Sanity Check - Reloading Process

[SDHNTR]

What chronograph are you using? My ES readings magically tightened up across all my rifles once I got a Garmin Xero.

 

[Mulyhuntr]

Correct. The book says 40.5 is max. I’ve shot close to what your saying in Hornady brass and didn’t see pressure signs but had a feeling it was over pressure so didn’t keep shooting it even though it shot well

I load them at COAL of 2.910


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Hodgdon max is 41.8

 

[TimberHunter]

What chronograph are you using? My ES readings tightened up across all my rifles once I got a Garmin Xero.

Labrador, really hoping it’s accurate lol


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[Shortschaf]

Long winded….


About at my wits end and hopefully someone can see my issue. No mater what I’ve changed over the last 3 months and 350 shots I can’t improve my ES of approx 45 fps

Originally I was just using Hornady brass, FL sizing with Lee die, no anneal, H4350 from autotrickler, 147/143/berger140. ES 40-50

Then went to Peterson and Lapua brass (not mixing headstamp) On virgin brass I was seeing 40-50 FPS in two different 6.5cm rifles. On twice fired, I’m using Redding body die to set shoulder back, Lee collet to set approx .001 neck tension and induction DIY annealer. Same 40 ish fps ES.

Then tried same above process but with one size smaller collet that gave me approx .0035” neck tension. Also used imperial dry neck lube on the ID. Bullets seated consistently with what felt like same force and still ES of approx 40 over only 10 shots.


So… I’ve tried these and they didn’t make a difference:

- Different brass
- Different bullets
- changed to fed 210M
- changed neck tension and even used dry lube
- changed die setup

One of the common themes is I’m using H4350. But that is suppose to be the best stuff for 6.5cm and I’ve tried it in two completely different rifles with similar ES/SD so I’m doubtful that’s my issue.

Anyone see any red flags?


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Ive got a 6.5 creed barrel that I cant tame the ES with all premium components. Several bullets, couple primers, lapua, h4350 or varget, mandrels, neck lube, etc.
Nothing helps.

10% of shots are a +50fps outlier.

My other barrels have ES's of 30 or less. Ive given up and decided its just the barrel

 

[Pharmseller]

You’re missing a crucial step when you seat the bullet, clearly.

You’re holding your mouth wrong.

Try the Sylvester Stallone look from the end of Rambo.

60% of the time, it works every time.





P

 

[Harvey_NW]

Good info, thanks

My ES data is usually from 5-10 shots which may explain my slightly higher ES numbers. I’ll go see what power I can find locally. Last time I checked before buying 6lbs of H4350 I found some stabil 6.5 which I’ve head good things about as well

I recommend testing 6.5 Staball, the Hornady guys seem to be a fan of it on the podcasts so they may have produced some lots of ammo using that. If you have some of the ammo that shoots with the good ES pull a bullet and see if the powder is ball or extruded and try to match it up.

 

[TimberHunter]

Additional data. Not a lot of shots so need to confirm this evening with more shots. This does match my findings with H4350 that annealed results in a larger ES but H4350 had a higher ES compared to 6.5 staball as of now

Peterson brass, 4th firing, non annealed since fire forming, FL sized, 6.5 staball

1- 2670
2-2669
3- 2657
4- 2645
5-2664
6-2657
7-2655

ES- 25 SD-8.8

Peterson brass, 2nd firing, freshly annealed, FL sized staball 6.5

1- 2630
2-2643
3-2643
4-2650
5-2664

ES- 34 SD 12.5

Peterson brass 3rd firing not freshly annealed, neck size only no shoulder bump, staball 6.5

1-2661
2-2645
3-2632
4-2628
5-2644

ES-34 SD 13.3

16 of the 17 fell within a 1” group at 100 yards. With the “flier” group was 1.5 so like just about anything the gun groups well with this powder

I’m going to load up 10 non annealed and 10 annealed. Shoot annealed first then Non annealed (opposite of what I did in this test) to hopefully come to a conclusion if it’s my style of annealing that hurting me or powder


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[SDHNTR]

Additional data. Not a lot of shots so need to confirm this evening with more shots. This does match my findings with H4350 that annealed results in a larger ES but H4350 had a higher ES compared to 6.5 staball as of now

Peterson brass, 4th firing, non annealed since fire forming, FL sized, 6.5 staball

1- 2670
2-2669
3- 2657
4- 2645
5-2664
6-2657
7-2655

ES- 25 SD-8.8

Peterson brass, 2nd firing, freshly annealed, FL sized staball 6.5

1- 2630
2-2643
3-2643
4-2650
5-2664

ES- 34 SD 12.5

Peterson brass 3rd firing not freshly annealed, neck size only no shoulder bump, staball 6.5

1-2661
2-2645
3-2632
4-2628
5-2644

ES-34 SD 13.3

16 of the 17 fell within a 1” group at 100 yards. With the “flier” group was 1.5 so like just about anything the gun groups well with this powder

I’m going to load up 10 non annealed and 10 annealed. Shoot annealed first then Non annealed (opposite of what I did in this test) to hopefully come to a conclusion if it’s my style of annealing that hurting me or powder


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Buddy, you are chasing a unicorn. Those numbers are good enough for anything. You are only wasting time and components. Go hunting!

 

[TimberHunter]

Buddy, you are chasing a unicorn. Those numbers are good enough for anything. You are only wasting time and components. Go hunting!

The sad part is I don’t disagree with you! I’m very deep into mental mastrabation as Form would say lol

If I didn’t know that factory precision hunter was more consistent (ES around 20) I’d say my reloads are as good as they get


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[SDHNTR]

The sad part is I don’t disagree with you! I’m very deep into mental mastrabation as Form would say lol

If I didn’t know that factory precision hunter was more consistent (ES around 20) I’d say my reloads are as good as they get


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I get it, I’m the same way. But with reloading I have to check myself. Otherwise it’s just a useless waste of time, energy, and components.

 

[Shortschaf]

Your numbers are outstanding. Go shoot

 

[Formidilosus]

Form recently covered the SD thing and how it doesn’t really matter for hunting distances

More like- doesn’t matter for any legit distance that animals can be shot at.

but I’m just trying to atleast get to what factory Hornady does in my rifle (+- 20 ES with good grouping)

For what? Just to say you did?

Do you also measure all of your tires to ensure how perfectly round and consistent they are? Do you weigh all of your spoons in your house so that you stir your coffee exactly the same way? Count how many circles you make with your toothbrush on each tooth so that they are exactly the same?

 

[Jason Snyder]

Count how many circles you make with your toothbrush on each tooth so that they are exactly the same?

Yes?

 

[Jason Snyder]

I’m going to load up 10 non annealed and 10 annealed. Shoot annealed first then Non annealed (opposite of what I did in this test) to hopefully come to a conclusion if it’s my style of annealing that hurting me or powder

You’re chasing your tail.

Anneal until the neck starts to change color and that’s it.

 

[Formidilosus]

Yes?

Haha. Well then, 1,000 yard benchrest is for you.

 

[northernalpine]

Anyone see any red flags?

Only thing I don’t see is confirming your scale/powder charges by secondary means, but that may be me oversimplifying it. I saw that you’re using an autotrickler setup, from what I understand those are supposed to be the cat’s pajamas once you get them dialed.

 

[JF_Idaho]

Gotta watch that Precision Hunter, too. Just had two boxes with 100+ fps difference in average velocity.

Lot# 3240075
Lot# 3230674

Avg 2688
Avg 2576

Not sure which was which. Wasn't paying attention.

 

[Harvey_NW]

Only thing I don’t see is confirming your scale/powder charges by secondary means, but that may be me oversimplifying it.

I think I've suggested this twice as well.

I saw that you’re using an autotrickler *Intellidropper setup, from what I understand those are supposed to be the cat’s pajamas once you get them dialed.

Fixed it. Big difference, lol.

 

[northernalpine]

I think I've suggested this twice as well.

Apparently my skimming through did you a disservice, great minds…

Fixed it. Big difference, lol.

Well played sir, well played

 

[Harvey_NW]

Apparently my skimming through did you a disservice, great minds…

I know I first suggested it when it was brought up in a different thread, so no disservice. I'm just curious if there is some measurable variance there, and if it actually translates into the ES of his load.