Schooling for floorless FNG

[Browtinemt]

I'm trying to get set up for backpack bow hunting elk in sept-oct in MT, in the timber, possibly with my buddy. So I was going to buy a Hilleberg for my first forays into the hills because it was pretty idiot proof and would exceed anything I could put it through, but then life gave me a booty call and it apparently still wants to f^@% me. So now I'm looking at going with a Go-Lite Shangrila 5 without the nest, down quilt from enlightened equipment, a cheaper cc foam pad and a ti goat bivy (kestral?)...which combined is still cheaper than the Hilleberg. I've read over a bunch of older posts on floorless camping and several have stated rain/moisture/condensation is a non-factor when the SL5 is pitched right. Please excuse my ignorance as I've only camped in tents before, but am I understanding this right that you elevate the bottom for venting when humid, but lower it for rain? Isn't it humid while it's raining? Please help me understand the correct pitches for all the occasions you endure while on the mountain. Maybe this would be a good topic for one of Aron's pod casts? Also, any recommended changes/additions to my proposed setup would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for any feedback, you folks are the best.

 

[Beastmode]

I'm trying to get set up for backpack bow hunting elk in sept-oct in MT, in the timber, possibly with my buddy. So I was going to buy a Hilleberg for my first forays into the hills because it was pretty idiot proof and would exceed anything I could put it through, but then life gave me a booty call and it apparently still wants to f^@% me. So now I'm looking at going with a Go-Lite Shangrila 5 without the nest, down quilt from enlightened equipment, a cheaper cc foam pad and a ti goat bivy (kestral?)...which combined is still cheaper than the Hilleberg. I've read over a bunch of older posts on floorless camping and several have stated rain/moisture/condensation is a non-factor when the SL5 is pitched right. Please excuse my ignorance as I've only camped in tents before, but am I understanding this right that you elevate the bottom for venting when humid, but lower it for rain? Isn't it humid while it's raining? Please help me understand the correct pitches for all the occasions you endure while on the mountain. Maybe this would be a good topic for one of Aron's pod casts? Also, any recommended changes/additions to my proposed setup would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for any feedback, you folks are the best.

As long as water isn't drainging right through your campsite you will be fine. I would leave about an inch between the ground and sl5 all the way around to help circulate air. The sl5 has a vent at the top too which is better that nothing. You will have condensation without a stove but it shouldn't be anything to bad.

 

[Becca]

As long as water isn't drainging right through your campsite you will be fine. I would leave about an inch between the ground and sl5 all the way around to help circulate air. The sl5 has a vent at the top too which is better that nothing. You will have condensation without a stove but it shouldn't be anything to bad.

This advice is correct, except I will say in my experience that we usually end up with more like 3-5"...sometimes a bit less and sometimes a bit more. I can't speak for others, but in my 100+ nights in our SL5 I can't think of a single time we have had to adjust the gap up or down, regardless of conditions. We just set it up with a bit of a gap, and haven't had any trouble. You want to allow some ventilation, but not so much that you end up with gusts coming under the shelter if it's windy. We sometimes put packs in front of the leeward side if we notice a breeze. Condensation will form on the inside, particularly when it's rainy, but it isn't usually enough to make it "rain" inside the shelter...you will get transfer if you brush up against it though. Plan to seam seal it, regardless of what they say, we noticed a few drips in ours during a downpour at places where seams came together, but haven't had any trouble since we seam sealed it.

Only other advice I would give would be to see if you can go with some kind of inflatable pad. Closed cell foam will get the job done, but it isn't anywhere near as comfortable as an inflatable, nor does it provide the same amount of insulation to keep you warm while you sleep. Doesn't have to be the most expensive pad on the market, between Big Agnes, neo air, and thermarest you should be able to find something on sale somewhere (or perhaps used if you watch the forum classifieds).

 

[castandblast]

Only a lot of wind will force you to pitch tight to the ground. Even then you can gap the downwind side a bit to keep some air movement. You can pitch it high in calm rain or snow.

You'll want to rely on your sleep system for warmth, not your shelter.

 

[Becca]

I would say that these photos pretty accurately show the gap we typically leave:

 

[Browtinemt]

Thanks all! Becca (or anyone else), what do you seam seal with? I'm hoping to pick up a few side jobs so I can get a better pad and still pay some med bills, but I've either always slept straight on the ground or bag on the tent floor, so I thought that was an easier place to save money and still be able to get out there. Rookie mistake? Also, I noticed from the photos you so kindly posted that in the first photo your sl5 has about a dozen guy-out lines, the second has none, and the third has four or so...what's the method of madness for guy-out lines?

 

[Becca]

Thanks all! Becca (or anyone else), what do you seam seal with? I'm hoping to pick up a few side jobs so I can get a better pad and still pay some med bills, but I've either always slept straight on the ground or bag on the tent floor, so I thought that was an easier place to save money and still be able to get out there. Rookie mistake? Also, I noticed from the photos you so kindly posted that in the first photo your sl5 has about a dozen guy-out lines, the second has none, and the third has four or so...what's the method of madness for guy-out lines?

I didn't post those photos in any particular order and I realize now that the middle photo is from the first season we used the sl5 (we have gradually added line so we have more guy outs, I also think it was originally a different color), but we currently have guy outs on every available place like in the top photo. In low wind conditions, or with lots of brush around sometimes we don't utilize them all, but it's nice to have the option. Doing the midpoint guy outs really increases the useable space inside the tent too by pulling the walls out.

As far as seam sealing goes, we use commercial silicon and dilute it just a little with mineral spirits and then brush it on. If you have time to kill, and don't mind listening to yours truly, we did a video awhile back that shows our process...

I am not techy enough to imbed it, but the link is here: http://vimeo.com/41216093

 

[Becca]

I had forgotten, but Luke put together a video review of the SL5 and how we have it set up for our uses. You can see the amount of gap, and he also talks about guy outs and stakes...

http://vimeo.com/45182137

 

[Ray]

For seam sealing you can make your own as Becca shows, use Silnet product by Gear-Aid/Mcnett, or use permatex flowable window sealant. All three are the same thing a thinned flowable silicon. You should be able to find the Permatex flowable window sealant at many automotive or hardware stores.

 

[mrbillbrown]

Tagged for later. Thanks for your insight