Preference points?

[Riplip]

I purchased (my first ever purchase of any points with Montana) a NR combination pref point in Sept 2018 (Year 1), and again last year in July 2019 (Year 2). But when I log into my account it says I only have 1 preference point.

Guess I need to call them and see what the deal is. I am applying through my outfitter for this year and will purchase a point at application, but I am wondering why that 2018 Combo PP is not showing up

Strange, yes I would call them as you should have two and will have 3 going into draw if you elect to purchase one at time of draw, although you should't need it if you actually have two points.

But remember, if you don'y apply this year you will lose those preference points since this will be the third year buying points without applying for a tag.

 

[Riplip]

So would it be a waste if I bought a pref point last year and I was going to plan on getting 1 more this year for a 2021 hunt? I was trying to get points to draw a rifle tag in the Missouri River breaks area for 2021 or later but if I’m understanding correctly getting pref points for a NR won’t help..
also if you do not draw a specific unit, can you just buy a pref or bonus point and not have to pay the crazy $1200 and keep waiting until you get drawn for the unit u want?


If you aren't going to apply this year you can just purchase both a Preference Point and Bonus Point in July.

 

[Oldpuck]

Preference points are cumulative in Oregon too. Each missed draw each year equals a point. And next year Oregon is very strongly considering changing some general hunts to controlled ones so I can look forward to earning more preference points in the coming years.

 

[CNY-Joe]

I had the same issue. I was using safari and ended up switching browsers to chrome and my application went through without a problem.

 

[fatlander]

I had the same issue. I was using safari and ended up switching browsers to chrome and my application went through without a problem.

What’d you use for the “Sponsor ALS #,” your own ALS number?


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[Doc Holliday]

Strange, yes I would call them as you should have two and will have 3 going into draw if you elect to purchase one at time of draw, although you should't need it if you actually have two points.

But remember, if you don'y apply this year you will lose those preference points since this will be the third year buying points without applying for a tag.

I just got off the phone with MT FWP. Up until the new law was passed that just went into effect March 1, preference points WERE only good for they year your bought it in, and the following year. So my 2018 point I purchased in September of 2018 expired after I did not enter the 2019 draw. So it was technically good for less than a year, about 7 months.

With the new law, my 2019 point would be good until the 2021 draw. They count the year you buy the preference point as year 1, and if you don't use it by year 3 (within the next 2 application periods) it goes away.

I will buy another PP with my application for this year so I will have 2 points. If I don't draw I'm going to be bitter.

 

[Riplip]

I just got off the phone with MT FWP. Up until the new law was passed that just went into effect March 1, preference points WERE only good for they year your bought it in, and the following year. So my 2018 point I purchased in September of 2018 expired after I did not enter the 2019 draw. So it was technically good for less than a year, about 7 months.

With the new law, my 2019 point would be good until the 2021 draw. They count the year you buy the preference point as year 1, and if you don't use it by year 3 (within the next 2 application periods) it goes away.

I will buy another PP with my application for this year so I will have 2 points. If I don't draw I'm going to be bitter.

I am not sure that I follow this explanation. If you purchased a PP in 2018 and 2019 and did not draw general tag either year you should have 2 points. Preference points accumulate until one of two things take place. 1. You draw a general tag; 2. You do not apply for a general license within three years of accumulating your first point.

Directly from the 2020 Regs: "Preference points accumulated will be used during the current drawing whether you purchase an additional preference point or not. Any accumulated preference points are lost after three years of not applying for a Nonresident Combination License."

Maybe I am missing additional language in the regulations which is certainly possible. Did they point you to the specific rule modification that took place March 1st?

 

[Doc Holliday]

I am not sure that I follow this explanation. If you purchased a PP in 2018 and 2019 and did not draw general tag either year you should have 2 points. Preference points accumulate until one of two things take place. 1. You draw a general tag; 2. You do not apply for a general license within three years of accumulating your first point.

Directly from the 2020 Regs: "Preference points accumulated will be used during the current drawing whether you purchase an additional preference point or not. Any accumulated preference points are lost after three years of not applying for a Nonresident Combination License."

Maybe I am missing additional language in the regulations which is certainly possible. Did they point you to the specific rule modification that took place March 1st?

No, prior to 2020, they were good for 2 years (counting the year you bought the point as year 1)
Now in 2020, they are good for 3 years. (again counting the year you buy as year 1)

You are quoting the 2020 regs......my lost point happened prior to 2020. It wasn't 3 years until now. Prior to that it was 2, so my 2018 was lost because I didn't apply in year 1 (2018), and I didn't apply in year 2 (2019).

Here was the verbatim transcript of our call after I was on hold for 34 minutes:

Him: "Hello, Montana FWP"

Me: "Good Morning, I purchased a NR Combo PP in September of 2018, and another one in July of 2019, but when I log into my account it says I only have 1, so I was hoping you all could correct it before I put in for this year."

Him: "No, you only have 1 because you didn't apply last year. You lost the 2018 point when you didn't apply last year. Prior to the new rules that became effective just yesterday, you had to apply for a tag within 2 years or you lost the point. 2018 was year 1, and 2019 was year 2."

Me: "So even though I bought the point in September of 2018 where it was impossible for me to apply for the rest of the year, you still count that as year 1?"

Him: "Yep. With the new law you have 3 years, so your 2019 point is good through the 2021 draw."

Me: "I can buy a point now with the application and I will have two points, right?"

Him: "Right."

Me: "Do you think that will be enough?"

Him: "It should be."

Me: "OK, good luck with all the calls, I know you guys are busy."

Him: "Have a good one."

 

[TonySkyline]

Thanks for posting this... much much appreciated! So it looks like my pref point I bought last year is safe and I can add another this year and try to draw for 2021...


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[Riplip]

Got it. So in essence they change the time to apply from 2 to 3 years in 2020, and you lost your original point. That sucks.

Well if you buy a point this year, you will have two and should draw the general tag. Good luck!

 

[TonySkyline]

So how does a non resident save up enough points to get into the harder to draw units? I’m trying to get into the Missouri River breaks area for elk/mule deer hunt in the future but if my points disappear after a few years it looks impossible?


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[Doc Holliday]

So how does a non resident save up enough points to get into the harder to draw units? I’m trying to get into the Missouri River breaks area for elk/mule deer hunt in the future but if my points disappear after a few years it looks impossible?


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Bonus points. Different from Preference points for the Combo tag (general tag)

If you pull a general tag, then your bonus points go towards a limited entry draw if you want to put in for it. They do not expire.

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[Silveroddo]

Your bonus points won't go away, you can keep buying those and building them until you draw, as you buy them they square.
1=1
2=4
3=9
4=16
etc.
Thats how many chances in the hat you have to be drawn.
In any given limited entry unit non residents can only get up to 10% of the licenses, but they are not guaranteed to draw a total of 10%.

 

[TonySkyline]

Can you just purchase bonus points like you can preference points? When is the cutoff date if so?


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[CNY-Joe]

What’d you use for the “Sponsor ALS #,” your own ALS number?


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I tried and it didn’t work. If you select “No” for party, it should bypass the prompt asking for sponsor als#. In my case when using safari, it didn’t recognize I selected the no option. It wasn’t until i opted to use another browser (chrome) and then it didn’t require a sponsoring als#.... application was then successfully submitted.

 

[fatlander]

I tried and it didn’t work. If you select “No” for party, it should bypass the prompt asking for sponsor als#. In my case when using safari, it didn’t recognize I selected the no option. It wasn’t until i opted to use another browser (chrome) and then it didn’t require a sponsoring als#.... application was then successfully submitted.

No that’s not what my issue was. I tried it both ways.
MT doesn’t have the best system for sure. It’s unnecessarily confusing for most people and their technology is crap.


I talked to FWP today after an hour on hold and they told me that there was a mistake on their end for NR combinations yesterday. It was apparently asking everyone for ALS sponsor that should be required if purchasing a land owner voucher. I haven’t tried again yet.


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[Doc Holliday]

Can you just purchase bonus points like you can preference points? When is the cutoff date if so?


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Yes, if you dont want to put in for the draw, but just want the points, that is from July 1 to Sept 30.

Hunting Licenses & Permits | Montana FWP

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fwp.mt.gov

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