Old guys: How has beetle kill changed your hunting?

[Chris in TN]

I almost put this in the elk forum but it has just as much implication for mule deer and bear and likely some other stuff (grouse and hares at least).

I only very vaguely remember seeing western forests before beetle kill became a thing. Looking over the aerials of places we want to try to hunt next month, if you look back at the historic imagery on Google Earth, some of these places were largely unbroken blocks of mature forest and now they look very, very open.

I'm aware that most of what looks 'open' on aerials is likely very thick on the ground and easily capable of hiding deer for days and elk probably hide in it pretty well too. I've seen mule deer several times (while hunting elk) that seemed to live all day every day in places where the aerials look like a slightly thick cow pasture - but in reality the brush is dense and visibility is limited unless you can get high and look down into it. I'm also aware that what looks 'open' on aerials from a year or three ago, will likely be brushier every year. But I'm curious as to how you guys that get to hunt such places every year, have seen them change. Do you sit and glass places now that you used to still-hunt? Do you see deer living in former forests now because there's now browse everywhere across places that used to be tall mature timber without much understory browse? Do you see wallow spots that no longer are wet enough to be wallows because there's so much more sunlight that maybe what used to be a seep or spring is now just a tiny damp spot? More hares where there used to just be squirrels?I'm assuming the blue grouse populations have declined as stands of timber have died out?

Do the burn areas seem to burn hotter and take longer to recover now?

 

[taskswap]

Define "old" LOL. Here's one answer from a 50-yr-old.

It's a thing to deal with but not a deal breaker. Elk have always loved heavy timber and blowdown and this makes for plenty of that, at least when they're hiding out. I've always glassed before still hunting and this didn't change that at all. I think a lot of your other points are small impacts, like changing how they make and use wallows. I wouldn't say this is the driving factor for that.

Honestly, one thing you didn't mention that's changed is you sure have to be careful where you pitch a tent. Avoiding fall-paths for these trees can sometimes require more hunting around to find safe (and still usable) spots, if you're in the thicker stuff.

 

[survivalistd]

Being old made it easier to make a cane???

 

[Pony Soldier]

Beetle kill blocks in mature timber (lodgepole) is not on the ground. Is waist high to neck high. Nothing can walk through it. Travel paths have been totally abandoned by the elk, etc. After ten years we are starting to development of travel patterns. As I cut out trails the elk move onto them within days. Most of what I cut are on old old elk paths that they were forced to abandon. Major migration paths of the last hundred years have been changed to abandoned. It's been tough to adapt to the mess that is left.

Get over your imagination. You don't have the strength to get across those blow down zones.

 

[cnelk]

61 here - Ive quit hunting some spots due to beetle kill deadfall - elk seem avoid it too.

When necessary, I try to find elk trails that weave thru beetle kill blowdowns.

Ive found that elk have really changed their previous routes when deadfall is horrendous

 

[AZ Gator]

Sorry, I’m ignorant to this. What is “beetle kill” / “beetle kill blocks”?

 

[MuleyFever]

Sorry, I’m ignorant to this. What is “beetle kill” / “beetle kill blocks”?

Google Search

 

[Weldor]

64 yeap changed a lot. Worse yet is the FS has devastated some area's with Maserater's miles and miles. All the cover is gone ,void of critters except cattle.

 

[Weldor]

Forgot, don't want to be in the lodgepoles (beetle kill) during a wind storm, that's for sure and certain.

 

[Chris in TN]

Get over your imagination. You don't have the strength to get across those blow down zones.

Yeah, there's no way I'd try what your picture shows. The area we're headed to seems to have some very localized 'thick spots' like that but overall I think past fires and the passage of time have mitigated it somewhat.

I've been within a few miles of this area, within the last few years, and what I saw then, that looks identical on the aerials, wasn't nearly as bad as what you're showing. To be clear, I'm not saying no such spots exist, just that overall I think the worst of them are at least reasonably avoidable. I'm looking at a spot on the aerials right now where there's several acres that look like matchsticks then a several acre spot a couple hundred yards away with almost zero downed timber. Of course I'm sure that cleaner spot is probably dying too, and will look worse at some point.

 

[Chris in TN]

Forgot, don't want to be in the lodgepoles (beetle kill) during a wind storm, that's for sure and certain.

I have put a lot of thought into what I'll be looking for in a campsite, whether it's miles deep or the side of the road. I don't want to have a tree fall on us.

 

[Chris in TN]

61 here - Ive quit hunting some spots due to beetle kill deadfall - elk seem avoid it too.

When necessary, I try to find elk trails that weave thru beetle kill blowdowns.

Ive found that elk have really changed their previous routes when deadfall is horrendous

That has to stink. If the elk can't use it, it's essentially lost habitat, and then you have to go learn new spots.

Here in the east we have lost almost all of our Green Ash due to the Emerald Ash Borer. It wasn't a terribly important tree from a deer/turkey standpoint but they were everywhere. It made the woods hard to navigate for a few years, and dangerous for a few years, but most of them have fell now. As a bonus, huge swaths of timber now have developed thicker understory browse where the ash canopies used to be. It honestly probably ended up being a net habitat improvement for deer.

 

[Poser]

Yeah, there's no way I'd try what your picture shows. The area we're headed to seems to have some very localized 'thick spots' like that but overall I think past fires and the passage of time have mitigated it somewhat.

I've been within a few miles of this area, within the last few years, and what I saw then, that looks identical on the aerials, wasn't nearly as bad as what you're showing. To be clear, I'm not saying no such spots exist, just that overall I think the worst of them are at least reasonably avoidable. I'm looking at a spot on the aerials right now where there's several acres that look like matchsticks then a several acre spot a couple hundred yards away with almost zero downed timber. Of course I'm sure that cleaner spot is probably dying too, and will look worse at some point.

In Southern Colorado at least, I think that there has been frequent enough beetle infestations combined with fires over the last ~50 years that you don't intend to encounter large swaths of blowdown that look like that pic where every tree is dead and has fallen. Thick blow down that is a PITA to deal with? absolutely. Impassable? Only exists in pockets that have been subject to localized wind events.

I do have an area I like to hunt where the earth is really shallow on top of granite, much of which is exposed. As a result, trees reach a certain size and then inevitably uproot, usually taking 2-4 other trees with them when they do. It is a total PITA to get around and rather loud due to the exposed rock. Nobody else that I have seen hunts the area because it sucks so bad dealing with the blwodown, but the elk and deer love it.

 

[Muttman]

where i hunt in northern utah - Uintah mountains - the beetle kill on the west slope is ridicoulsy crazy - i'm starting to notice the deer are not using the timber patches as much, too much blow down, ive seen 50-100yd patches where the winds have knocked down hundreds of beetle killed trees causing making navigating thru there pretty much impossible. ive seen deer bedding on the edges but not seeing trails or tracks threw them like i used to. when i do find elk they seem to navigate thru these areas better, and will make new trails thru.
plus still hunting thru a beetle kill blow down area is torturous on your body and clothing. have torn a many pairs of pants or jackets. lots of tripping hazards and if not careful you could catch your foot on a blowdown and fall into a broken branch and hurt yourself badly. almost put a branch thru my eye recently.

really sad to see

just my .02 tho.

happy hunting >>>>>>>>>>>>>------------------------->

 

[KHNC]

I wont ever apply for a S region elk tag in Wyoming again. Im done with all the beetle kill. This is despite having very good success rate when hunting elk in those areas.

 

[wytx]

We hunt a lot of blow down areas, still plenty of elk. They make trails through the thick stuff.
Usually there is a path around or a faint game trail through heavy blowdown.
Wallows, just need the moisture to keep them active.
Good fires are a blessing for elk and other game.

Yep at 62 it's not easy but doable. Hit the gym and work those abductor and adductors with your quads.

 

[TaperPin]

It’s not like beetles were just invented, but 100 years of putting out fires and leaving continuous stands of timber have given them an easy way to multiply and move. Forests that were just starting to be beetle killed when I was a kid are growing back. Once the red needles fall off, the forest floor really grows a lot and provides a lot more food so animals go into the winter better off, but it has made traditionally good elk areas harder to hunt since there’s more to eat everywhere.

There’s always a lot of debate over what to do with standing dead trees, but most of the areas in Wyoming aren’t worth enough to salvage them for lumber, but it’s sure easy to find firewood.

Once enough time has passed and roots are rotten, it’s creepy to hear so many dead trees falling over in the middle of the night. It definitely pays to look up and all around before picking a camp site.

In 100 years all the dead trees will be flat on the ground mostly rotten and another continuous stand of pine trees will be about the right diameter for another wave of beetles to wipe it out.

 

[AZ8]

56. I avoid severe blowdown, it just flat wears me down. 100 yards feels like a mile. Too many other places that hold elk.

 

[cnelk]

This pic of me is a few years old and this particular area has burned since then, but there are many, many more areas just like this that haven’t burned

 

[Chris in TN]

where i hunt in northern utah - Uintah mountains - the beetle kill on the west slope is ridicoulsy crazy - i'm starting to notice the deer are not using the timber patches as much, too much blow down, ive seen 50-100yd patches where the winds have knocked down hundreds of beetle killed trees causing making navigating thru there pretty much impossible. ive seen deer bedding on the edges but not seeing trails or tracks threw them like i used to. when i do find elk they seem to navigate thru these areas better, and will make new trails thru.
plus still hunting thru a beetle kill blow down area is torturous on your body and clothing. have torn a many pairs of pants or jackets. lots of tripping hazards and if not careful you could catch your foot on a blowdown and fall into a broken branch and hurt yourself badly. almost put a branch thru my eye recently.

really sad to see

just my .02 tho.

happy hunting >>>>>>>>>>>>>------------------------->

We drove through that area a few years ago and it was mid-October, pretty much peak colors, and it was absolutely stunning to see.

This pic of me is a few years old and this particular area has burned since then, but there are many, many more areas just like this that haven’t burned


View attachment 943431

Yikes.

Yeah, I'm hoping to avoid anything that bad.