Premium Tag Advice/Lessons learned

[IrkedCitizen]

On my premium tag i failed to capitalize on a 340 class bull on the second day and ended up killing a 304" 6x6 on the seventh/last day of season. He was the third biggest bull i found in 12 days (5 scouting/7 hunting). I saw him on the second day of scouting and killed him ten days later. Persistence paid off. It's a mental game

 

[PLhunter]

 

[PLhunter]

Getting into some better bulls on my second trip out. A couple I would take with the tag.

 

[NRA4LIFE]

What I would tell anyone is don't give up, ever, keep going. Although not a "premium" tag, I drew a rare cow moose tag here in WA in 2016. Weather was as bad as you could imagine. Other than the first and last day, it poured down rain every day I hunted. But we kept at it, only my wife and I. And then, one day, my wife bino'd a cow a mile away. Backed up the truck out of her sight and took off. An hour later and 1000 foot climb, it was over, notched tag.

 

[PLhunter]

Well, I have some lessons learned myself I’ll share more about later. Ultimately, I ended up shooting a much smaller bull than I wanted and several factors had to combine for it to happen. I’m pretty devastated and it’s still pretty fresh.

I guess my quick advice would be question your spotters and as a spotter don’t throw out the “shooter” statement lightly. The shooter might have a narrow window and take your word for it. Be as sure as you can. I had some amazing elk encounters and was in big elk. I was very successful at getting in on elk and missed a great bull twice. All on me there. Tricky shots but ones I made in practice. Unfortunately I connected perfectly on a bull I would not have went after if I had looked at it through optics. I put too much weight into someone else’s assessment and paid the price. Open sights at medium ranges makes that quick assessment tougher, bow range is close enough for naked eye assessment and scoped rifle is good at any shooting ranges. Open peep sights at 130 yards isn’t as easy to make that final call at. I’m sick if I’m being honest. Wish I was still out there. I’m the one who pulled the trigger but the response from my spotter stings. “Well he was 2000 yards, you were 150, you shouldn’t have shot” I just wish they had used less definitive language. Possible shooter, decent bull, take a closer look, etc… but I’m the shooter and pulled the trigger. Ended up with a 290 5 year old bull. When less than a half mile away I’d spotted and assessed a 330 and passed on making a move. Had chased several 370’s. Never considered my spotter would be this far off.

 

[WRO]

Well, I have some lessons learned myself I’ll share more about later. Ultimately, I ended up shooting a much smaller bull than I wanted and several factors had to combine for it to happen. I’m pretty devastated and it’s still pretty fresh.

I guess my quick advice would be question your spotters and as a spotter don’t throw out the “shooter” statement lightly. The shooter might have a narrow window and take your word for it. Be as sure as you can. I had some amazing elk encounters and was in big elk. I was very successful at getting in on elk and missed a great bull twice. All on me there. Tricky shots but ones I made in practice. Unfortunately I connected perfectly on a bull I would not have went after if I had looked at it through optics. I put too much weight into someone else’s assessment and paid the price. Open sights at medium ranges makes that quick assessment tougher, bow range is close enough for naked eye assessment and scoped rifle is good at any shooting ranges. Open peep sights at 130 yards isn’t as easy to make that final call at. I’m sick if I’m being honest. Wish I was still out there. I’m the one who pulled the trigger but the response from my spotter stings. “Well he was 2000 yards, you were 150, you shouldn’t have shot” I just wish they had used less definitive language. Possible shooter, decent bull, take a closer look, etc… but I’m the shooter and pulled the trigger. Ended up with a 290 5 year old bull. When less than a half mile away I’d spotted and assessed a 330 and passed on making a move. Had chased several 370’s. Never considered my spotter would be this far off.

I have that t shirt too.


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[LongWayAround]

@PLhunter

Bummer how it ended for you, but it's cool that you got to see and chase those really big bulls.

Don't forget a 290 is still a bull almost anyone would be proud of in a different context.

I killed a bull smaller than I had planned on a ten point tag a few years ago. It took a moment for it to sink in. Bugling elk, beautiful sunrise/scenery, my buddy there to help... It was a great day even if it didn't end in monster bull dreams.

 

[PLhunter]

@PLhunter

Bummer how it ended for you, but it's cool that you got to see and chase those really big bulls.

Don't forget a 290 is still a bull almost anyone would be proud of in a different context.

I killed a bull smaller than I had planned on a ten point tag a few years ago. It took a moment for it to sink in. Bugling elk, beautiful sunrise/scenery, my buddy there to help... It was a great day even if it didn't end in monster bull dreams.

Mine stings just because it was so unnecessarily soon, we had no rush. We were having fun. I was fit and up to days and days of moves on elk. We had bigger elk fully located. It just was all around unnecessary. Lol, a 7x7 wandered through camp after we got all the meat out. No one else missed the 350 twice though.

 

[PLhunter]

The spotter who made the call “shooter” is also one not to reflect or apologize. My dad. He simply saw the bull and said…. “Well that’s not even close.” Then didn’t apologize or state anything other than it was a long ways away for him and you were closer why did you shoot. Not considering all that goes into shooting a successful shot with open sights in a 20 yard gap of aspens. He watched the bull for two hours and never changed his assessment or added any info. Simply criticized my 10 second window. It’s hard.

 

[huntnful]

Honestly, I know it sucks. But live, learn and move on. At least you got to hunt with your dad, even if he was the catalyst to you killing a lesser bull. They're just animals, they don't matter much in the grand scheme. You kill one, look at the horns a couple times, and move on to the next year/hunt.

My buddy just had a 240" mule deer smoked right out from under him after watching him all summer. Shit happens for sure. But it's just a hunt. You'll lose some sleep and pass some blame around, but at the end of the day, it's mostly on you and you're decisions. If you're only trophy minded, either hunt with trophy hunters that know exactly what they're seeing, or hunt alone and take it all in your hands.

Lets see some pictures of the bull!

 

[realunlucky]

I had max points, drew a top tier unit, shot the wrong bull on opening morning (crazy circumstances). Made me physically sick in the moment of realization.

All that to say the sting goes away with time.

Give your dad a little grace, move on and don't let it eat at your relationship with him.

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[hoosierhunter11]

I just found this thread today and read the entire thing. I enjoyed reading about your preparations and strategy for the hunt. I can understand the bad taste in your mouth, however, years from now that will be gone and you’ll have fond memories of hunting with your dad and this will hopefully be a funny story to share with your children or younger hunting partners down the road. I’m not trying to downplay your emotions, but this too shall pass. Congrats and cherish the memories!

 

[hoosierhunter11]

I just found this thread today and read the entire thing. I enjoyed reading about your preparations and strategy for the hunt. I can understand the bad taste in your mouth, however, years from now that will be gone and you’ll have fond memories of hunting with your dad and this will hopefully be a funny story to share with your children or younger hunting partners down the road. I’m not trying to downplay your emotions, but this too shall pass. Congrats and cherish the memories!

I have had the opportunity to hunt elk with my dad the past two years. Last year, he was 10 feet from me when I shot my first bull (CO archery - unreal experience!) and I was 10 feet from him this year when he missed a beautiful 6x6 at just under 100 yards with an open sight muzzleloader. He’s 60 and I know this era of our hunting career won’t last forever. This is likely the reason for the spirit in my response. Eager to see some photos!

 

[PLhunter]

I have had the opportunity to hunt elk with my dad the past two years. Last year, he was 10 feet from me when I shot my first bull (CO archery - unreal experience!) and I was 10 feet from him this year when he missed a beautiful 6x6 at just under 100 yards with an open sight muzzleloader. He’s 60 and I know this era of our hunting career won’t last forever. This is likely the reason for the spirit in my response. Eager to see some photos!

My dad refused to take a photo with the bull. I think he’s embarrassed. I was with him on his 370+ bull. I’d love to just be able to have an honest conversation with him about what we each could have done better but he gets really defensive. Any time I try to bring up how next time saying a different less definitive word would be helpful if it’s far he just says how I was on the trigger and closer…. Makes reconciling hard. Outside of this hunt I have many epic memories. When he was a hell of a lot tougher and harder of a man. He’s a different man without his horses. It’s tough for me to reconcile. It’s like they took all his responsibility and grit when they died.

 

[PLhunter]

 

[MThuntrrr]

Still a beautiful bull! Premium tags are tough. Sounds like you learned a valuable lesson and thanks for sharing. I’ll echo what the others have said that the disappointment will fade, and the memory with your father will prevail. Don’t forget that he wanted the best outcome for you and was putting in the time on your behalf. Everybody makes mistakes in the heat of the moment, and ultimately you pulled the trigger. Certainly not worth negatively impacting a relationship. Best of luck with the rest of the season.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

My dad refused to take a photo with the bull. I think he’s embarrassed. I was with him on his 370+ bull. I’d love to just be able to have an honest conversation with him about what we each could have done better but he gets really defensive. Any time I try to bring up how next time saying a different less definitive word would be helpful if it’s far he just says how I was on the trigger and closer…. Makes reconciling hard. Outside of this hunt I have many epic memories. When he was a hell of a lot tougher and harder of a man. He’s a different man without his horses. It’s tough for me to reconcile. It’s like they took all his responsibility and grit when they died.

Sounds like he’s processing a lot of stuff. That can be very tough for “tough and hard men.” I’d guess that he got a hint of his own mortality when those horses died. And that some of the joy in the overall experience went out of it with them.

I think a man needs to just accept the tough reality. Don’t look for a hard man to open up. Just try to put some of the joy back into the experience for both of you.

This is easy for me to say because I didn’t miss any elk. I also didn’t shoot at, or even hunt, any elk. Forgive yourself for the misses and forgive your dad for his misappraisal of the “trophy status.” We are all human. We carry our regrets far too long. We all need to be more like Scotty P.

 

[LCguy]

You'll lose some sleep and pass some blame around, but at the end of the day, it's mostly on you and you're decisions. If you're only trophy minded, either hunt with trophy hunters that know exactly what they're seeing, or hunt alone and take it all in your hands.

Gotta agree with this. Not your dad's fault you pulled the trigger. I get the disappointment but one of the number one rules of hunting safety is to always verify what you're shooting at. That's on you, not your dad.

 

[Preston]

That’s how my dad’s premium elk tag went. We were tagged out by 10 am opening morning but the 6 scouting trips he went on left him fulfilled. It was an hour away though and we had horses back then too.

My buddies goat hunt was opening day and while we had dreams of bivy hunting them at 9000 ft for days on end a snowstorm put an end to those dreams but the scouting trips and long phone calls planning left us satisfied. Also, the pack out to base camp stretched out until 1 am so that added bonus time haha.

My dad’s bison hunt was tough. We turned up one bison on a two day scout. Got there two days early. Saw nothing. Our horses were killed in a tragic accident a month before the hunt. The rental horses were terrible and ran off hobbled 3 miles in backcountry and required the tracking job of my life to find. My dad was in afib and a snowstorm was coming. While my dad had already suffered hypothermia on a 50 degree day. (Cotton and afib). We got into a herd finally in the evening and shot the biggest one. Which ended up being a cow, legal but not the goal. I processed a bison in aspen deadfall by myself for 10 hours while my dad was unable to do anything. Almost as bad as one can go.

If it were you would and you were coming from a long ways away would you maybe do one scout trip and then come in like 5 days early to bump the experience up? That’s something I’m considering.

How did your horses get killed? Car accident I assume. That is traject

 

[wjohnson1983]

All of the replies are very insightful. I also think the perspective can be skewed with phase or life and where one lives. I've played the game for a while and would say that I've been lucky enough draw 4 "premium" tags since 2021.

I live in AL, so it takes me 2 days to drive out and 2 days to drive back when I do it solo. I have two children active in sports where I typically help coach and all the other life things of school etc. that come with children under 10. Limited vacation each year, and we take at least one family trip during fall or spring break, so I usually can't take time off to scout. I've also had philosophical debates with hunting friends on if you go guided is it your animal? There's also the prices of the guided hunts these days. Does my family have the money? Yes. Could it be better served by investing, etc.? Yes Can you take it with you when you go? No

I guess I say all of this to say that I'm likely in the camp of hiring a guide for premium tags in certain situations. Mostly I'm paying for the guide on premium tags because I can't pre-scout in the summer and if I can't find a trusted partner, the guide in theory makes it more likely of me going home to the family in one piece.

I don't think I would have to harvest to make a trip successful, but seeing game and opportunities are a must on premium tags to make the experience more enjoyable. I mean how crappy would it be to draw a tag after applying for 20 years and not even get a shot opportunity, and then you'll never draw the tag again in your lifetime?

As my kids get older/grown, maybe I retire and have more time, etc. then my views may change because then I probably can spend the time to do a tag justice by pre-scouting and/or hunting the whole season.

1) 2021 drew my first elk tag as a random with 3 points in a max/near max point unit. A friend decided they wanted to go with me that had experience Western hunting, so we went DIY. I was told by all the locals and several others that I had the "golden ticket" and to not shoot a bull less than 350. I bow hunted 5 days and rifle hunted 2. Did not see a bull over 300 on the entire trip. Harvested a 270 as my first elk with a rifle. Also called in a bull archery hunting on my own that winded me as I was drawing back. 6x6. Real fun experience.

2) 2023 Drew a Gila archery tag. None of the friends I trusted to elk hunt would to commit to going, so I forked out the money to go guided. I ended up harvesting a 320 as my 1st archery elk. There's a lot of things I didn't like or agree with the guided experience with that outfitter, but I also would not have harvested an elk without the guide because we were 7 miles in on horses.

3) 2025 drew a premium NV antelope tag. May be the only one I draw in my lifetime as a NR. Guide was $4500, so I didn't contract. Thought how hard can it be to find antelope. I've done it 3 times before in WY and MT. Well I wish I hired a guide. I scouted for 3.5 days and did harvest an antelope on opening day, but not a premium caliber animal. Lots of hunters. Over 100 rifle tags handed out, and I didn't find 100 antelope in 4.5 days that would have filled the tag quota. There was also a wildfire that burned at least half of one of the units I could hunt while I was there. Only thing cool about the trip was my dad decided he wanted to ride with me. He likes to fish, but doesn't hunt and has never been out west hunting/camping.

4) 2025 Drew WY red desert antelope after 15 years of applying. Guide wanted $6,5000, so I went solo. Saw probably 500 antelope in 2.5 days and shot one that I thought was bigger, but taped out to 72. It was the biggest I saw as I think the area is still rebounding from winter kill. Still very happy and the extra 8" to maybe find an 80 wasn't worth $6,500 in this instance.