Rate my Mid-Nov Frank Church Clothing System

[Alegault]

Hey All - doing a Mid Nov hunt in the Frank Church. It will be my first time out there. Seems like weather averages 10 low-30 high with possibility of being colder. Activity levels will vary as some will be on horseback before sunrise (I'm guessing cold), some glassing (cold), and some hiking up tough country (Probably overheating).

Just looking for some sanity checking of my clothing system and excuses to buy new gear. Current system thoughts:

• Top
  • FL Kiln QZ
  • FL Furnace or Kuiu Strongfleece 260
  • FL Solitude vest or Kuiu Kenai Vest
  • SG Grumman Puffy or FL Chamberlain (have both, can't decide)
  • Kryptek Koldo (sized up one to fit over puffy if needed, hopefully quiet enough)
• Bottom
  • Merino lightweight boxers
  • Kuiu zipoff Peleton
  • Kuiu Attacks
  • SG Grumman Puffy Pants
  • Kuiu Northridge Rain Shell Pants
• Boots/Feet
  • Kene Mountain Extreme 400g
  • Liner sock
  • midweight merino sock (darn toughs)

The guide sent a gear list emphasizing quiet gear and mentioned wool and fleece a bunch of times. He pointed me to woolrich but their website looks like a nordstrom ad rather than somewhere I'd buy mountain clothes. Not sure what pieces folks get from there. This is a rifle hunt so not sure how loud my stuff could be.

Could use the most input where I have the "or"'s above and just generally if folks think I will be warm enough and have the right layer options to deal with varying activity level. Guessing during glassing I might just throw everything on, but not sure if that will fly for the horseride part.

Any tips appreciated -Thanks All!

 

[doverpack12]

Looks pretty good. I’d bring both puffy jackets and the vest you prefer plus everything else listed.
I don’t use the furnace or strong fleece so can’t offer anything there.
Attacks are not that warm in late season conditions when not moving or if it’s windy.
Frank Church can be downright nasty in September on rifle hunts so I imagine mid November will be real late season conditions and you will want it all.

Just curious, which outfitter

 

[Alegault]

Thanks for the response. Yea I am trying to plan for nasty cold, but also calibrating what clothing will actually help against that.

You think worth going with a thicker pant like the guides (or heavier) or better to increase weight of the base layer bottoms? Basically balance not being able to shed layers or vent during the hard hike portions with not freezing when stationary.

Going with middle fork outfitters.

 

[doverpack12]

I would step up the pant for better DWR and wind resistance. Base layers don’t do a lot against those two.

I really like the guide and wear mine most of November in SW MT. If you have them then take them instead. Guide pants do pretty well against the wind and much better than the jacket.

If you don’t have the guide consider the axis, they are better in the wind and offer better water resistance but the pant itself is slightly thinner. Guides have bigger vents especially when combined with hand pocket zippers and fly.

SG DeHavilland is another option that is an In between pant from attack to guide. Better in the wind and against moisture than the attack, thicker and warmer but also massive vents.

 

[tjmitchell]

Your boot choice is spot on but I think I would take another pair of warmer boots also like the Schnee Extreme,that’s a fantastic boot that will keep you warm and dry.

 

[Alegault]

I have the de havilland lite and like them, especially that full zip for venting, though can be a touch loud sometimes. Do you find the regular ones to be quieter? My guess is, it’s not loud enough to matter at distances we’re talking for rifle.

On boots the outfitter mentioned he often goes with pac boots.Wasn’t sure the trade off on warmth vs hike-ability.

Really appreciate all the input guys.

 

[Big Ern]

Kuiu guide pants or talus hybrid would be my choice over attack pants for a november hunt.

 

[sneaky]

I have the de havilland lite and like them, especially that full zip for venting, though can be a touch loud sometimes. Do you find the regular ones to be quieter? My guess is, it’s not loud enough to matter at distances we’re talking for rifle.

On boots the outfitter mentioned he often goes with pac boots.Wasn’t sure the trade off on warmth vs hike-ability.

Really appreciate all the input guys.

Pac boots in the Frank? Holy smokes. Ron never gets off his horse then. No way I'd take pac boots on a hunt in the Frank. No way. My ankles hurt just thinking about it.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[jdmaxwell]

Mid October Frank last yr.. weather ranged from 20 degree nights to 60 degree days. Couple inches snow up top.
Hiking every day, no horses i wore uninsulated boots and thin Wrangler cargo pants every day. Layered up when on top glossing with puffys.
My extra warm boots and Kuiu Guide pants sat at airstrip whole time.
But that's me and my experience.

 

[MtnMuley]

I'll second the Talus Hybrid for a mid November hunt there. I'd also have a set of gaiters with me. Last thing I'd do different would take midweight merino bottoms instead of the Peloton. Zip-off's if you prefer that style, but not too sure I'd take them on a mid Nov hunt there.

Other than that, you're list looks very good.

 

[mtwarden]

As pointed out above, mid-November could mean a couple of different things- without a crystal ball you don't know which mid-November you'll be getting until a week or two out (even then subject to change)

If the outfitter reports a lot of snow, I'd definitely consider pac boots- with an extra set of liners. The "new" pacs aren't the old Sorels, you can hike in them and hike a lot. If there isn't a lot of snow, I'd go with something to what you have listed; lots of snow- I'd seriously consider pacs.

 

[Alegault]

Updating on how this went in case it helps anyone else. Temps were from 5-33. Ankle deep snow in most places we hunted.

Weight ended up being not an issue with the horses packing us in so I took a few extra pieces to fine tune my gear after each day in the field.

• Top
  • FL Kiln QZ
  • Kuiu Strongfleece 260
  • FL Klamath
  • Kuiu Kenai Vest
  • Kryptek Vellus
  • SG Grumman Puffy
  • FL Chamberlain
  • Kryptek Koldo (sized up one to fit over puffy if needed, hopefully quiet enough)
• Bottom
  • Merino lightweight boxers
  • Kuiu zipoff 200
  • Kuiu Axis pant
  • SG Grumman Puffy Pants
  • Kryptek Koldo pants
• Head
  • FL Tundra Balaclava
• Boots/Feet/Hands
  • Kene Mountain Extreme 400g
  • FL Brambler Gaiters
  • Hoffman Pac boots
  • Liner sock
  • midweight merino sock (darn toughs)
  • OR Highcamp 3-Finger Gloves
  • Kuiu Yukon pro gloves

Things I didn't use or stopped using quickly:

• Kuiu 260 - Too hot when hiking (Merino long sleeve under), and too cold when sitting. Merino base + 260 + kenai vest + grumman I was cold on the horse. I found the merino base + klamath to be perfect when hiking hard even at the low temps. Vellus + kenai vest when sitting and was fine. I really like this piece but could not find a place for it my system this trip.

• FL Chamberlain - only wore it around camp. Too warm and bulky for the field IMHO. Even stationary, the fully zipped vellus, add my keani vest under was perfect. It was nice to be able to rock just a tshirt and this around camp though.

• Koldo Raingear- never snowed hard enough to need it. Vellus cut the wind so well never thought about grabbing them. Again, on a pure backpack hunt, I might have needed to be more discerning with layers and maybe would have used them more to cut down weight.

• Hoffman Pac boots - toes were cold when not moving during the lows, but not enough to wish I had too much more. Even hiking hard in the 400g was a bit hot and caused more sweat in the boot than I would have liked. I wonder if boot covers for glassing and less/no insulation would have been the best move.

• Grumman Pants - Never wore them. The Axis pants with the 200 merino zip offs was plenty warm when sitting. Vents and zipping off the pants when moving. Was nice piece of mind to have em though.

Unexpected champ of the trip:

• Kryptek Vellus - I lived in this thing. Super warm and quiet. Big pit zips let you regulate temps pretty well. Not the most packable. I think on a pure backpack hunt, I might have thought differently, but man was this piece great.

Other things I liked a normal amount:

• Kuiu Axis pants - thanks all for the recommendation here. Really comfortable, fit well, plenty warm. Only 2 knocks I had on these were that 1) I put a couple holes in them which seemed fast for only one hard hunt on em and 2) I wish the vents went down lower so when active you could mitigate even more sweat. Glad I picked these up.
• FL Balaclava - Slept in it. Glassed in it. Rode the horse in it. The part you pull up over your face stays in exactly whatever place you put it. The face part is thinner to mitigate your wet breathing. Easy to pull just around your neck if getting hot. Packable enough. It was a great last minute impulse add to the list.

A staged photo with my horse's bridle messed up showing off my dialed in fit by trip end.

Thanks again to all here for the advice!