Shoulder Dislocation/Subluxation

[cured_ham]

I have always been a knee problem guy and do not know much of anything about shoulders.

Popped my shoulder last night during jiu jitsu. Kind of instance where you're braced with the arm and your body moves forward but arm doesnt. Similar to if you fell forward, caught yourself, and popped shoulder. Hurt immediately after and is still going this morning. No bruising or visible deformities.

External rotation hurts. Bringing arms overhead hurts. Cannot hold things up at 90 degrees. Hurts doing nothing. Normally can do overhead work with 50lb kettlebell, my 10lb weight is barely able to be held up there.

Anyone done something like this and can give me a ballpark idea of whats going on? Gonna give it the weekend and see a doc if its still an issue but am cautiously pessimistic due to past issues with recurrent dislocations.

Thanks

 

[LostArra]

At best it's a strain, at worst you tore up stuff (rotator cuff).
Stop testing it and just rest it.
Internet opinions, including mine aren't worth a penny.
From my years of bad shoulder issues there is only one fact: "The MRI don't lie"

 

[Brendan]

I've had massive problems with my right shoulder over the years and two failed surgeries due to those issues.

Best I can tell you - rest it. Do not keep testing it. Don't pull a bow or any of that. After a couple weeks start working up very, very slowly only if there's no pain. If there's any pain, back to resting it until there isn't. Don't even use it much if you can help it, if you are tweaking it or feeling it at all in daily use - put your arm in a sling.

The reason being - rest and not screwing with it allows things to recover and tighten up, if you didn't tear something. Keep using it, tweak it again, and you start to get an irreversible "loosening" of the joint without surgery.

If it doesn't start getting better - see a doc and probably looking at an MRI. But, in some scenarios rest and letting it heal could still be better than surgery.

Over time, mine (Right / draw shoulder) has tightened and scarred up to the point I can draw a bow fine, and do everything I'd normally do on a day to day basis. I can never throw a baseball / football again - worst motion possible for me.

 

[cured_ham]

Thanks for both of your responses.

I guess I went and proved that I am both young and dumb. I went ahead and shot 3D last night. I tested with a #30 recurve and it felt fine. Flung a few with my compound and it did not go bad on me. No pain just a little sore this morning. Joint is definitely less stable than it was. I will likely give it the week to see what happens to it. Check again and maybe give it another. After using it the pain went away from raising overhead and rotating externally. Gives me a little extra hope that it is just a strain.

There is visible swelling and it is warm to the touch. Injured side trap is bigger (likely swelling) than the good side.

At what point is an MRI recommended? I would normally be as aggressive as possible but there is no way to fix it at this point (surgically) without busting my fall trips. Surgery and rehab are no joke and I have done it more times than I would like on my knees. Thank you!

 

[Brendan]

If there's no "sharp" pain and just soreness, and full range of motion comes back quickly, i'd count that as a good thing. It could have been a minor subluxation where it popped out, went back in, strained and loosened everything up without tearing. I think of them like sprained ankles in that way, once you start turning / spraining them it gets progressively worse loosening them up.

But the more you can rest it, the better. You don't want it feeling tired / sore, or to tweak it at all while it's healing. Wait for the soreness and swelling to go down, make sure you have full range of motion, then work back slowly and you'll probably be fine. Every time you re-tweak it or aggravate it though, you're making things worse and delaying the healing time.

MRI - it obviously isn't going to hurt, knowing is always a good thing, but you could just be wasting the time and $$$. I personally would give it a couple weeks and if soreness subsides, everything back to normal, just be careful with it. Any sharp pain with certain motions, looseness, or things don't start improving rapidly, I'd probably want one for peace of mind.

Once everything gets better - I would consider adding in shoulder external rotation / rehab exercises into your workout routine in the future if you don't already, and go easy on football/baseball throwing motion. Preventative medicine is always better... Might even be worth a session with a PT to learn the exercises.

 

[Cdroot89]

Disclaimer, I am not giving you medical advice, only information. Therefore legally you are not becoming my patient and I have no medical legal obligation associated with this post.


From your most recent post, things sound hopeful but from your original description it sounds like there is a possibility that you had a posterior dislocation. If you continue to have instability and pain this could be an indication of a labral tear or maybe just capsular stretching from micro trauma. If it was me I would let it rest for a few days and see how things feel. At minimum I would stay away from lifting any sort of weight over a few pounds. If you had a posterior dislocation that needed to be reduced, there is a good chance they would immobilized your arm in a sling for 6 weeks. There are some specialized physical exam tests that a medical professional can perform on you if things persist to help decide if you need an MRI. I use a resource that is intended for orthopedic surgeons in training called ortho bullets for most of my references. It is made for ortho residents so it might be a little to much info for most people. Brendan’s advice of shoulder PT to strengthen and prevent further injury is probably a good idea. Here is a link with some exercise:

Rotator Cuff and Shoulder Conditioning Program - OrthoInfo - AAOS

After a shoulder injury or surgery, following a well-structured conditioning program will help you return to daily activities and enjoy a more active lifestyle.

orthoinfo.aaos.org

 

[LostArra]

At what point is an MRI recommended?

As mentioned above I would put it in the category of "last resort" when rest has not improved things and you see an orthopedic doctor. I think your biggest recovery hurdle right now is actually allowing it to rest. Feel fortunate there are no hunting seasons now. Don't let an acute injury become a chronic long-term problem.

 

[cured_ham]

Thanks for the additional responses everyone. It is much appreciated.

I will give it a week off without any workouts or shooting and then start to reintroduce stabilization work. Fortunately for me my younger sister just had a torn labrum repaired so I will steal her PT exercise papers. I have some 5lb clubs I use for some tendinitis that I had in the shoulder awhile back I can break back out. If it gives me issues i will schedule a session or two with a pro. MRI as a last resort works for me. I’ve had enough of those to last me awhile.

I will check out that link. Hopefully it’s not too far over my head.

thanks!

 

[cured_ham]

The appointment I had planned to schedule 3 weeks out happened today. Ended up being able to slip in.

Initial diagnosis is a SLAP Tear. Likely will require surgery. Having an MRI to confirm. Anyone have any experience with this procedure?

 

[Mable300]

That usually occurs when there is tearing of the rotator cuff as well, doesn’t happen all the time but the two go hand in hand. Had a full rotator cuff thickness tear with a labrum slap tear deep fried with a bone spur. 12/26/19 so about 15 months ago. Still not 100% but getting there. Shoulder stuff sucks for sure. Good luck my dude..


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[Stubborn_bowhunter]

Looking back on my original right shoulder issues...

I wish I had waited a month at least before I started doing much of anything with it after the first sign. Had a labrum tear that I just kept making worse. I refused to give up activities for a while.
That eventually turned into constant dislocations. Even when I was sleeping.

Give yourself time. Especially if you cant reach above your head without pain. Doctor told me if I waited in the initial tear then I probably would've been fine. But I pushed it too far.


I had surgery on it. It was all scoped, so no big incision. Two small ones. One for a camera, and one for tools.
Outpatient procedure that only took a morning.
The pain was pretty bad for me, but tolerable. Follow their instructions and it'll go smooth. If everything goes well you could be shooting light bows by September. Depends on how fast you heal and PT progress. Listen to the doctor for sure. Too much too soon can erase the surgery.


If it's a small tear you might be able to rely on PT without surgery. I know guys who do action sports and have bad shoulders that they never got repaired. They're real good at popping it back into the socket.

Don't do anything that could hurt it more until after your MRI. Then go from there. You don't want to get into rotator cuff and bicep tear territory.



Edit: if you've had knee surgeries then this one will most likely be a walk in the park. Assuming no rotator cuff repairs. Just as @Mable300 said that's when stuff gets interesting.

 

[cured_ham]

I am really hoping to avoid rotator cuff injuries, however I have pain right wear that runs so I am not too optimistic. They are already concerned that the bicep attachment has been partially torn so I am babying it. I am pretty much decided to be a spectator until I get the MRI read (going Tuesday morning) to avoid further injury.

I always joked that knee surgeries were the worst because you never had to walk with your shoulder, hoping I did not build up some bad karma

 

[grizz_bait]

take it seriously! what you do now could determine the future of your athletic career, no joke. if you have to burn a hunting season, no big deal in a lifetime of healthy hunting.

 

[drmatara]

Get the MRI read and take proper care of your shoulder, fortunately there are no hunting seasons now. The earlier you figure out what is going on with the shoulder the better.

 

[cured_ham]

Definitely taking this one slow. I disconnected my patellar tendon by deadlifting too soon after a tibial transfer. Not a good time.

Planning on putting 40lb limbs backed down with cables untwisted on my Black 5 for rehab shooting. Going to stick with that until PT says otherwise. Not willing to risk anything if I can help it.

 

[grizz_bait]

Definitely taking this one slow. I disconnected my patellar tendon by deadlifting too soon after a tibial transfer. Not a good time.

Planning on putting 40lb limbs backed down with cables untwisted on my Black 5 for rehab shooting. Going to stick with that until PT says otherwise. Not willing to risk anything if I can help it.

I wouldn’t even shoot your bow right now. Shoulder dislocations are a completely different ball of wax compared to knee dislocations. I have a torn labrum from going ham with a 55# recurve and I tried to fight through it at first. I was able to draw the bow back with only a little bit of discomfort so I thought it was no big deal. That was 6 months ago. I wish I had immediately stopped everything because now I’m looking at surgery and probably a year until I can even think about pulling back a bow or shooting a heavy recoiling rifle. Any time cartilage or tendons are damaged, it’s time to go full stop, cuz they just don’t heal likes bones do.

 

[Mable300]

I have strained my shoulder muscles so many times from Oly lifting to bodybuilding to doing just stupid shit. Usually a strain will start to subside in a couple weeks anyway with me that’s usually the case..I gave myself a good month when my shoulder was fubar just to make sure. When I knew there was a prob I seen somebody, sounds like you’ve done the same or similar. Like most the dudes on here keep saying,
Take it slow, you’ll thank yourself in the long term.


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[Grit2]

I am really hoping to avoid rotator cuff injuries, however I have pain right wear that runs so I am not too optimistic. They are already concerned that the bicep attachment has been partially torn so I am babying it. I am pretty much decided to be a spectator until I get the MRI read (going Tuesday morning) to avoid further injury.

I always joked that knee surgeries were the worst because you never had to walk with your shoulder, hoping I did not build up some bad karma

Did you schedule the follow up? I was able to get the results and schedule the surgery the same day as the MRI this time around

 

[cured_ham]

I am not shooting anything right now. That bow is for post op or post PT shooting (whenever released). I have stopped everything I was doing. The shoulder is being totally babied.

Follow up is Tuesday. My MRI was on a Friday and the doc was out of the office that afternoon and in surgery Monday. Expecting to schedule surgery Tuesday morning, but it is possible I will only be scheduling PT. Either way a clear path forward.

 

[Grit2]

Man the suspense is rough