Newer shooter with questions

[Pinchecharlie]

Hey all, trying to decide on a rifle and have questions. Iam a newer hunter/shooter and I’d like to learn to shoot further distances for target practice and to become a better hunter. I’d like to eventually try a nrl match also (looks fun) . I’ve been using my only rifle a .270 and I’ve been successful hunting but it’s a bit much for me to say it’s a “pleasure” to shoot. I actually have a flinch that may be a problem. So I’ve been wanting something that’s less recoil and maybe considered accurate that I could learn with and still hunt deer and antelope. I’ve had it in my head so much now iam lost and unfortunately I can’t buy two or three rifles at the moment and have a happy wife. I have a tikka t3 now I bought off classifieds a few years ago for next to nothing lol. I thought I’d use the action and do a do but now I think I should do something else. I have a good budget but was raised to be frugal lol.
So I’d like to learn to shoot to 500 under an inch moa (or be very consistent lol) . I set a goal of shooting a hundred rounds a week. I have all the equipment to reload but have never done it it Iam looking forward to it. I’d like to maybe someday try a nrl hunter event just for fun. I’d like to shoot an antelope or mulley with it just so I don’t feel stupid for spending a lot on a target rifle. I had originally wanted a 22 creedmore. Then I wanted a 6mm creedmore then a 6.5x47 lapua and then a 25 creedmore then a 7mm prcw. Then a 6.5 prc so no would accidentally see a big bull when iam out east lol. I wanted all of these because I knew jack shit and cool kids buy them it would appear. I do actually want a rifle that doesn’t kick to bad.
I could with no problem and enthusiasm do a custom action build or I could do a rebarrell style too. I allways feel a bit dumb buying a 1000 dollar rifle just to discard most of it. I d rather not do a cheap rifle just to be cheap though . I’ve researched coup de grace and some after market tikka actions as well as the upper end but didn’t consider the most expensive. I’d do something like that though? I’d also be willing to do a “system “ where I had a chassis that could do double duty? Open to what others who know do.
I can say that I’ve never seen one of my shots land but usually see blue sky lol. I’ve only killed a few deer and a couple antelope and three elk (only one bull lol) in my entire life so iam pretty green. Even more embarrassing I started hunting a few years ago at 53 so iam old too. Yeah embarrassing but at least iam honest lol! So if you felt this way what caliber and cartridge would you consider? If you have patience please state barrel length and twist because I don’t really understand that just yet. I also understand I need a good scope and iam willing to spend on it also. Sorry for the long post thanks if you care to reply.

 

[Ajsomp]

lots to take in here. If you want to get better at shooting long range, take a class from vetted instructors. Some will let you rent equipment. Get yourself a rifle you will train a lot with for cheap (tikka 223). Get a main rifle you actually like shooting (6.5 creed or similar).

If you’re looking for suggestions- here’s what you should go buy -
Tikka t3x in 6.5 creedmoor with Swfa 3-9 scope (still on sale today btw)
Tikka t3x in 223 with Swfa 3-9 scope

Buy (or load) lots of ammo and go shoot. The rest is noise. A lot of threads here to search through but focus on the ones with training tips. Nothing magical behind long range these days - just need to get out there.

 

[Pinchecharlie]

Yeah sorry for the long winded post. I d like the next level of tikka t3 if I could. I like my rifle and it’s perfect for the mountains and it works good but it feels cheap and the stock is wonky. I’d just like to experience a nice rifle just once even if it’s wasteful a little. Maybe if I lose interest I’ll buy a 6.5 tikka and put it in a chassis or stock just to say I did . I can’t find the other rifles chambered in anything reasonable locally but I’ll keep looking. If anyone knows a firearms instructor in the Bozeman mt area let me know. A quick search and all I found where some very expensive at-style training programs. I just need fundamentals not tactical or past 1000 sniper stuff lol’ thanks for the reply. I also enjoy just talking about stuff with people so I appreciate you helping.

 

[35WhelenAI]

Yeah that's a lot to unpack. For some background, did you begin shooting with a rimfire or small bore like a .223 or .243 and then developed the flinch with the .270 Win as you moved up after trigger time with the smaller cartridge rifles?

Shooting well at any range with rifles is not going to do anything for your hunting skill per se. Those two are separate things although there could be an opinion or experience that shows shooting the rifle and hunting (finding/locating game to be in position for said shooting of the rifle) have some overlap, so I don't want to say never.

You didn't mention removing the .270 from your repertoire, don't. You need trigger time with a lighter recoiling rifle/cartridge. The .270 is not a heavy recoiling rifle or one most folks consider flinch inducing unless introduced to it in a way that put you in a bad spot to learn from the get-go.

With your desire to reload, its easily within your ability to load reduced recoil rounds for the .270, get the right practice and use the .270 easily and confidently.

With that said, no flies on getting another rifle but I don't know that is the answer.

Things need to get unwrapped and peeled back to find the root cause of how a .270 Winchester has caused a flinch to the extent you are considering a complete retool.

 

[codym]

Do a zermatt origin action. They are the cheapest most feature packed action out there. Do a 6 dasher prefit. It will be low recoil, highly accurate, incredibly easy to load for, long barrel life and more than capable of taking deer and antelope at any reasonable range. For whatever reason you choose not to do the dasher go 6.5x47. Both of these are ridiculously easy to load for. I would then get a trigger tech trigger and an xlr element chassis. That system will serve you well for hunting, add a few weights for comps. Then shoot shoot and shoot

 

[TaperPin]

The 270 is a great hunting cartridge but no fun to practice with to get over that flinch. I see a used 243 for $250 every once in a while and it’s the cartridge everyone around me shoots for practice. I used to pull the scope off my 270 and put it on the 243 for most of the year until hunting season.

 

[TaperPin]

If you reload, making up 270 reduced loads with no more recoil than a 243 is a piece of cake.

 

[35WhelenAI]

If you reload, making up 270 reduced loads with no more recoil than a 243 is a piece of cake.

Yep, just what I was saying in post #4. The cart is in front of the horse with everything I've read so far. There's an issue that has reared its head and the root cause needs to be found out and worked through.

 

[Tahoe1305]

Concur that if you want to shoot, you want none of what you listed.

6.5C or less is what I would go for. If you don’t want to reload then 223 is cheapest way to shoot a lot. Anything more recoil sucks a bit.

If NRL is on the list. Really between 25 creedmoor and 6.5C because of power factor.

You “could” use your 270 though for that and use the whatever else tikka as a trainer.

 

[Pinchecharlie]

Well my only rifle EVER is the .270 tikka t3 I have now. Iam not completely afraid of it but when I see good shooters on you tube they are able to see their shots and I can’t. It’s a big boom to me . I know that’s probably just cause iam a baby but I just thought I should try a smaller rifle for target practice to get the fundamentals down and so I wasn’t expecting such a big boom. My friend let me shot his 6.5 x 284 that was suppressed and it was better and this year he shot his deer with a suppressed 220 swift and it was like he didn’t even shoot a rifle at all lol, he’s a great marksman and he told me to maybe get a 22 creedmore. I just thought maybe i should buy a little bit bigger caliber just because I felt guilty buying a rifle that was just a toy. You know? Iam not going to be able to have a safe full of rifles unfortunately because my wife isn’t very sympathetic to the cause. That’s why I was wondering if I could meet in the middle. A 6.5 creedmore is everywhere and I thought guys made fun of them for being vanilla? I bought a 6.5 prc but my buddies dad wanted it and I never shot it lol. I dunno? Iam going to try and find shooting lessons and after I missed a deer last year under 200 (yes I know that’s bad) i bought a snap cap and I dry fired my rifle nine million times last winter. Unfortunately I got ran over by a truck in an accident and iam recovering from shoulder surgery now. I went hunting a few times but I couldn’t carry a pack so just did truck hunts. I got a small buck at 137 yards and it was great shot but of course easy . I won’t lie a 300 and over shot for me is long. So I watch guys and I thought if I had a small caliber going fast maybe I could master shooting to 300-500 and then up the caliber maybe. I will keep my 270 but it’s pretty basic. I don’t think anyone would consider it nice. Iam going to buy a suppressor for it just because it’s so much nicer to shoot. I said I might have a flinch because a guy at the range said I was ? Sometimes I am not surprised by it firing so I thought maybe he was right. Iam not afraid of it though just kinda cringing cause I k ke it’s gonna jump and be so f’n loud lol

 

[Caseknife]

You do wear ear protection when you shoot don't you? Does your rifle have a muzzle break causing more muzzle blast? 6CM would be a very viable cartridge, not a toy and quite a bit less recoil than the 270. Is .22 caliber legal for hunting in the state you live, if so, get a 223, 22-250, 22 ARC or something like that, all very lethal.

 

[35WhelenAI]

I really appreciate your sharing without holding back on the things that have steered you one way or the other.

What about your .270 makes you feel its basic and not very nice? Brand of rifle, scope, etc?

Less expensive rifles with good mounts and a good scope in the hands of somebody who has practiced with them is the best medicine for a successful shot on a hunt.

I have nothing fancy in my hunting guns. Every rifle at one point or another was bought at a pawn shop or a sporting goods store. They have good glass and I can dang well shoot them in the field from Decades of shooting different rifles. But it all started with a 22 rimfire, 222 remington, 243 Winchester then moving up from there as I matured in the shooting process.

300 yards and over is a long shot in many people's book. The internet and forums do folks that don't have a hunting or shooting background a huge disservice. They also do a disservice by talking down on cartridges or lifting up other cartridges that do no better or worse in the field.

Useful is as useful does. The shine of a new dime often gets the nod when it's still worth the same 10 cents as the old one.

Good luck in what you choose, but you have to undo the flinch regardless of which road you take.

 

[Jimss]

I grew up with a 270 and shot a gob of prairie dogs and jack rabbits in Wyo during the off season! If you are concerned about the kick buy a muzzlebrake. It will likely kick similar to a 220 swift with a brake. In fact, I have a 300 Win Mag with a quality muzzy brake that I hardly even notice a kick at the range. Make sure to wear ear protection.

The cheapest way to go would be to put on a muzzlebrake.

The rage right now seems to be 6.5 creedmore or PRC's. Those calibers have a following. A lot of long range guys swear by them. The shells are a bit spendy and sometimes impossible to find. They would be great for antelope and deer sized game and 6.5 fanatics rage about how they are plenty big for elk. Every post I see I give those guys a ration of sh$t. It is highly debatable at longer range vs 30 calibers for elk + sized game. I would say the same for a 270.

I used a 300 WSM for years and really like that caliber. With a brake it would hardly kick. I recently went to 300 Win with a brake to use for all game since the shells are easy to find and are inexpensive. There is no doubt when I pull the trigger than the critter (antelope to moose size) are hitting the ground with one shot!

You mentioned a suppressor. I give the suppressor guys a ration of sh$t as well. There likely is a difference between suppressing a 220 (that hardly even kicks without a suppressor) and a larger caliber rifle. Your 270 will likely kick pretty hard with most suppressors. With a muzzlebrake you will have a significant reduction in recoil and depending upon the brake it may be similar to your buddies 220. There may be a suppressor or 2 that reduces both sound PLUS recoil but they are as expensive as a new rifle!

Do yourself and your wallet a favor. Buy a pair of quality earmuffs and a quality muzzlebrake! If you don't believe me, there are a pile of youtube videos about muzzlebrakes and suppressors on sleds that measure recoil differences.

 

[Pinchecharlie]

Yeah the rifle has a break on it now . I do wear ear miffs at the range but I never seem to have ear protection in the mountains. My bad on that. Maybe just learning to set up correctly will cure my twist back recoil deal. It seems like I try and follow my rules and breath and relax and try to be surprised by the shot and I have to re aim after and it’s kinda bad lol! We can hint with a 22 iam pretty sure but maybe I wouldn’t shoot at anything to far or to big but my buddy killed a giant buck at 317 with the swift and it fell over dead. I guess iam mixing target shooting with hunting just because I’ve been watching Erik cortina and benches and the nrl hunter matches and trying to make excuses to have some of that stuff cause it looks fun and it’s cool. Iam lucky and I’ve done ok in life so I can have a few exspensive things just not lots lol.
I bought all the reloading stuff to try it out for fun but I haven’t used it yet. Iam pretty excited to try though and might as well. Truth is this year I fired my rifle twice. So I need to go to the range a lot.
Would you guys give me a recipe for a mellowed down .270 so I can make that a little more fun at the range? I just bought my very first pistol tonight lol! Brand new fn 502! Yahaha. You guys are used to bad ass hunters and shooters not tourists like me! I grew up here but just never hunted or shot. Dunno. Feel like I wasted a lifetime not shooting animals! Yahaha!

 

[mtnbound]

Well my only rifle EVER is the .270 tikka t3 I have now. Iam not completely afraid of it but when I see good shooters on you tube they are able to see their shots and I can’t. It’s a big boom to me . I know that’s probably just cause iam a baby but I just thought I should try a smaller rifle for target practice to get the fundamentals down and so I wasn’t expecting such a big boom. My friend let me shot his 6.5 x 284 that was suppressed and it was better and this year he shot his deer with a suppressed 220 swift and it was like he didn’t even shoot a rifle at all lol, he’s a great marksman and he told me to maybe get a 22 creedmore. I just thought maybe i should buy a little bit bigger caliber just because I felt guilty buying a rifle that was just a toy. You know? Iam not going to be able to have a safe full of rifles unfortunately because my wife isn’t very sympathetic to the cause. That’s why I was wondering if I could meet in the middle. A 6.5 creedmore is everywhere and I thought guys made fun of them for being vanilla? I bought a 6.5 prc but my buddies dad wanted it and I never shot it lol. I dunno? Iam going to try and find shooting lessons and after I missed a deer last year under 200 (yes I know that’s bad) i bought a snap cap and I dry fired my rifle nine million times last winter. Unfortunately I got ran over by a truck in an accident and iam recovering from shoulder surgery now. I went hunting a few times but I couldn’t carry a pack so just did truck hunts. I got a small buck at 137 yards and it was great shot but of course easy . I won’t lie a 300 and over shot for me is long. So I watch guys and I thought if I had a small caliber going fast maybe I could master shooting to 300-500 and then up the caliber maybe. I will keep my 270 but it’s pretty basic. I don’t think anyone would consider it nice. Iam going to buy a suppressor for it just because it’s so much nicer to shoot. I said I might have a flinch because a guy at the range said I was ? Sometimes I am not surprised by it firing so I thought maybe he was right. Iam not afraid of it though just kinda cringing cause I k ke it’s gonna jump and be so f’n loud lol

Get a 223 training rifle with a 1-8 twist or less and a decent scope, and shoot the crap out of it. Take your current T3 and get a pre-fit barrel in 22CM, 6CM, or 243 (1-8 twist) for your hunting rifle, or you could just use your trainer with some good handloads to hunt with.

Get yourself a chrono like a Garmin so you have good velocity numbers and plug your load info into a ballistic solver like Shooter, Hornady, Revic, etc., so you know what to dial, and go to a range that you can shoot 300-500y. Once you start shooting more, your confidence will build.

 

[Flyjunky]

Yeah the rifle has a break on it now . I do wear ear miffs at the range but I never seem to have ear protection in the mountains. My bad on that. Maybe just learning to set up correctly will cure my twist back recoil deal. It seems like I try and follow my rules and breath and relax and try to be surprised by the shot and I have to re aim after and it’s kinda bad lol! We can hint with a 22 iam pretty sure but maybe I wouldn’t shoot at anything to far or to big but my buddy killed a giant buck at 317 with the swift and it fell over dead. I guess iam mixing target shooting with hunting just because I’ve been watching Erik cortina and benches and the nrl hunter matches and trying to make excuses to have some of that stuff cause it looks fun and it’s cool. Iam lucky and I’ve done ok in life so I can have a few exspensive things just not lots lol.
I bought all the reloading stuff to try it out for fun but I haven’t used it yet. Iam pretty excited to try though and might as well. Truth is this year I fired my rifle twice. So I need to go to the range a lot.
Would you guys give me a recipe for a mellowed down .270 so I can make that a little more fun at the range? I just bought my very first pistol tonight lol! Brand new fn 502! Yahaha. You guys are used to bad ass hunters and shooters not tourists like me! I grew up here but just never hunted or shot. Dunno. Feel like I wasted a lifetime not shooting animals! Yahaha!

Another possibility is to put that 270 in a quality stock which will help with recoil.

 

[35WhelenAI]

You've been brutally honest with where you are and what you have done so far, most guys around here will be willing to help you out a whole lot more than a pretender that argues back with everything.

Are you sure it's recoil, and not the muzzle blast and percussion? A brake on a 270 reduces recoil to nothing. And you have earmuffs at the range. Granted there is more percussion and blast with a muzzle brake but the recoil itself is mitigated with that alone.

My experience with a brake was a 300 Winchester Magnum, and it mellowed that down tremendously, extrapolating to a 270 with a brake would say recoil should be minimal. Sold that 300 Win with brake and got another without a brake. The muzzle blast at the range was more than just obnoxious, it was ridiculous. One shot in the field was sobering with respect to how loud it was. Never again.

At the range, are you wearing a recoil pad on your shoulder, does the stock have a recoil pad?

It's not a basic 270 in my opinion if it has a muzzle brake on it already. What are the reasons you say it is basic and not very nice? Still interested in that.

With respect to lower recoil hand loading, many starting loads with most powders could be considered that. As well, published and trusted reloading data also show reduced recoil loads with powders designed just for that.