Project 2025 and public lands and environment

[PLhunter]

There is an infinite amount of mistruth in this. They certainly did not “devastate” the cattle industry. You are talking about one BLM allotment the APR acquired with the land purchase. How in the world does one allotment devastate the entire cattle industry in the state? Get real n

They require special fencing because the cattle industry lobbies and requires they be fenced in. They don’t actually “require” fencing if we’d move off the ridiculous practice of calling them livestock instead of wildlife.

 

[Jason Snyder]

They require special fencing because the cattle industry lobbies and requires they be fenced in. They don’t actually “require” fencing if we’d move off the ridiculous practice of calling them livestock instead of wildlife.

Details, shmetails.

 

[PLhunter]

Regardless, I think the attack on environmental resources and public lands is imminent. We need to be ready and to organize.

I think defining when the threshold for combined action is reached is a good first step. Some people think that starts at locked gates. Some think it starts much earlier. A smattering of opposition does little. So reaching some consensus would be great.

If you don’t already know your representatives contact information get it. Bother them. It’s super easy to send emails and phone calls. Talk to fellow hunters and encourage them to join you in calls. Join organizations that align with your values and ask that they hold politicians accountable to coming through on congressionally designated funds for conservation. It’s unconstitutional to revoke those resources so hold your politicians to their oath of office.

Be selfish in your hunting and fishing advocacy. The extraction industry doesn’t consider your needs at all. They can advocate and will for themselves. So be selfish in your advocacy. They sure will, they don’t need your help to balance the debate, it’s plenty balanced their way already.

 

[Gila]

I'm curious about your sentence "...our rights codified on the federal level". What does that mean exactly and how would we go about getting that done? It sounds interesting.

Some states have amended their constitution to include the right to hunt and fish. Trapping has continued to be a “political hot potato” though. I doubt that states with high urban populations would ever go for it on the federal level. The reason why these rights are not included in the US Constitution is because the founders had no idea that there could be grocery stores in the future. LOL! I think these rights should be an amendment but not going to hold my breath.

 

[CJ19]

Regardless, I think the attack on environmental resources and public lands is imminent. We need to be ready and to organize.

I think defining when the threshold for combined action is reached is a good first step. Some people think that starts at locked gates. Some think it starts much earlier. A smattering of opposition does little. So reaching some consensus would be great.

If you don’t already know your representatives contact information get it. Bother them. It’s super easy to send emails and phone calls. Talk to fellow hunters and encourage them to join you in calls. Join organizations that align with your values and ask that they hold politicians accountable to coming through on congressionally designated funds for conservation. It’s unconstitutional to revoke those resources so hold your politicians to their oath of office.

Be selfish in your hunting and fishing advocacy. The extraction industry doesn’t consider your needs at all. They can advocate and will for themselves. So be selfish in your advocacy. They sure will, they don’t need your help to balance the debate, it’s plenty balanced their way already.

how are we going organize? I do not want transfer of federal lands. But for some reason when i have voted big government and big green conservation in the past, what i got instead of sound conservation policy was over 40% of federal conservation budgets going to dei, men in womens locker rooms and sports, child gender transition surgeries, and open borders.

 

[PLhunter]

Some states have amended their constitution to include the right to hunt and fish. Trapping has continued to be a “political hot potato” though. I doubt that states with high urban populations would ever go for it on the federal level. The reason why these rights are not included in the US Constitution is because the founders had no idea that there could be grocery stores in the future. LOL! I think these rights should be an amendment but not going to hold my breath.

It’s also a tricky thing to have worded correctly. Someone could view any game laws as obstructing that right. Or in some future where wildlife populations get depleted to the point a closure is necessary to maintain the resource. It’s a good route to go but needs to be worded very clearly and carefully.

 

[PLhunter]

how are we going organize? I do not want transfer of federal lands. But for some reason when i have voted big government and big green conservation in the past, what i got instead of sound conservation policy was over 40% of federal conservation budgets going to dei, men in womens locker rooms and sports, child gender transition surgeries, and open borders.

I don’t think your figures are correct…. Also, a lot of those cultural issues are used disingenuously on both sides. I don’t get as worked up about chicks with dicks as some people. They knew it would get people hot and bothered and that doing so would allow them changes they care more about. Honestly, in a real world sense the forest service and blm where I am was super responsive and engaging over the last 4 years. Also, they sponsored some good projects we participated in. I think the figures are exaggerated intentionally to get people to throw the baby out.

 

[Ozarkansas]

how are we going organize? I do not want transfer of federal lands. But for some reason when i have voted big government and big green conservation in the past, what i got instead of sound conservation policy was over 40% of federal conservation budgets going to dei, men in womens locker rooms and sports, child gender transition surgeries, and open borders.

40% of federal conservation budgets go to DEI, men in women’s locker rooms and sports, and child gender surgeries? That sounds less than factual.

You know there’s a lot of pro-public land conservative politicians out there, right? There’s several in my state. They often get beat out in the primaries out west, but they’re there. Vote for them. Write to your reps. Join hunting and access orgs (I know BHA triggers some people on here but there’s a lot of others too). There’s a ton of ways to engage

 

[CJ19]

I don’t think your figures are correct…. Also, a lot of those cultural issues are used disingenuously on both sides. I don’t get as worked up about chicks with dicks as some people. They knew it would get people hot and bothered and that doing so would allow them changes they care more about. Honestly, in a real world sense the forest service and blm where I am was super responsive and engaging over the last 4 years. Also, they sponsored some good projects we participated in. I think the figures are exaggerated intentionally to get people to throw the baby out.

before you accuse me of being disingenuous and making stuff up maybe you sound read the actual documents. 40% is straight out a biden EO that applies to a wide range of goverment funding including conservation related funding such as things like the precious LWCF so many in the conservation crowd get chubbed up about.

 

[PLhunter]

The examples of DEI in the I DOI personally liked recently, that is likely under threat, is the gathering of diverse native seeds and including and preserving them in seed banks. A solid effort to create seed stores is invaluable after winter range fires. Like eastern Oregon experienced this year. Important projects like that are unlikely to be executed under current management. Other success stories abound when you look at it for what actually happened vs the prevailing narrative.

 

[CJ19]

40% of federal conservation budgets go to DEI, men in women’s locker rooms and sports, and child gender surgeries? That sounds less than factual.

You know there’s a lot of pro-public land conservative politicians out there, right? There’s several in my state. They often get beat out in the primaries out west, but they’re there. Vote for them. Write to your reps. Join hunting and access orgs (I know BHA triggers some people on here but there’s a lot of others too). There’s a ton of ways to engage

maybe you should try reading some of the documents also. there are many posts on this very forum about it.

here one on page 4

Public funding: Should skin color or ethnicity matter for conservation related public funding?

Are hunters and conservationists on this forum aware that skin color and ethnicity are important considerations by the Biden Adminstration and state governments for distribution of billions of dollars of public funding including funding directly tied to conservation? Do hunters think skin color...

rokslide.com

so completely factual

The examples of DEI in the I DOI personally liked recently, that is likely under threat, is the gathering of diverse native seeds and including and preserving them in seed banks. A solid effort to create seed stores is invaluable after winter range fires. Like eastern Oregon experienced this year. Important projects like that are unlikely to be executed under current management. Other success stories abound when you look at it for what actually happened vs the prevailing narrative.

so here is where all this we need to organize falls apart. when you start telling me DEI wasn't a problem. I am imagining things and it was all about collecting seeds. I was there. In publicly funded meetings. being told whiteness was the problem. blah blah blah. so all this over stuff you typing is really just garbage to me when you start type stuff like this here.

 

[PLhunter]

before you accuse me of being disingenuous and making stuff up maybe you sound read the actual documents. 40% is straight out a biden EO that applies to a wide range of goverment funding including conservation related funding such as things like the precious LWCF so many in the conservation crowd get chubbed up about.

That number alone wasn’t disingenuous but the details of what it was to go to are. That’s not an accusation it’s a reality. Those investments were to go into disadvantaged communities. Which federal spending in disadvantaged communities is something that has happened. A lot of those areas being prioritized for that investment were deep red as those are often the poorest areas. So calling that DEI in that sense is more than just a stretch.

 

[PLhunter]

maybe you should try reading some of the documents also. there are many posts on this very forum about it.

here one on page 4

Public funding: Should skin color or ethnicity matter for conservation related public funding?

Are hunters and conservationists on this forum aware that skin color and ethnicity are important considerations by the Biden Adminstration and state governments for distribution of billions of dollars of public funding including funding directly tied to conservation? Do hunters think skin color...

rokslide.com

so completely factual




so here is where all this we need to organize falls apart. when you start telling me DEI wasn't a problem. I am imagining things and it was all about collecting seeds. I was there. In publicly funded meetings. being told whiteness was the problem. blah blah blah. so all this over stuff you typing is really just garbage to me when you start type stuff like this here.

The real examples of successes of federal DOI funding is garbage to you? The seed project was really earmarked and to happen? Why is it garbage does it not reflect what you want it to?

 

[PLhunter]

maybe you should try reading some of the documents also. there are many posts on this very forum about it.

here one on page 4

Public funding: Should skin color or ethnicity matter for conservation related public funding?

Are hunters and conservationists on this forum aware that skin color and ethnicity are important considerations by the Biden Adminstration and state governments for distribution of billions of dollars of public funding including funding directly tied to conservation? Do hunters think skin color...

rokslide.com

so completely factual




so here is where all this we need to organize falls apart. when you start telling me DEI wasn't a problem. I am imagining things and it was all about collecting seeds. I was there. In publicly funded meetings. being told whiteness was the problem. blah blah blah. so all this over stuff you typing is really just garbage to me when you start type stuff like this here.

I’m just not interested in culture war stuff like many are. I care more about things like seeds and conservation projects and the actual things happening related to conservation. Sure be mad about DEI but again keep in mind that we are losing more than DEI when we let that distract us. Those important tangible conservation projects that were to happen will not be happening under current management. That matters more to me than culture war side shows.

 

[Gila]

There is an infinite amount of mistruth in this. They certainly did not “devastate” the cattle industry. You are talking about one BLM allotment the APR acquired with the land purchase. How in the world does one allotment devastate the entire cattle industry in the state? Get real.

You’ve obviously missed the fact APR often works with neighboring ranchers to lease grazing to them? That sounds pretty nefarious. Not to mention they also allow public hunting AND access to landlocked public lands.

I beg to differ. They are up to six grazing allotments now. And last I looked AP was allowing only one (small) block management unit for public hunting. That is a drop in the bucket compared to how much land they occupy that can’t be hunted. As far as access to public lands is concerned, the last AP Podcast I listened to Gerrity was trying to establish corridors for Wolves and Grizzlies. CBD is the largest anti-hunting group on the planet and they endorse AP. I have never had CBD endorse anything I was ever involved with. Read this:

“Attorney General Knudsen’s appeal asks the U.S. Department of the Interior Office of Hearings and Appeals to overturn the decision and issue a stay until the appeal is resolved to prevent irreparable harm to the grazing allotments and surrounding communities, said a Knudsen news release.

“The BLM’s decision ignores the real concerns of rural communities and ranchers who rely on the land in favor of elitist attitudes of those seeking to transform Northeast Montana into a wildlife viewing shed for tourists. Agriculture is not an easy way of life, but Montana ranch families – including my own – are proud of their history and heritage that is still a part of our state today,” Attorney General Knudsen said. “As American Prairie Reserve occupies more and more land here, it pushes out ranching communities, threatens our livestock industry, and will ultimately add to the instability of the world’s food supply.”

 

[CJ19]

The real examples of successes of federal DOI funding is garbage to you? The seed project was really earmarked and to happen? Why is it garbage does it not reflect what you want it to?

you're gas lighting right now. You type whatever you need to in order to make yourself feel better,

Nobody wants to hear you telling them they did not really understand what DEI was. Everyone knows what it was. Until the line from people like you, is "yea that dei stuff was nuts and we should never be spending another penny on it." Its my opinion that I really don't care if every acre of federal land is transferred because I listed the issues that are all more important (life changing) to 9/10 sportsman including myself and you can't even acknowledge they got out of hand or were a problem.

 

[Ozarkansas]

maybe you should try reading some of the documents also. there are many posts on this very forum about it.

here one on page 4

There’s no page 4, and there’s some pretty strong rebuttals in there against your point.

As it stands I think “40% of federal funding of certain programs should be directed to disadvantaged communities”-which includes many poor rural white communities- is way different than “40% of federal conservation funding is going towards transgender surgeries and men in women’s locker rooms/sports”

 

[CJ19]

There’s no page 4, and there’s some pretty strong rebuttals in there against your point.

As it stands I think “40% of federal funding of certain programs should be directed to disadvantaged communities”-which includes many poor rural white communities- is way different than “40% of federal conservation funding is going towards transgender surgeries and men in women’s locker rooms/sports”

gas light away. you guys can organize all you want. i am on the finding fraud, waste, and abuse train. Liking what i am seeing. Government employee don't even want to report to the office still. There are issues in this world more important than hunting once every 5 years on BLM to me. Until the big issues get solved, I am not really interested in what you guys are saying here. Good Luck to you.

 

[PLhunter]

you're gas lighting right now. You type whatever you need to in order to make yourself feel better,

Nobody wants to hear you telling them they did not really understand what DEI was. Everyone knows what it was. Until the line from people like you, is "yea that dei stuff was nuts and we should never be spending another penny on it." Its my opinion that I really don't care if every acre of federal land is transferred because I listed the issues that are all more important (life changing) to 9/10 sportsman including myself and you can't even acknowledge they got out of hand or were a problem.

Okay that DEI stuff was nuts and we shouldn’t spend money on it. Done. Like I said not here for culture war stuff. It is absolutely wild to me that you think that stuff matters more than environment or land issues but I’m meeting you on that one.

Now back to the differences in the current administration when it comes to those other uses of resources and funds. Those were important projects that ultimately made up a significant use of funds and now are lost and what we got in exchange was no more investment specifically in certain areas with past issues. I just think it’s a baby and bath water situation that doesn’t pencil out for me. But then again I didn’t get really fired up about those culture war things but I realize many did.


Here is the actual initiative. Without narrative. For those curious. The premise was that the most polluted or rundown areas get priority in cleanup and infrastructure investment. But I’m fine blowing that up to get back to gathering seeds and working on resilient landscapes and improving winter range.

Federal Register, Volume 59 Issue 32 (Wednesday, February 16, 1994)

Justice40 Initiative | Environmental Justice | The White House

“We’ll create good jobs for millions of Americans…and we’ll do it all to withstand the devastating effects of climate change and promote environmental justice.” President Joe Biden, 2022 State of the Union What is the Justice40 Initiative? For the first time in our nation’s history, the Federal...

bidenwhitehouse.archives.gov

 

[CJ19]

Okay that DEI stuff was nuts and we shouldn’t spend money on it. Done. Like I said not here for culture war stuff. It is absolutely wild to me that you think that stuff matters more than environment or land issues but I’m meeting you on that one.

Now back to the differences in the current administration when it comes to those other uses of resources and funds. Those were important projects that ultimately made up a significant use of funds and now are lost and what we got in exchange was no more investment specifically in certain areas with past issues. I just think it’s a baby and bath water situation that doesn’t pencil out for me. But then again I didn’t get really fired up about those culture war things but I realize many did.


Here is the actual order. Without narrative or distortion. For those curious.

Federal Register, Volume 59 Issue 32 (Wednesday, February 16, 1994)

i have many years in public resources and environmental resource management. I don't need you to tell me how DEI ties into them and if they are important to how those things are implement. It matters.