Pennsylvania Deer Camp

[Mr. October]

I think xbows are responsible for the vast majority of the increase. OnX, Gaia and other mapping software is just a digital copy of what we did for years on topo maps. Mark them up, look for terrain features, overlay with aerial photos... I have killed plenty of deer prior to having Gaia, just by picking terrain features on a map and going in. 1st or 2nd hunt... As far as learning, social media like Youtube, FB, etc videos, are the last place I would look to learn abouy bowhunting.

The jump from compound to xbow is less than stick to compound....

Remember the last time you nestled the stock of your compound against your shoulder. Fingers wrapped around the pistol grip. Forestock securely clamped in a tripod. Peer thru the 4x scope with lighted reticle and range preset from built in range finder. Flip the safety off. Send a razor tipped arrow towards a deer. 80 yards away.

Ya, me neither.

Exactly. Tons of people that were not willing to learn to shoot a vertical bow of any sort were more than happy for the ease of the crossbow. And while crossbows still take some practice, it is not nearly has hard to get and remain proficient. I know a couple dozen crossbow hunters that never hunted with a bow. Right or wrong they treat their crossbow like a gun. They get it out at the start of the season, take a few shots, and as long as it hits they are good to go. Should they be practicing more? Absolutely. Just like most guys with their rifles. Yet they don't. And most wind up taking plenty of deer with both of those tools.

OnX, trail cams, etc. have a far more limited effect in suburban/urban areas as well. Generally you don't need either tool to hunt smaller properties.

 

[Mr. October]

Remember looking at your auto ranging illuminated optic, bow completely steady from the front and rear stabilizers, slowly pulling the trigger of your release. Just like shooting a stick bow instinctively without fingers.

There are some outstanding hunters on YouTube. Dan Infalt comes to mind. I am a way better hunter from watching him.

Your old paper topo map doesn't show you real time, where you are, the rub line you marked or the five years of data you plotted on it. It's a huge advantage.

I used a crossbow for the last three years. I tore my shoulder and couldn't pull my bow anymore. I killed 4 deer with it. None of the shots were anything I couldn't have made with my regular bow. Offhand, I can't group as good with the crossbow as I can with my regular bow. It's an advantage, but it's not a rifle.

Honestly stabilizers are pretty meaningless for most hunting scenarios. A vertical bow STILL takes a lot of practice to be proficient.

Again . . I'm not knocking crossbows. People can hunt with whatever is legal but the introduction of crossbows remains the single biggest factor in the huge increase in archery season success.

 

[Yoder]

Exactly. Tons of people that were not willing to learn to shoot a vertical bow of any sort were more than happy for the ease of the crossbow. And while crossbows still take some practice, it is not nearly has hard to get and remain proficient. I know a couple dozen crossbow hunters that never hunted with a bow. Right or wrong they treat their crossbow like a gun. They get it out at the start of the season, take a few shots, and as long as it hits they are good to go. Should they be practicing more? Absolutely. Just like most guys with their rifles. Yet they don't. And most wind up taking plenty of deer with both of those tools.

OnX, trail cams, etc. have a far more limited effect in suburban/urban areas as well. Generally you don't need either tool to hunt smaller properties.

Look at the difference it takes to become efficient with a stick bow vs a compound with a peep, sights and a release. I've shot a bow since I was a toddler. I can shoot my bow a handful of times and be ready to kill deer at 20-30 yards no problem. A stick bow requires shooting several times a week.

 

[Mr. October]

Look at the difference it takes to become efficient with a stick bow vs a compound with a peep, sights and a release. I've shot a bow since I was a toddler. I can shoot my bow a handful of times and be ready to kill deer at 20-30 yards no problem. A stick bow requires shooting several times a week.

Yet thousands felt that compounds were hard enough to learn to shoot that they didn't bother buying an archery license until they could use a crossbow.

 

[Gremcat]

Driving through Allegheny you really see the decline in the Camp tradition. I hunted mostly up in the ADKs from a camp or a residence cabin, someone lived in the latter full time. Wish I could let kids experience camp vs. hunting from the house. Miles of gorge in eye sight and no competition to speak of makes it more a wish than any action taken. The boy hunting with me now tagged his buck in archery as did I. Will get the youngest out late season. Maybe next year we’ll trek up to ADK and I’ll get a Non-Res NY license. A few of the old timers started getting together again I heard.

 

[Gremcat]

On the state regs front, I’ve only been a res for 8 years or so. I just wish they’d stabilize on a set of seasons instead of the yearly relearn/playbook required. Not as complex as some western states but it’s been extremes lately. Extra long bear archery season became 3 days after they added inlines to decrease population now it’s too low but there’s still inlines?! My neighbors watch me and always asking if I’m hunting X day/season. I’d likely not know they changed something but for the neighbors. I usually tag a good buck and have gone 3 for 4 on bears when I started hunting them in archery. Would be 4 for 4 but had an arrow clip a shoulder and blow up on the near side, totally on me. Bear raided my garbage that night as revenge for the skin piercing.

 

[Gremcat]

On crossbows, my 14 yo shoots both compound and a Xbow. I like compounds and would like to learn more traditional but my job has me traveling most weeks of the year. I will give you the concession the learning curve is short on a Xbow. It is similar in range to compound, I don’t shoot an ultra speedy version though. My oldest is over serving in Korea but we hunted NC and archery was too warm for him. My 14 yo wanted to hunt this year and Xbow got him in stand with me. They are clunky though compared to anything Vert limbed. With youngest hunting he’ll start with an Xbow too most likely but if the regs changed I’d go to a vert limbed weapon and not grumble. Early season and late RockLock are great. I don’t do much in rifle here. Wouldn’t be hard to glass across the gorge from a comfortable perch but I have enjoyed early season too much to carry tags into rifle most years beyond the doe tag I try to hold for late traditional.

 

[Gremcat]

Good Luck to anyone hunting late season coming up. I’ve read about some flintlock camps here in PA. That’s an interesting idea too. Flintlock focused hunting camps.

 

[Gremcat]

On the flip side how many people archery hunt purely for the love of archery vs the extra 7+ weeks of hunting season? I started bow hunting at 14 with an old whitetail hunter compound not because I loved bow hunting but because it was the only way for me to hunt deer outside of the 3 day JR season in October or the rifle season at the end of November.

There is a reason the south has a way lower archery harvest than the rest of the country, if you can use rifles for most of the season the only people bow hunting are those that truly like bow hunting. You don’t get the people that just want to hunt more and have to pick up a bow to do so.


Then how do you explain South Dakota’s 30% increase in the same time period when crossbows are limited to rifle season only?

The South, at least NC, has rifle or inline during rut and early archery can be down right awful. I sat in a stand in 104 temp one year. SC it was any weapon Aug through close. Used to be pretty liberal on seasons too. About like some folks run flintlock in regular season there and here. More of a niche that a few stick to over anything else.

One thing you notice in long season states with high populations of deer like NC’s Piedmont region, folks don’t put near as much into pushing for anything in particular for deer hunting. The general thinking is they are more nuisance than game animals. Where in Northern states it’s frowned upon to kill small bucks or does in some groups in the south it’s just another one for the freezer. NC passed a more relaxed depredation process than the pretty liberal one in place while I was there just to cut populations further. You’d get a lot more scorn shooting a wild quail than you would a truck load of does or scrub racks.


If PA opened rifle during the rut I doubt many would run a bow instead. I prefer archery because it’s quieter and I don’t give away some of my hunting spots or spook much game. I wouldn’t advocate a rifle season during rut but my point is people will use what’s most effective given an option. Some suburb type hunting areas would remain unchanged but I bet they’d be the exception.

 

[Gremcat]

We aren't too far from there. Camp is Lake Harmony/Albrightsville.

Jim Thorpe here, house not a camp. I’m up overlooking Glen Onoko Falls, small world. Biggest 8 pt I’ve ever seen I bumped into helping a buddy find his deer in Albrightsville. Ive hunted most of the east coast and this one easily dwarfed any others. He let me get some good video at 10 yards then disappeared.

Last I saw we might get some tracking snow this weekend.

 

[Gremcat]

I’m in PA also as we do our deer camp group the last 3 hunting days and then close up the camp on Sunday until trout season. This was a tough year for our group after losing literally the greatest guy to all of us in camp in February. It was an unexpected tragedy with a tree cutting accident. It just wasn’t the same but everyone was in good spirits. On the last day we all met for the last 3 hours at a nice bonfire in a spot he frequently hunted from. His son spread his ashes and it was sort of a closure for all of us. It’s going to be a long healing process but we all have the wonderful memories.

Lost the guy that taught me to hunt. He also gave me my first 22 at 12 yo and my 7mm in my late teens I’d shot since I was 9 or 10. He owned the ADK camp. My aunt will keep it and his unexpected passing brought some of the now old timers together but he was way too young.

Sorry for your loss. I know it all too well myself. It changes things and the best we can do is carry the memories while we make new ones with the next generation.

 

[Gremcat]

As someone who doesn’t bow hunt I’d be pissed if they dropped the early doe season. That’s one of my favorite seasons to hunt and we have an entire camp tradition based around the last weekend of muzzleloader that started when I was a JR hunter and has been continued for the last 22 years.

That being said based on the massive increase in doe tags over the years as well as the late rifle seasons being introduced I see a bigger chance of that early season either being expanded or going to something like straight wall rifles before it would be removed.

They tend to cut days or tags in any state I’ve hunted long before they cut the additional weapons once they open them. Case in point, bear this year in PA. Cut to days from weeks but kept the special inline season during archery. I think special interests so to speak are vocal enough to keep the state from fully rescinding new weapons seasons once they are open.