Muzzleloading Wannabee - CVA Accura LR-X .45

[CBECK61]

I've shot the ELRs through 4 45 cal CVA and had great results. They do seem to tumble or do something wonky somewhere past 550 but inside 400 they have been very consistent for me. I have heard of a lot of the early guns key holling but I wonder if people aren't pushing them hard enough. The twist rate seems pretty slow to be so I assume you need a pretty hot charge. Just my experience.

OP. I'm curious of your goals for your future Muzzy. What state and species you want to hunt, optic, and how far you want to shoot. Certainly major benefits to shooting next to bore with the right setup but w/o much experience I would eliminate a few other variables before I jumped down that rabbit hole.

 

[Newtosavage]

Thanks for the reply JeffRaines. Much appreciated. As I said, I'm very very new to this. So I'm assuming that if you have a .45 and you are using a sabot, that you are shooting a .40 bullet? I wonder if it makes more sense to purchase a .50 and then shoot .45 bullets with a sabot? I haven't heard anything about the .50 LR-X's having an oversized bore. That would give me the option to use either .50 or .45 bullets I guess. Am I way off base here? No one I know does any muzzleloading and I'm early in the learning stage so these are likely stupid questions. I wasn't wanting to use sabots because of what I've read with bullet-to-bore being more accurate and not having to deal with the sabot residue in the barrel...

It definitely makes more sense to purchase a .50 cal and shoot sabots with .45's if you want, and when you can. In some places, you must use a .50 cal with full bore sized bullets, so a .50 gives you more options.

I'm completely happy with my CVA Optima .50 cal. Wouldn't change a thing.

 

[Pickettpuncher]

It definitely makes more sense to purchase a .50 cal and shoot sabots with .45's if you want, and when you can. In some places, you must use a .50 cal with full bore sized bullets, so a .50 gives you more options.

I'm completely happy with my CVA Optima .50 cal. Wouldn't change a thing.

I don’t know that you have more options using a 50 cal with bore sized bullets. There’s plenty of good options, in 40 and 45 for full bore bullets, you just won’t find them in the big box stores. If you wanna step up your muzzleloader game, get an adjustable sizing die and get some custom bullets.

 

[Newtosavage]

I don’t know that you have more options using a 50 cal with bore sized bullets. There’s plenty of good options, in 40 and 45 for full bore bullets, you just won’t find them in the big box stores. If you wanna step up your muzzleloader game, get an adjustable sizing die and get some custom bullets.

I'm sure you're right. However the OP knows nothing about ML's so I'm not sure that's the advice we need to offer just yet.

 

[weisenbu]

I've shot the ELRs through 4 45 cal CVA and had great results. They do seem to tumble or do something wonky somewhere past 550 but inside 400 they have been very consistent for me. I have heard of a lot of the early guns key holling but I wonder if people aren't pushing them hard enough. The twist rate seems pretty slow to be so I assume you need a pretty hot charge. Just my experience.

OP. I'm curious of your goals for your future Muzzy. What state and species you want to hunt, optic, and how far you want to shoot. Certainly major benefits to shooting next to bore with the right setup but w/o much experience I would eliminate a few other variables before I jumped down that rabbit hole.

Thank you all so much for your input. I live in Minnesota. With my current situation of young kids at home and a stay-at-home wife, I just simply don’t get out west often and when I do, it is with a rifle. So my main goal with a muzzy is to extend my deer season in MN. They offer a muzzy season after rifle season closes. It is much easier for me to sneak away a couple weekends than to be gone for 7-10 days at a time and the big expense. Most of my shots will be within 200 yards. I plan to use a scope as it is now legal in MN. It sounds like a .50 cal would do everything I need from a muzzy. Again thank you for all the input!

 

[Pickettpuncher]

I'm sure you're right. However the OP knows nothing about ML's so I'm not sure that's the advice we need to offer just yet.

I’ll agree, at least in part. For the sake of the OP, and the limited knowledge he has it will be much simpler to go to the big box store, whether that’s Walmart or cabelas or whatever his local store is and get the supplies he needs. In todays times, I hope he can get primers and powder because if not, caliber makes no difference.

 

[weisenbu]

I'm sure you're right. However the OP knows nothing about ML's so I'm not sure that's the advice we need to offer just ye

I don’t know that you have more options using a 50 cal with bore sized bullets. There’s plenty of good options, in 40 and 45 for full bore bullets, you just won’t find them in the big box stores. If you wanna step up your muzzleloader game, get an adjustable sizing die and get some custom bullets.

This is where I was originally planning to go. I reload for my rifles so it didn’t seem like too much of a stretch for me. But it’s probably overkill to start…

 

[weisenbu]

I’ll agree, at least in part. For the sake of the OP, and the limited knowledge he has it will be much simpler to go to the big box store, whether that’s Walmart or cabelas or whatever his local store is and get the supplies he needs. In todays times, I hope he can get primers and powder because if not, caliber makes no difference.

I have sourced 400 primers and a couple bottles of BH409.

 

[Pickettpuncher]

This is where I was originally planning to go. I reload for my rifles so it didn’t seem like too much of a stretch for me. But it’s probably overkill to start…

Going full bore to start with most likely is. My muzzleloaders are not black powder guns. But even without reloading tools there’s plenty of good options in a 45 cal. Even if you use a sabot there’s good options. I wouldn’t let the caliber slow me down near as much as getting a quality rifle.

I have sourced 400 primers and a couple bottles of BH409.

You’ve done very well! Much luckier than some of the guys I know.

 

[weisenbu]

I have sourced 400 primers and a couple bottles of BH409.

BH209, typo, whoops!

 

[Pickettpuncher]

BH209, typo, whoops!

If you get a cva, be sure to get the correct plug for the bh209 primers and also clean your flash channel out after every 6-10 shots. I also hope you didn’t get muzzleloader primers, but true 209 primers

 

[weisenbu]

If you get a cva, be sure to get the correct plug for the bh209 primers and also clean your flash channel out after every 6-10 shots. I also hope you didn’t get muzzleloader primers, but true 209 primers

Thanks for the tips. Yep, got true 209 primers.

 

[menhaden_man]

I've shot the ELRs through 4 45 cal CVA and had great results. They do seem to tumble or do something wonky somewhere past 550 but inside 400 they have been very consistent for me. I have heard of a lot of the early guns key holling but I wonder if people aren't pushing them hard enough. The twist rate seems pretty slow to be so I assume you need a pretty hot charge. Just my experience.

OP. I'm curious of your goals for your future Muzzy. What state and species you want to hunt, optic, and how far you want to shoot. Certainly major benefits to shooting next to bore with the right setup but w/o much experience I would eliminate a few other variables before I jumped down that rabbit hole.

I’ve got a new 45 and shoot the ELRs on BH209 also, it’s a fine gun. Email Kyle Pittman, dude knows his shit and responsive. Maybe I lucked out?

 

[Pickettpuncher]

I’ve got a new 45 and shoot the ELRs on BH209 also, it’s a fine gun. Email Kyle Pittman, dude knows his shit and responsive. Maybe I lucked out?

Kyle Pittman makes some fine bullets

 

[ENCORE]

This is where I was originally planning to go. I reload for my rifles so it didn’t seem like too much of a stretch for me. But it’s probably overkill to start…

My dad (R.I.P.) always said: "If you don't have the money or time to do it right the first time, where will you get the money or time to do it over?"

Its not that hard to learn to size bullets and if you buy a rifle with a GOOD BARREL any .451 or .452 bullet can be sized and there's a ton of them out there. The 50cal rifles can't compete with the 45's for either accuracy or distance.

I would not purchase a CVA 45cal rifle at this time. WAY to many issues with barrels at the time. I'm not a fan of the 1:22 twist either. A 1:20 will stabilize most all bullets much better.

If the OP wants a rifle with a quality barrel and one that you can shoot any sized .451 or .452 bullet, at this time and without question, I choose a Knight with the faster 1:20 twist.

 

[CBECK61]

OP. My two sense for your situation is to grab an Accura .45 and put a quality scope on it. The ELR 285 push with a max load will stabilize just fine and I have seen several sub 1 inch guns with this setup. A scope using a reticle out to 300 would be pretty easy and if you want to shoot father I would recommend a scope with a quality turret. This would potentially pigeon hole you into shooting the ELR but there are to many benefits to a smaller diameter bullet for me to go to a 50 cal if its legal for you to do so. Encore is right that you can build a better gun than the 45cal CVAs but my experience has been positive while shooting the ELR. Spend your time and money elsewhere like on an optic. Not sure what your budget is but if its under a grand for a scope the $200 your will spend on a sizing die would be better served on a scope IMO.

If you hunt for a season or two and decide you enjoy it but need to squeeze more performance I would hit Encore up for recommendations for bullets, barrels, and builders.

I have set up several of this setup for buddies and they have been excited to get out to 3-400 yards consistently.

Accura (pick your poisin but I like the new features of the X series but haven't actually got to shoot them yet)
Leupold VX5hd 3-15 wind plex
Warne Mountain tech bases and rings (duramounts suck)
285 ELR
80-84 Weighted grains of BH209

I think that one thing guys miss in the hunting community when muzzleloading at ranges past 300 is how small your margins of error are past 300 yards. Big heavy slow bullets drop very quickly and get blown around by the wind. A range finder with atmospheric sensors are a quick easy soloution, ballisitc apps work, or a kestrel. At 400 yards temperature swings that deviate from your dope chart can make you miss animals pretty easily. The applied ballistics ap ($30) can help if you have cell service to update the enviormentals. The sig 2400 abs, Revic, and leica 2800/3500.com rangefinders all have this feature and can just read out your bullet drop in MOA/Mils.

 

[weisenbu]

OP. My two sense for your situation is to grab an Accura .45 and put a quality scope on it. The ELR 285 push with a max load will stabilize just fine and I have seen several sub 1 inch guns with this setup. A scope using a reticle out to 300 would be pretty easy and if you want to shoot father I would recommend a scope with a quality turret. This would potentially pigeon hole you into shooting the ELR but there are to many benefits to a smaller diameter bullet for me to go to a 50 cal if its legal for you to do so. Encore is right that you can build a better gun than the 45cal CVAs but my experience has been positive while shooting the ELR. Spend your time and money elsewhere like on an optic. Not sure what your budget is but if its under a grand for a scope the $200 your will spend on a sizing die would be better served on a scope IMO.

If you hunt for a season or two and decide you enjoy it but need to squeeze more performance I would hit Encore up for recommendations for bullets, barrels, and builders.

I have set up several of this setup for buddies and they have been excited to get out to 3-400 yards consistently.

Accura (pick your poisin but I like the new features of the X series but haven't actually got to shoot them yet)
Leupold VX5hd 3-15 wind plex
Warne Mountain tech bases and rings (duramounts suck)
285 ELR
80-84 Weighted grains of BH209

I think that one thing guys miss in the hunting community when muzzleloading at ranges past 300 is how small your margins of error are past 300 yards. Big heavy slow bullets drop very quickly and get blown around by the wind. A range finder with atmospheric sensors are a quick easy soloution, ballisitc apps work, or a kestrel. At 400 yards temperature swings that deviate from your dope chart can make you miss animals pretty easily. The applied ballistics ap ($30) can help if you have cell service to update the enviormentals. The sig 2400 abs, Revic, and leica 2800/3500.com rangefinders all have this feature and can just read out your bullet drop in MOA/Mils.

Thank you. I really appreciate you taking the time to provide me with your insight and experience!

 

[JGS8163]

I just recently purchased a Accura MR-X in .45 cal. I’ve yet to shoot it but I’ve already bought a Hankins Ignition system for it, this allows me use regular rifle magnum primers in it. I’m just curious if there’s any other load data using BH209 and the 285 Powerbelt 285 ELR. I’ve got a COUES hunt in November and am a total novice in Muzzleloader. I appreciate any guidance and thank the OP for letting me tag in.

CVA Replacement plug for the Accura, Optima, Wolf - Hanks Precision Gun Parts

This is a direct replacement plug for many CVA muzzleloading rifles. It was designed for use with the DIS priming modules and uses large rifle magnum primers to give you a hotter ignition and a 100% leak free seal. No more worrying about the rain getting into your 209 shot gun primers. With this...

hanksprecisiongunparts.com

 

[BPI_Outdoors]

Yeah that appears to be the best approach at this time unfortunately. The .45 LR-X checked all the boxes for me as a new muzzleloader but I really don't want to deal with those issues. Hopefully CVA gets things resolved soon. Does anyone know if the CVA .50 barrels are having the same QC issues?

I have the 50 MR-X no problems with mine

 

[JGS8163]

My 45 prints sub MOA at 200 yards with the 285 Powerbelt and 83 grains of BH209. Using Hankins Ignition system.