Rifle scopes you'd love to see Form test

[fwafwow]

Someone who owns and is confident with a Swaro could send it in for testing. More data is better.

 

[Reburn]

Going to preface this by saying scopes should be more reliable than the boxes they come in...

Crazy that some hunters use POS Swarovski scopes for dangerous game. If these scopes were as bad as you portray them to be, there'd be a huge pile of dead or maimed hunters in Africa alone. Throw in all the other POS unreliable scopes used over the decades there and that pile would be taller than Kilimanjaro.

Somehow hunters are finding a way to successfully recover the millions of animals they kill every single year using unreliable scopes. Until you can successfully explain that, you are unlikely to get more converts. This holds true for folks on this site as there is still a near constant stream of scope recommendations that are not SWFA, Nightforce, and Trijicon.

That is the worst possible example of why you need scope that wont zero shift one click.
You could spin the turret half a reveloution and still fataly shoot a cape buf. They are large x huge.
Not to mention alot of the time the PH shoots if the buff doesnt drop. Appears that you havent been on an actual cape buff hunt.

Where having a scope that holds zero is important is when you start trying to shoot 500 plus yards.
But. I did have a leupy in talley rings gun slide down the wall and result in a ass shot deer at 150 yards.
Just one of those things until it happens to you most people dont want to believe.
Or they just dont shoot to practice at all or really at any animals. Maybe one every couple years.

 

[DJL2]

As I understand it, Swarovski uses an atypical method of securing the internals in their optics (a setup with coil springs). It’s either genius or foolish… and I’ve never owned one to say.

I’ve only killed one scope in use. My dad, however, has killed several (by “killed” I mean total failure). He has a talent (which I only partially inherited) - if it can break, he will break it. Scopes, bipods, magazines, bolt carrier groups, chronographs, and so on.

I guess you could say he was doing his own version of Form’s endurance test - lots of miles to and from the range on unimproved roads with rifles in soft cases/drag bags. Nothing at all even close to intentional abuse. It’s funny because I never really thought about optics not holding zero before these reviews... but he is always chasing his zero at the range, and it now seems obvious why that is.

 

[amassi]

I’ve had z3, z5 and X5i. None held zero
The Z3 wouldn’t adjust without a tap or shot
On paper the z3 is the perfect mtn scope. Crazy light, beautiful optics. But ZERO reliability


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[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Despite all those fallacies Swarovski still doesn’t make a reliable scope. “Dangerous game” hunting is probably the least strenuous hunt on earth. Also NONE of the professional hunters seem to have Swarovski scopes on their double rifles, or any scope at all.

So you have an easy hunt
With back up rifles
In the hands of professionals
Without optics
Huge targets at close range
Targets and ranges so close you wouldn’t be able to see an 8” shift when the scope failed
Shooting scenarios that if 3 rounds landed 36” apart it would be explained away as stress induced.


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Are you claiming that there are not massive numbers of animals killed every year with unreliable scopes?

Are you claiming that no one has ever used an unreliable scope for dangerous game? You know the one time the scope actually does need to work "good enough", with a large bore no less, and not the WKR fantasy of hunting the "Killer Rabbit of Caerbannog".

I do want to thank you for pointing out that even with your claimed horrific failure, a monstrous 8" drift, an unreliable scope could still be effective on a large animal. Cut that in half and that still would theoretically be effective on most North American game at traditional hunting distances. Yes that is still ugly but it is not necessarily the Armageddon folks are screeching.

Find a way to reconcile the fact that all scopes should be reliable with the fact that hunters everywhere are successful despite their unreliable scopes. Once you are able to do that, then rewrite your gospel and get more converts who can put additional pressure on the scope manufacturers to make the required changes to their designs.

 

[amassi]

Are you claiming that there are not massive numbers of animals killed every year with unreliable scopes?

Are you claiming that no one has ever used an unreliable scope for dangerous game? You know the one time the scope actually does need to work "good enough", with a large bore no less, and not the WKR fantasy of hunting the "Killer Rabbit of Caerbannog".

I do want to thank you for pointing out that even with your claimed horrific failure, a monstrous 8" drift, an unreliable scope could still be effective on a large animal. Cut that in half and that still would theoretically be effective on most North American game at traditional hunting distances. Yes that is still ugly but it is not necessarily the Armageddon folks are screeching.

Find a way to reconcile the fact that all scopes should be reliable with the fact that hunters everywhere are successful despite their unreliable scopes. Once you are able to do that, then rewrite your gospel and get more converts who can put additional pressure on the scope manufacturers to make the required changes to their designs.

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[fwafwow]

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Do you own a Swaro? Serious question. I’ve got their binos, and used to own a Z5.

Had a Z5 that I won in a raffle. Sold it as I didn't care for it having insufficient elevation once the zero was set; left way too much yardage on the table with my 6.5 CM.

Once its zero was set, there were no issues with it retaining zero nor dialing while I had it. This was before the publication of the RS drop test. Neither the rifle nor scope was dropped while I had it. The bulk of the shots were in the 300-550 yard range.

I do have Swaro SLC 10s/15s and an STX 65/95. While I like those products and will likely buy more of them in the future, the same is not true for their scopes. For similar price points I'd go Trijicon or Nightforce and not look back; now if March scopes pass the drop test then they too would go on the short list.

 

[Ryan Avery]

Going to preface this by saying scopes should be more reliable than the boxes they come in...

Crazy that some hunters use POS Swarovski scopes for dangerous game. If these scopes were as bad as you portray them to be, there'd be a huge pile of dead or maimed hunters in Africa alone. Throw in all the other POS unreliable scopes used over the decades there and that pile would be taller than Kilimanjaro.

Somehow hunters are finding a way to successfully recover the millions of animals they kill every single year using unreliable scopes. Until you can successfully explain that, you are unlikely to get more converts. This holds true for folks on this site as there is still a near constant stream of scope recommendations that are not SWFA, Nightforce, and Trijicon.

Hmm…..People kill lots of animals every year with a stick bow most of them are not hitting where they were aiming. People also post lots of spine shot animals…with rifle's, they missed by a lot and still anchored the animal. Thats not how I want to kill things.

I am a swaro fanboy( spotter and binos). My wife and I have killed a pile of animals with an X5. I also had some WTF was that shots with it as well.

I don’t know why eliminating variable is such a hard concept for some to grasp.

And Long range hunting has definitely compounded the need to eliminate variable and magnified how most scopes suck at holding zero.

 

[PanhandlePilgrim]

I haven't seen much talk about these, but how about the Burris XTR pro? Looks like a really nice scope and I like the reticle.

 

[100percent]

Anecdotal (albeit enough for me) forewarning!

I watched a z5 fail twice while dialing 4 minutes. Luckily, the third shot I told my friend (who is a fine shot and experienced hunter/shooter) to hold just above the deer’s back and he dropped him like a sack of potatoes. With that it actually failed three times as it apparently didn’t register the the third shot, either! We checked the damn thing repeatedly on tall target and it was more of the same and then it magically began tracking consistently again.
A few weeks later, I witnessed another dialing Issue with a z6i on a friends rifle at the range—-same thing stuck on zero! Up to this point, I had confidently dialed and killed a lot of animals, rocks and targets with Swarovski products I had more than a few Z5/Z6’s so, I summarily replaced the batch with nightforce products out of fear of a repeat. I hate, I mean truly despise, the nightforce reticles and the glass is not Swarovski but, they are proven bombproof the world over, by the guys that matter! Variable removed!

Ryan and I had a back and forth similar to this thread a time or two before that event! I thought he must be crazy but, these experiences made me doubt my equipment. Ryan does sound crazy but, potentially correct in this instance!

i asked the question of amassi out of pure curiosity, as I am willing to make a Z5 donation if there has not been one tested (not the same one that failed)! How do you go about that?

I sold the one that failed to a smartass!!!

 

[Dobermann]

I haven't seen much talk about these, but how about the Burris XTR pro?

I'll second this ... if only because of all of the talking up about it on the Hide, and Burris would have had to have done something really different for it to not fail like previous offerings.

Like Form, I don't particularly care if any particular brand passes or fails - I'd like them all to pass - but the hype from people about optics they haven't even used, let alone tested, is pretty silly.

 

[Clark33]

I'll second this ... if only because of all of the talking up about it on the Hide, and Burris would have had to have done something really different for it to not fail like previous offerings.

Like Form, I don't particularly care if any particular brand passes or fails - I'd like them all to pass - but the hype from people about optics they haven't even used, let alone tested, is pretty silly.

What previous offerings failed? I'd like to see and XTRII or III tested, the PRO seems like more of PRS scope like the bushnell tested a bit ago.

 

[Dobermann]

What previous offerings failed? I'd like to see and XTRII or III tested, the PRO seems like more of PRS scope like the bushnell tested a bit ago.

I don't think any have been documented in this subforum yet ... but Form can comment on others he's seen fail.

 

[brn2hnt]

I don't know if it's been mentioned yet, but after listening to the shoot 2 hunt podcast... I'd love to see the gunwerks scope.

 

[dreamingWest]

Is the Maven RS.1.2 (2.5-15X44 FFP) on the list yet?​

 

[JakeSCH]

Is the Maven RS.1.2 (2.5-15X44 FFP) on the list yet?​

Yeah I have been wondering if the .2 version's have been designed to higher standard. I emailed this morning and asked them directly. @Ryan Avery have tested your 3.2 yet?

 

[JakeSCH]

Is the Maven RS.1.2 (2.5-15X44 FFP) on the list yet?​

FYI - Justin from Maven responded and said the RS1.2 has passed a 3rd party testing...(referencing the form drop testing) - so it may be a winner.

 

[Brontosaurus]

FYI - Justin from Maven responded and said the RS1.2 has passed a 3rd party testing...(referencing the form drop testing) - so it may be a winner.

This is huge... wow

 

[Brontosaurus]

@Formidilosus did you test the R.S. 1.2. ?