Newbie Reloading Questions: Updated with range session

[JPeters218]

So I’m going to get into reloading. I have a tikka .223 and 6 creed. Been shooting factory black hills 77 TMK, and Hornady 108 Eld-M’s.

1) From my research it seems like IMR 8208 is kinda the easy button for .223. I’m good with easy. Don’t need crazy speed out of it. Mostly just going to be an MN whitetail gun.

2) The 6 creed hasn’t been as easy to find a formula for. Going to shoot the 107 TMK’s I think. That will be my antelope and elk gun. IMR 4350 seems to be the most common powder I’ve seen mentioned.

3) As for primers i saw the fed GMM 205m’s a lot for .223 .

4) And CCI 450’s for 6 creed. Do those sound about right?

And as for brass, I unfortunately haven’t been keeping it so I don’t have any to start with.

5) I grabbed a bag of Starline .223 today, but my local stores also carry Hornady. I’m completely open to other ideas as well

6) As for 6 creed, my only local option is Hornady. Open to suggestions for ordering as well. The thought of paying over $1 apiece for just brass for some brands seems a little crazy to me, but if that’s the thing to do, I’m open to it.

I don’t expect to get deep into the reloading weeds. Just want to be able to load whatever bullet I want.

 

[huntsd]

When I started loading my tikka 223 I was a newb. Couldn’t get it to shoot over varget. Tried xbr/ 77tmk as recommended on here and it hammered. It doesn’t produce great es/sd but I don’t care. Here is 500 yards the other day

 

[Taudisio]

So I’m going to get into reloading. I have a tikka .223 and 6 creed. Been shooting factory black hills 77 TMK, and Hornady 108 Eld-M’s.

1) From my research it seems like IMR 8208 is kinda the easy button for .223. I’m good with easy. Don’t need crazy speed out of it. Mostly just going to be an MN whitetail gun.

2) The 6 creed hasn’t been as easy to find a formula for. Going to shoot the 107 TMK’s I think. That will be my antelope and elk gun. IMR 4350 seems to be the most common powder I’ve seen mentioned.

3) As for primers i saw the fed GMM 205m’s a lot for .223 .

4) And CCI 450’s for 6 creed. Do those sound about right?

And as for brass, I unfortunately haven’t been keeping it so I don’t have any to start with.

5) I grabbed a bag of Starline .223 today, but my local stores also carry Hornady. I’m completely open to other ideas as well

6) As for 6 creed, my only local option is Hornady. Open to suggestions for ordering as well. The thought of paying over $1 apiece for just brass for some brands seems a little crazy to me, but if that’s the thing to do, I’m open to it.

I don’t expect to get deep into the reloading weeds. Just want to be able to load whatever bullet I want.

1.) IMR 8208xbr with the gold label, yes
2.) Hodgedon H4350 is the powder of choice for creedmoor cases. Slightly different.
3/4.) Primers are pretty close and difficult to differentiate, I would stick with anything from CCI or Federal. I have used Winchester with no issues, haven’t tried Remington, but I’m sure they are fine too.
5/6.) Brass is very subjective. Depending who you ask, but generally you have the “high end” lapua/alpha, “medium” Peterson/adg/others I can’t remember, and “low end” Hornady/federal/winchester/starline/nosler.
Depending on the person you ask each brand can move spot to spot, in reality all the brands can make mistakes, all of the brands can put out a perfect batch. Some can be softer than others, some have more case capacity, some have longer brass life. I wouldn’t worry about it. I’ve shot itty bitty groups with Hornady brass in my 6creed.

Just find a safe and repeatable routine with reloading, and know that you are making more consistent ammo than factory stuff can achieve. It’s time consuming, you need to pay attention, but I find it very meditative.

 

[JPeters218]

1.) IMR 8208xbr with the gold label, yes
2.) Hodgedon H4350 is the powder of choice for creedmoor cases. Slightly different.
3/4.) Primers are pretty close and difficult to differentiate, I would stick with anything from CCI or Federal. I have used Winchester with no issues, haven’t tried Remington, but I’m sure they are fine too.
5/6.) Brass is very subjective. Depending who you ask, but generally you have the “high end” lapua/alpha, “medium” Peterson/adg/others I can’t remember, and “low end” Hornady/federal/winchester/starline/nosler.
Depending on the person you ask each brand can move spot to spot, in reality all the brands can make mistakes, all of the brands can put out a perfect batch. Some can be softer than others, some have more case capacity, some have longer brass life. I wouldn’t worry about it. I’ve shot itty bitty groups with Hornady brass in my 6creed.

Just find a safe and repeatable routine with reloading, and know that you are making more consistent ammo than factory stuff can achieve. It’s time consuming, you need to pay attention, but I find it very meditative.

Well I know my rifle can shoot the Hornady brass. Its shot plenty of MOA groups with the Hornady ELD Match ammo. That stuff just varies in speed so much. My current stash is like 150 fps slower than the last. So maybe that answers my question about which brass to use for the 6…

 

[Taudisio]

Well I know my rifle can shoot the Hornady brass. Its shot plenty of MOA groups with the Hornady ELD Match ammo. That stuff just varies in speed so much. My current stash is like 150 fps slower than the last. So maybe that answers my question about which brass to use for the 6…

Yea, just get 3 boxes of the match ammo it likes, practice with it and save the brass, you have 60 pieces to reload.

 

[MCGHeel]

I had UM load the “rokslide special” 223 8208 xbr and 77 tmks. 2.5” and larger groups from my t3x. I started reloading, threw in Staball match, longer coal and groups now at 1” for 10+ shots. Point is, if combo doesn’t work right off the bat, change one component at a time to find something that does. For me, it was powder. Happy happy now


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[JPeters218]

Update time:

.223
-I loaded 25 rd of 23.5gr of XBR 8208 at 2.264” with 77 TMK’s in Starline .223 brass, GM205m primer
-Avg of 2702 fps (16” barrel)
-SD of 22
-ES of 75
- 10 rd group of 1.8” (bot left on pic)

I also shot up the rest of my black hills loaded 77 TMK’s (5.56)
- 35 shot avg of 2724
- SD of 24
- ES of 112 (Min 2656, max 2768)
- Shot a 10 rd group starting with cool barrel that measured 0.9”, and a 10 rd group on a hot barrel (shots 26-35 in a row) that measured 0.87” (top right)

My thoughts: Do I just find another box of the same lot Black hills ammo and use that for my hunting ammo? And just load practice ammo myself?
Open to suggestions here of course


6 creed
There wasn’t as much of a common recipe for this. So I researched as best as a I could.
Book max was 41.3gr of h4350

I loaded 10 at book max at .030 off the lands (as best as I could measure at least lol) 2.874” Coal, 107 TMK, CCI Br-2 primer, Hornady brass
-Avg of 2839 (18” barrel)
- SD of 23
- ES of 67
- No pressure signs that I could tell. Easy bolt lift, no extractor marks
- 10rd group size of 1.3”. Mostly vertical dispersion (middle group)


Also loaded
1 at 41.6gr, 2843 fps
1 at 41.9gr, 2901 fps. Also no pressure signs.

For reference the last 4 factory 108 EldM’s I had averaged 2741, with an ES of 120. Didn’t shoot a group with it but historically it’ll shoot an MOA 10 shot group

Open to suggestions here. Not super happy with that group but it measures a little better than it looks


Summary: Happy nothing blew up, but not super happy with groups. I’m using the Lee challenger press kit, with their powder dispenser and beam scale

 

[JPeters218]

Going to try different primers in my .223. Loading up 10 with cci 450’s at 2.260 coal in Starline .223 1x brass, and 10 in the 1x Black hills 5.56 brass with the same specs.

6 creed - Loading:
-5 at 42gr and the same 2.87”
-5 at 42gr and 2.800”
-5 at 41.5gr and 2.800

Any other ideas I’d be happy to try too

 

[Taudisio]

Update time:

.223
-I loaded 25 rd of 23.5gr of XBR 8208 at 2.264” with 77 TMK’s in Starline .223 brass, GM205m primer
-Avg of 2702 fps (16” barrel)
-SD of 22
-ES of 75
- 10 rd group of 1.8” (bot left on pic)

I also shot up the rest of my black hills loaded 77 TMK’s (5.56)
- 35 shot avg of 2724
- SD of 24
- ES of 112 (Min 2656, max 2768)
- Shot a 10 rd group starting with cool barrel that measured 0.9”, and a 10 rd group on a hot barrel (shots 26-35 in a row) that measured 0.87” (top right)

My thoughts: Do I just find another box of the same lot Black hills ammo and use that for my hunting ammo? And just load practice ammo myself?
Open to suggestions here of course


6 creed
There wasn’t as much of a common recipe for this. So I researched as best as a I could.
Book max was 41.3gr of h4350

I loaded 10 at book max at .030 off the lands (as best as I could measure at least lol) 2.874” Coal, 107 TMK, CCI Br-2 primer, Hornady brass
-Avg of 2839 (18” barrel)
- SD of 23
- ES of 67
- No pressure signs that I could tell. Easy bolt lift, no extractor marks
- 10rd group size of 1.3”. Mostly vertical dispersion (middle group)


Also loaded
1 at 41.6gr, 2843 fps
1 at 41.9gr, 2901 fps. Also no pressure signs.

For reference the last 4 factory 108 EldM’s I had averaged 2741, with an ES of 120. Didn’t shoot a group with it but historically it’ll shoot an MOA 10 shot group

Open to suggestions here. Not super happy with that group but it measures a little better than it looks


Summary: Happy nothing blew up, but not super happy with groups. I’m using the Lee challenger press kit, with their powder dispenser and beam scale

My load with the 109eldm in the creed was 42gr. With you not seeing pressure at 41.9, I would send a group there at .050 under mag length (as long as it fits in your barrel). Wiggle room, easy to remember and replicate with a little room to grow if needed.

I halfway expect that black hills ammo is .3gr over your load to get that little bump in velocity. I would bump it out to 2.270” to round that number for simplification and it should still fit your magazine fine. If you are trying to replicate the black hills velocity, that is where I would go.

 

[JPeters218]

My load with the 109eldm in the creed was 42gr. With you not seeing pressure at 41.9, I would send a group there at .050 under mag length (as long as it fits in your barrel). Wiggle room, easy to remember and replicate with a little room to grow if needed.

I halfway expect that black hills ammo is .3gr over your load to get that little bump in velocity. I would bump it out to 2.270” to round that number for simplification and it should still fit your magazine fine. If you are trying to replicate the black hills velocity, that is where I would go.

I’ll give both of those a shot.
I’m not worried about the velo in the .223, it’s only 20fps and that gun will probably never kill anything past 250 yards. But I’ll give it a try

I’m really enjoying the loading process so far. But I’m still trying to learn the next steps after an initial load

 

[Taudisio]

I’ll give both of those a shot.
I’m not worried about the velo in the .223, it’s only 20fps and that gun will probably never kill anything past 250 yards. But I’ll give it a try

I’m really enjoying the loading process so far. But I’m still trying to learn the next steps after an initial load

If it’s only a 250 yard gun, I wouldn’t even bother chasing the black hills. Find a 1.5” or under sized group, and go for it. That will hit a 4 inch target at 250 yards. Call it a day.

 

[JPeters218]

If it’s only a 250 yard gun, I wouldn’t even bother chasing the black hills. Find a 1.5” or under sized group, and go for it. That will hit a 4 inch target at 250 yards. Call it a day.

I’ll shoot it out to 750 at my local range, but yea actually hunting 250 is about the max my terrain allows. If nothing pans out when the new testing tho I’ll just buy another box of black hills for hunting, then buy some target bullets to plink with. Hard to argue with sub 1” 10rd groups out of factory ammo