Packs in the rain

[RockChucker30]

XPac is NOT waterproof.

To clear this up, X-Pac IS waterproof. Most of the X-Pac fabrics we use are rated to 160 to 200 psi water resistance, meaning that most pressure washers can't force water through the laminate.

Stitch holes, cordura, wicking webbing, etc, are NOT waterproof and can allow water to penetrate through seams. Good seam sealing technique solves this for most users. In extreme uses like packrafting, drybags for critical gear are a good idea.

 

[grappling_hook]

Looking at rain covers and dry bags. Any recommendations on dry bags? Should I get a couple smaller ones or try and get one big dry bag for the pack?

I live in a very wet area, and when backpacking, I use several small bags in different colors to organize my pack contents. One bag for my kitchen stuff, one bag for my emergency kit, one bag for water kit, etc. Bigger items like tent and sleeping bag are put in plastic garbage bags or dry bags inside the backpack (and I usually put an inflatable pillow and sleeping pad in with my sleeping bag).

As far as the KUIU Pro 6000, it works great with my setup; I prefer not to have a waterproof backpack for most uses (I’ve never tried a rain cover but would like to give it a go sometime).

One note on DWR— they literally don’t make it like they used to due to environmental regulations— C8 fluorocarbon is no longer allowed. So the same brands of DWRs (both applied by manufacturer fabrics and in sprays sold to consumers) that worked great 10 years ago are no longer in the same class of water resistance or durability as they used to be, and they don’t reapply very easily, either. They should probably be renamed Temporary Water Resistant.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Why rely on a single line of defense?

Layer 1: Rain cover
Layer 2: DWR-treated and/or waterproof pack
Layer 3: Contractor trash bag for main body of pack
Layer 4: Waterproof bags for sensitive items such as electronics and sleeping bag)

 

[manitou1]

Yeah, I believe the only packs that will keep all.contents dry during extended wet conditions are the packs left at home, lol.
Waterproof storage bags... even gallon ziplocks can work in a pinch, then a pack cover.

 

[RockChucker30]

Why rely on a single line of defense?

Weight & Simplicity are big concerns.

This year on our caribou hunt we were in driven rain for the first couple days, with winds of 20-30 mph. My spectra pack that was seam sealed had a tiny amount of water seep in, not enough to cause any issues.

Pack Covers are more "access preventers" than they are helpful IMO.

Years ago I was on the AT in May and met a guy in the rain. His oversized pack cover had filled up with water at the bottom and was slapping him in the butt on each step.

 

[Where's Bruce?]

When I use a 55L dry bag and cargo panel...I have zero worries.



Sometimes I line my bag with a trashcan and/or put a cover on it. No problems yet.

 

[Tradchef]

I got stuck in an all day soaker this summer. It was a 9 mile in and the same out. I had my reckoning with me that day. I just put all of my stuff in my OR 35l dry sack and it stayed good. I have got a rain cover since then just in case.

 

[Or.hunter]

Amazon rain cover. Works great for my K3 3200.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Weight & Simplicity are big concerns.

This year on our caribou hunt we were in driven rain for the first couple days, with winds of 20-30 mph. My spectra pack that was seam sealed had a tiny amount of water seep in, not enough to cause any issues.

Pack Covers are more "access preventers" than they are helpful IMO.

Years ago I was on the AT in May and met a guy in the rain. His oversized pack cover had filled up with water at the bottom and was slapping him in the butt on each step.

Dry bags are light and work well; but the weight can add up to a handful of ounces. That additional weight may be too much for some people to handle.

A contractor’s bag is about 4 ounces. It’s cheap and effective. This weight may be too much for some people to handle.

DWR coatings and other waterproofing may or may not work. If the bag wets out, the net weight increase will likely be heavier than most other solutions. Some solutions may well be worth the cost for some folks while gross overkill for other folks.

Bag covers can work well. Some are better designs than others; love the hood on the OR cover. Unsure why your friend had so many issues. My Kuiu cover has held up well.

Folks can run what makes the most sense for them. There is no single solution that is perfect for every hunting scenario for all individuals.

 

[alpine_troop]

Why rely on a single line of defense?

Layer 1: Rain cover
Layer 2: DWR-treated and/or waterproof pack
Layer 3: Contractor trash bag for main body of pack
Layer 4: Waterproof bags for sensitive items such as electronics and sleeping bag)

Yup. And choose as many layers of protection as the trip and weather warrant. I’ve had good luck with a rain cover, dry bag compression sack for sleeping bag, then 50ish liter sil-nylon dry bag to line the rest of the pack. Or a contractor grade garbage bag.

 

[Kevin_t]

I've never had any problem with our XPAC or Spectra Pack bags in several years of worth of use , and I have never seam sealed them. I did flip a raft in the Arctic and a little water got in ..but not much and occasionally I have had dampness. I generally , but my bag in a stuff sack .. not even a dry bag .. the stuff sack provides some level protection as well. On rare occasions Ive stuffed stuff in a light garbage bag and twisted it .

Now as far as Cordura or similar fabrics .. Ive had stuff get wet .. real wet inside , and I have had packs gain ounces and maybe pounds.

IMO, XPAC, Spectra and similar work more than well enough for me when combined with a small amount of common sense to not loose a lot of sleep or add a lot of additional weight . No need to make it more complicated than it needs be.

 

[trophyhill]

Agree with a cover. If there is a chance of rain, I roll my rain gear up in the pack cover so it’s all together and easy to access

 

[alpine_troop]

Agree with a cover. If there is a chance of rain, I roll my rain gear up in the pack cover so it’s all together and easy to access

I think I like that method!

 

[ghost338]

I also suggest the multiple lines of defense if the situation warrants. I hunt the PNW (rainforest) that has potential to rain big drops for days. I use a waterproof pack cover on the outside and waterproof compression sacks for essentials on the inside. I've been happy with the OR brand sacks, like someone posted previously. Weight penalty is measured in ounces, not pounds. As for pack brand/material, I chose the pack design I liked with the features I wanted for my style over the material. Personally I don't see a lot of benefit to use a pack you don't like/prefer just because it's a waterproof material.

 

[Venom One]

Zach's pack review has a section where he tests the water resistance of many of the popular packs (link below). They all leak, it's just a matter of severity which is why everyone is recommending a cover and/or dry bag.

 

[roosiebull]

Only problem w a rain cover is I’m also using the pack for whitetail and I attach my saddle and climbing sticks to the pack so a rain cover won’t work. Sounds like best option is rain cover for elk hunts and some dry bags inside for the whitetail hunts

dry bags or a pack with an x pac bag (seek outside, and kifaru has some x pac options)

 

[roosiebull]

To clear this up, X-Pac IS waterproof. Most of the X-Pac fabrics we use are rated to 160 to 200 psi water resistance, meaning that most pressure washers can't force water through the laminate.

Stitch holes, cordura, wicking webbing, etc, are NOT waterproof and can allow water to penetrate through seams. Good seam sealing technique solves this for most users. In extreme uses like packrafting, drybags for critical gear are a good idea.

grommets in the bottom of the bag is the best solution for x pac IMO unless it's for pack rafting

 

[JR Greenhorn]

I'm in MN, where canoe tripping is the norm. Packs sit in the bilge water in the bottom of the canoe, sometimes for hours, so water has plenty of time to seep in. I have a year-old Seek Outside pack, and I've gotten water inside it several times that way (to be fair, I haven't seam sealed it, and someday I'll order another one without the zipper).

What has worked by far the best in our group over 10 years of trips is Spacesaver brand travel bags (you can find them on Amazon). Put your folded clothes in, sit on the bag, and zip it shut. Nice and flat to slide into the pack. Way more reliable than Zip Lock bags (I'm done with those). Guys in my group have done dry bags and contactor bags also, but over time everyone switches to Spacesaver. We even use one to pack out our garbage, with no fear of leaks inside the pack.


One exception is sleeping bags. Buy a Sea to Summit eVent compression dry sack for those. They float and survive temporary submersion (we've tested!). No matter what happens or what the weather brings, you have the literal life-saving peace of mind of a dry sleeping bag. One trip, that was the only thing dry among all my gear when days of rain changed to snow. Buy as small a size as you can, to avoid it compressing down to a ball shape.


To the comment above about 4 oz, that's actually a quarter pound. If you eliminate 4 things like that, you save a pound. That's how pack weight is reduced. Until you've gone through the exercise for yourself it sounds crazy, but 8 things that weigh 2 oz are a pound. You start looking at knives, containers, wallet, car keys, clips and caribiners, and it's pretty easy to eliminate a pound or 2 of pack weight of stuff that weighs 2-3 oz.

In that same line of thought, there probably isn't that much in your pack that really needs to be protected from water, and eliminating those extras bags can save more weight than you'd think.

 

[Centralcoastca]

In my experience, every single pack leaks. Dry bags/and or rain cover for stuff you want dry

 

[mlgc20]

All of our fabrics do well in the rain. The XPAC , is most waterproof, but in Alaska 3 of us had SpectraGrid packs and zippers .. and we had about 40 hours of rain with no issues.

I have a custom 4800 from SO in Xpac. I took it out for a week in Yellowstone. It saw a ton of driving rain. Literally only a few drops of moisture got in through the full length zipper over the course of the week. While I wouldn't submerge it. I would call it functionally waterproof. My clothes and down quilt were in dry bags. But, they would have not been affected either way. I was pleasantly surprised how well it did with constant rain.