Patterning Unpatternable Mountain Deer

[Trial153]

One thing about Mountain whitetail is dont get suckered into all the sign you see in the hollows and bottoms unless they are really big. The look great yet suck to hunt with swirling winds.

 

[SMOKYMTN]

One thing about Mountain whitetail is dont get suckered into all the sign you see in the hollows and bottoms unless they are really big. The look great yet suck to hunt with swirling winds.

Yep. Nearly all sign that I've found in open hardwoods and down in the bottoms are done at night anyway. My trail cams haven't lied about that.

 

[SMOKYMTN]

View attachment 63192
Not sure if this will work, but this is a map I made of the actual buck beds I found in the spot I was talking about in Vermont this year. The red dot at the northern end is where I jumped a giant out of his bed. The other two red dots at the bottom were used while I was there, based on sign, but I didn't see a deer there (I actually found those by accident, thinking the terrain was wrong based on topo).

The blue dots are all the other buck beds I found, but are those that there's no way to pin down the in/out of the buck. Just a flat spot, with some cover, but almost 360 degrees of access. The red dots are those that were right on the edge of dropoffs, but it just doesn't show on the map.

Anyway, first day, with a wind out of the south, the bed at the the red dot at the northern end held a buck, but I didn't know at the time exactly where the bed was. I came up the ridge from the northeast, but jumped him about 100 yards further down the ridge than I was expecting to see a bed. He was actually right where I was thinking about hanging a stand, and neither of us was aware of the other until I was about 20 yards from him.

He took off and I walked right to the bed to figure out why he was there. It was a little bench that stuck out into a dense pine thicket that covered the entire north facing slope in front of him, and that slope is probably 60 degrees or more. Sheer face to the west, that looped in just south of the bed. Only access was straight east, but there was a big blowdown there (which is how I got to within 20 yards without being seen), or southeast, which is where he bolted.

Way more beds that I COULDN"T figure out where to set up, or where they might enter and exit. So I'm lost on a east or west wind in this spot. But if there's a steady Northwest or Southeast wind, I know where I'll be.

It didn't work. Try an image hosting site like IMGUR.COM and then post the link. I'd love to see it to gain context!

 

[LateRiser]

I edited the post - image should be there now.

 

[SMOKYMTN]

Anyway, first day, with a wind out of the south, the bed at the the red dot at the northern end held a buck, but I didn't know at the time exactly where the bed was. I came up the ridge from the northeast, but jumped him about 100 yards further down the ridge than I was expecting to see a bed. He was actually right where I was thinking about hanging a stand, and neither of us was aware of the other until I was about 20 yards from him.

He took off and I walked right to the bed to figure out why he was there. It was a little bench that stuck out into a dense pine thicket that covered the entire north facing slope in front of him, and that slope is probably 60 degrees or more. Sheer face to the west, that looped in just south of the bed. Only access was straight east, but there was a big blowdown there (which is how I got to within 20 yards without being seen), or southeast, which is where he bolted.

That's very typical of how I would expect a buck to bed with that wind. Just on the leeward side of a ridge where the wind will carry the scent of what's coming behind him but the thermal would carry what's coming up below him. You came in under the perfect storm from the NE side where neither wind nor thermal gave him any inclination that you were there until you were on top of him.

What I didn't expect is that said buck was facing a dense thicket. To me that would be hard to see into thus leaving him solely his nose to keep him alive. Maybe that was improvisation on his part. Does your prevailing wind normally come out of the south?

 

[LateRiser]

The thicket to the north does block any view, but it is more northeast. He had a perfect view of that saddle to the north, and could see for a ways all the way to directly down the ridge line to the southwest.

It was no accident I came up to him the way I did - just as you said, I knew there had to be a buck there based on the wind (southeast that day), and I was very careful to dip behind that saddle to sneak up the northeast edge of that ridge, assuming a buck would be looking over it. I screwed up because he was lower than I thought he'd be - a good 100 yards below the typical 2/3 elevation. I was planning to set up right where the two lines cross to the southeast of that bed, on a well-used trail. The day before, with the same wind, I hung my stand about halfway between the red and blue beds to the west and east, and saw nothing. So I was pushing it a bit, trying to get a little closer to the steep hillside I knew they liked. I got a little too aggressive, but only had one more day there at the time.

And no - if there is a prevailing wind it's north or west. But this place is halfway up a larger mountain to the north, and the valley drops another 1000 feet or so over the 3/4 of a mile south to a river, with a mirror ridge on one side to the west, and another to the east. So very often, especially in the mornings, the thermals will come up the valley from the south. As with most places with terrain like this, the wind is really tricky, but I'm always surprised at how much the currents move north in the morning and south in the evening, regardless of overall wind direction any given day.

Edit: just realized I said it as the first day when I busted him in prior posts - it was the first morning. I hunted the evening the day before in the spot a little further west.

 

[flinginairos]

I hunt the mountains of WV and use the Dan Infalt theory on finding bedding areas and focus mainly on those. Like it's been said on here the hard part is figuring out when they use the beds. There are so many variables that no two areas are the same. In the spots I hunt I focus on mountain laurel or small clear cuts that sit at the right elevation on a leeward ridge. I scout my butt off in early spring and try to find as many areas as I can because a lot of spots there are no way to hunt them without busting the deer out. This has worked extremely well for me and I have killed 6 mature bucks in the last four years. I normally enter from the bottom and climb up with the wind in my face coming down the mountain and setup on the transition areas like laurel to hard woods, clear cut to hardwoods etc. In the main area I hunt I have six spots like this and I run cameras in the summer very close to each stand location to see which bedding areas are holding the most deer. It seems like when I find the right area there could be up to six bucks using one small area in the early season. My goal is to kill one the first week of October because the later you get into October it starts to get a little harder pinpointing where they will be. I guess i'm kind of rambling but really my method is pretty simple. Scout my butt off to find the best bedding areas and devise a way to sneak in as close as I can. I hunt each spot once on the right wind and see what happens. If I feel I need to sit it again I will. If not I move onto the next. Many times I kill the very first sit OR I observe them and move in the next sit and kill. Very fun way to hunt!!

 

[mtluckydan]

Right out of the gate, if you are trying to hunt mature deer outside of the rut it is going to be difficult. Especially so with total relief of 500 feet if I understood correctly. If rifle season is during the rut I would concentrate on the week before rifle if bow is open.

I am primarily a still hunter but have done a lot of tree stand hunting prior to living in Montana. Also, hunted in some really low deer density areas, as well as high pressure areas. Still hunting will work in all those areas, even with a bow if you are good.

On any given block of country there will be one or more locations where every traveling deer will pass through. Even relatively flat country. Finding those locations is key and if you get snow that's the best time to find the spot.

If you are seeing much more concentrated poop in the winter there may be better food sources elsewhere during the fall and more deer move into your area during the winter. You might need to move also.

Buck beds will almost always be scattered and every buck will have different preferences. I would forget trying to figure out bedding areas from your description and focus on transition areas where bucks hang out trying to cross paths with feeding does. They will almost always be in good cover and not in the open. Bucks will either show up there prior to dark to try & pick up a doe or cruise through after daylight to hit a good smelling track. There will usually be scrapes & rubs because bucks hang out there.

If you can find a spot like described earlier where deer cross through from multiple directions even better. Hang a stand & wait. Keep in mind that traveling bucks move perpendicular to doe trails unless they hook up with a doe. They want to cross as many doe trails as possible as efficiently as possible. If you have low deer densities & more older bucks, those deer may spend more time out of your area when getting ready for rut. Low densities mean low odds if you're sitting. That's why I move. Odds go way up the more deer you contact. You also need more area with that style of hunting.

Mature deer just won't move much during legal hours outside the rut both for safety & conserving energy for the rut. The widespread food choices you described compound the problem. Hope this helps. Knowing your ground completely is your most effective strategy.



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[GodsCountry]

I hunt the mountains of WV and use the Dan Infalt theory on finding bedding areas and focus mainly on those. Like it's been said on here the hard part is figuring out when they use the beds. There are so many variables that no two areas are the same. In the spots I hunt I focus on mountain laurel or small clear cuts that sit at the right elevation on a leeward ridge. I scout my butt off in early spring and try to find as many areas as I can because a lot of spots there are no way to hunt them without busting the deer out. This has worked extremely well for me and I have killed 6 mature bucks in the last four years. I normally enter from the bottom and climb up with the wind in my face coming down the mountain and setup on the transition areas like laurel to hard woods, clear cut to hardwoods etc. In the main area I hunt I have six spots like this and I run cameras in the summer very close to each stand location to see which bedding areas are holding the most deer. It seems like when I find the right area there could be up to six bucks using one small area in the early season. My goal is to kill one the first week of October because the later you get into October it starts to get a little harder pinpointing where they will be. I guess i'm kind of rambling but really my method is pretty simple. Scout my butt off to find the best bedding areas and devise a way to sneak in as close as I can. I hunt each spot once on the right wind and see what happens. If I feel I need to sit it again I will. If not I move onto the next. Many times I kill the very first sit OR I observe them and move in the next sit and kill. Very fun way to hunt!!

What sort of clear cuts are you hunting? How old? Some people have 10 year old hardwood growth, some have 2 year old briar clearcuts.

 

[GodsCountry]

Right out of the gate, if you are trying to hunt mature deer outside of the rut it is going to be difficult. Especially so with total relief of 500 feet if I understood correctly. If rifle season is during the rut I would concentrate on the week before rifle if bow is open.

I am primarily a still hunter but have done a lot of tree stand hunting prior to living in Montana. Also, hunted in some really low deer density areas, as well as high pressure areas. Still hunting will work in all those areas, even with a bow if you are good.

On any given block of country there will be one or more locations where every traveling deer will pass through. Even relatively flat country. Finding those locations is key and if you get snow that's the best time to find the spot.

If you are seeing much more concentrated poop in the winter there may be better food sources elsewhere during the fall and more deer move into your area during the winter. You might need to move also.

Buck beds will almost always be scattered and every buck will have different preferences. I would forget trying to figure out bedding areas from your description and focus on transition areas where bucks hang out trying to cross paths with feeding does. They will almost always be in good cover and not in the open. Bucks will either show up there prior to dark to try & pick up a doe or cruise through after daylight to hit a good smelling track. There will usually be scrapes & rubs because bucks hang out there.

If you can find a spot like described earlier where deer cross through from multiple directions even better. Hang a stand & wait. Keep in mind that traveling bucks move perpendicular to doe trails unless they hook up with a doe. They want to cross as many doe trails as possible as efficiently as possible. If you have low deer densities & more older bucks, those deer may spend more time out of your area when getting ready for rut. Low densities mean low odds if you're sitting. That's why I move. Odds go way up the more deer you contact. You also need more area with that style of hunting.

Mature deer just won't move much during legal hours outside the rut both for safety & conserving energy for the rut. The widespread food choices you described compound the problem. Hope this helps. Knowing your ground completely is your most effective strategy.



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I have no doubt still that hunting is a good method. I’ve found that September-October, I saw more deer walking to and from my stand locations. Far more. If I had a scattergun, I could have killed any of them by just taking a slow still in the woods. I’m not there with a bow.

My interest has really been spiked by the Whitetail Adrenaline guys way of hunting. I’m not in Kansas, but I like the idea of bringing the fight to the deer.

Also, I’m eagerly waiting my next snow, so I can find that killer travel lane.

 

[flinginairos]

What sort of clear cuts are you hunting? How old? Some people have 10 year old hardwood growth, some have 2 year old briar clearcuts.

It seems I have my best luck on cuts that are 10 years old or so. Ones that have a mixture of thick brush and saplings/small pines. I’ve had luck in younger ones too but they don’t seem to hold many deer after the summer growth dies off.


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