NAS3 5.56 Cases - Tikka 223 w/ 88 TMK

B_Reynolds_AK said:
Spoke to Anthony at Shell Shock today. He explained that the cases are supposed to stretch .020" and then contract back in an "accordion" manner. This happens near the base of the case where the horizontal line is.
His take was that the excessive chamber headspace should not be an issue.

He went on to say that millions of cases are being used and often at over 100,000 psi.
His recommendation was to load even HOTTER than I was, to get the case to stretch more and fire form to the chamber fully.

Well.. ok. I dumped 27 and 28 grains (8% more than my max load) of N150 into two cases and loaded with 80 ELD-M's.
Based on my regular loads of 26.0 of N150 with the 80's from my 16" 223, 28.0 would be pushing them in the 3,000 fps range.

I fired both into a snowbank outside my house and this was the result:
Two more pierced primers and a damaged firing pin.

View attachment 1042703
View attachment 1042704
Click to expand...
Well that’s a bummer. I do think your primers have thin cups though. John @ Blackarc only runs #41 primers in his alloy cases. CCI 450 probably be a good second choice. I’ve got both on hand for when I experiment
 
Schmo said:
Well that’s a bummer. I do think your primers have thin cups though. John @ Blackarc only runs #41 primers in his alloy cases. CCI 450 probably be a good second choice. I’ve got both on hand for when I experiment
Click to expand...
I have some #41's coming that @KyleR1985 put in an order of 88 TMK's for free. I'll give it another go and see what happens when they arrive.
 
I don’t reload but I have used several 100 Nas3 77TMK from phantom defense. About 2850 from 18”. None of the issues you are having.
 
Formidilosus said:
Their commercial ammo isn’t any faster than Blackhills MK262 Mod1.
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No doubt they are using the thinner material to add a little more powder.

But I do believe new case materials will allow higher pressure and faster velocities.

I also know I get 100fps faster with 77TMK in Nas3 than the 77TMK from black hills. That’s an apples to apples comparison.
 
B_Reynolds_AK said:
Spoke to Anthony at Shell Shock today. He explained that the cases are supposed to stretch .020" and then contract back in an "accordion" manner. This happens near the base of the case where the horizontal line is.
His take was that the excessive chamber headspace should not be an issue.

He went on to say that millions of cases are being used and often at over 100,000 psi.
His recommendation was to load even HOTTER than I was, to get the case to stretch more and fire form to the chamber fully.

Well.. ok. I dumped 27 and 28 grains (8% more than my max load) of N150 into two cases and loaded with 80 ELD-M's.
Based on my regular loads of 26.0 of N150 with the 80's from my 16" 223, 28.0 would be pushing them in the 3,000 fps range.

I fired both into a snowbank outside my house and this was the result:
Two more pierced primers and a damaged firing pin.

View attachment 1042703
View attachment 1042704
Click to expand...
That dosnt look like a 223 bolt?
 
omicron1792 said:
No doubt they are using the thinner material to add a little more powder.

But I do believe new case materials will allow higher pressure and faster velocities.

I also know I get 100fps faster with 77TMK in Nas3 than the 77TMK from black hills. That’s an apples to apples comparison.
Click to expand...

I didn’t say anything about what is possible with HP cases- I’ve shot quite a bit of 77gr TMK from HP cases at 3,100fps from 18” barrels. I said that the factory, commercial Phantom Defense 77gr TMK using the Nas3 cases is about the same MV as Blackhills MK262 Mod1- over the last 20 years that has averaged 2,820 to 2,850fps MV from 18” barrels. It also is the exact same MV on average as the 223 loads that we reload with 77gr TMK’s. In other words, it’s not that “special”, and not what it can be.

18” barrel-
1774496426298.jpeg
 
Formidilosus said:
I didn’t say anything about what is possible with HP cases- I’ve shot quite a bit of 77gr TMK from HP cases at 3,100fps from 18” barrels. I said that the factory, commercial Phantom Defense 77gr TMK using the Nas3 cases is about the same MV as Blackhills MK262 Mod1- over the last 20 years that has averaged 2,820 to 2,850fps MV from 18” barrels. It also is the exact same MV on average as the 223 loads that we reload with 77gr TMK’s. In other words, it’s not that “special”, and not what it can be.

18” barrel-
View attachment 1042826
Click to expand...
I hear you. That’s what I was trying to say too. They aren’t using the stronger case or higher pressures at all. They can get a little more powder in there so they get a small velocity gain from that. No different than reloaders doing a little bit spicy load.

The real benefit is from using tech to contain and shoot higher pressure loads. But nobody is doing that now except maybe federal with 7BC. Are they all just afraid of a lawsuit?
 
omicron1792 said:
I hear you. That’s what I was trying to say too. They aren’t using the stronger case or higher pressures at all. They can get a little more powder in there so they get a small velocity gain from that. No different than reloaders doing a little bit spicy load.
Click to expand...

Ahh. I misunderstand, apologies.



omicron1792 said:
The real benefit is from using tech to contain and shoot higher pressure loads. But nobody is doing that now except maybe federal with 7BC. Are they all just afraid of a lawsuit?
Click to expand...

Yes. No one is using them to their potential commercially, and I kind of doubt they will. At least for a while.
 
Switched up components to see if a powder and primer change would make a difference.
Ran a ladder, starting really low, with Lever and CCI #41 primers.

The first 3 finally didn’t puncture the primer, but the first two were under my regular velocity with brass cases and the 3rd was right at the same.

27.0 of Lever on the 4th round netted 60 fps faster than my normal load with 25.0 of N150 and 88 TMK’s, but also I had to crank on the bolt to open it.. and another punctured primer.
IMG_3170.jpeg

This time it was very hard to remove my bolt shroud to check my firing pin. The shroud is getting beat up.

I’m pretty much over this. If anyone else wants to try, I have about 100 cases of NAS3 5.56 cases left.

IMG_3171.jpeg
 
B_Reynolds_AK said:
Switched up components to see if a powder and primer change would make a difference.
Ran a ladder, starting really low, with Lever and CCI #41 primers.

The first 3 finally didn’t puncture the primer, but the first two were under my regular velocity with brass cases and the 3rd was right at the same.

27.0 of Lever on the 4th round netted 60 fps faster than my normal load with 25.0 of N150 and 88 TMK’s, but also I had to crank on the bolt to open it.. and another punctured primer.
View attachment 1043050

This time it was very hard to remove my bolt shroud to check my firing pin. The shroud is getting beat up.

I’m pretty much over this. If anyone else wants to try, I have about 100 cases of NAS3 5.56 cases left.

View attachment 1043052
Click to expand...
PM sent.
 
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