position.

With the .25-06, I can’t spot impacts at close range offhand. The muzzle jumps too much for that. I can usually spot them seated or prone, with or without support, out to 450. I’ve also spotted impacts at 200 yards standing, using the truck door for support. But it’s not nearly as consistent as the Tikka.

The .223 is easy to shoot, but I am really looking forward to having the wooden RokStok for it. I also plan to get a shorter, lighter suppressor for it.

The CZ is great to carry, but my least favorite rifle to shoot. It has a lot of muzzle jump. It’s very accurate, but if I had any chance of getting what I put into it back, I would sell it in a heartbeat.

Recoil: I rate this the second most important factor. Grok tells me that the 9.8# 6.5 has 31.6 ft-lbf of free recoil energy, while the 10.8# .25-06 has 40.3 ft-lbf (using their respective ammo). That is undoubtedly a factor in the experience, but I don’t have an apples to apples comparison. On this point, I like the 6.5 CM, but in hindsight I made the wrong cartridge choice. I got a deal on the 6.5, but I should have held out for the .243 I really wanted. That would be 26.9 ft-lbf. I have recently corrected that error and given myself a new Tikka .243 for Christmas.

Stock design: I think the stock design is the most important factor in all this. The RokStok drives straight back into my shoulder. The .25-06 is more muzzle heavy than the Tikka, but it still jumps more. The .223 doesn’t jump, but it’s not as steady.

Scope power: The 10x is the largest scope I have on a hunting rifle. I don’t think switching to a 6x would make any difference for the .25-06. When shooting offhand, most of the time the muzzle jumps so high that no scope would stay on target. The CZ jumps a lot too, even on 3x I don’t always stay on target. Under 10x, I think scope power is the third most important factor.

Fit: not very important for me.

Ring height: not very important to me, but I could be wrong. I typically get the lowest rings I can get and still work the bolt and safety with ease. But it’s possible that an expert might watch me shoot and tell me to use higher rings.

Finally, practice is critical. I’d estimate that I fired 250 center fire cartridges for each shot I took at an animal this year, with 90% of those in field positions.

Those recoil numbers sound wildly off. The 6.5 should be +\- 15 the 243 closer to 10, the 223 close to 5.

Im not sure on the 25-08 but best guess is high teens.
 
You’re maybe an inch taller at best and I’m fatter than you think 😂

I’m 6’1” or maybe a bit taller and currently a festive 215 or so I’d guess.

January lifting is going to suck haha.

You shot the rokstok with no spacers. All mine now have 3 spacers and the scope moved back a touch. Try it again next time we shoot 👍🏻
😂 I am a burrito grande sized 255 trying to fit.

I wasn’t going to comment on @NSI length or girth… he is a bit smaller.

I bet that will make a difference on the Rokstock. I was way too cramped up and the Neanderthal genes present in my cheek bones smashed the stock.

These small adjustments to the stock are nice, but higher scope rings and moving the scope forward would have allowed me to shoot it much better.

I don’t make the solution out to be hard or difficult, moving the scope higher and into eye box fixes most “stock” problems.
 
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