Looking for Truck/Trailer/Towing opinions on a new Trailer

[sawsington]

Definitely agree to not use the published dry numbers, and ORV's are heavy. I usually take the same ratio of dry hitch weight to dry trailer weight compared to an estimated wet hitch weight to trailer GVWR. For a 23DBS, that should be around 1,117 (with an extra 100# for a WDH).
For a short season, you could probably get away with running close to payload. But long term a move to more payload would be ideal.

 

[kota]

I tow a ORV 23 DBS with a 3/4 ton diesel, and
wouldn’t want to tow it with less. It definitely pushes me around a bit, can be jarring on the bumps and you can tell it’s back there. I wouldn’t hesitate to tow any of the other trailers we have had with a properly set up 1/2 ton, but this one is a significant step up from our last trailer that was 5K dry. I am sure you could, but I think you would be pushing the envelope a bit and would be looking at new pickups after the first trip.

Something else to consider is that they are really high off the ground, and i am about out of adjustment room on my hitch height.

Trailer is awesome by the way!!

 

[JDowning]

I want to run this by the group for a sanity check. I want to get a bigger Travel Trailer now that the kids are getting older/bigger etc. My current trailer is 3,600lbs dry and I have pulled it all over the west (mainly Colorado) with zero issues, most of the time I am fully loaded down with water and plenty of toys/gear. The truck handles it with zero stress, 70-75 MPH if I need too, high winds no problem, mountain passes I can accelerate with ease. I am pretty dead set on the new trailer being an Outdoors RV, but its heavy with the way they are built.

I am not adverse to a new truck, but I really don't want to buy one right now in todays auto environment. My plan would be to keep this F150 for another year or 2, then probably time for an F250 with as much as I do tow my current trailer. But, could I get through another summer & hunting season with my current setup?

Please let me know your thoughts on pulling this new setup with the 1/2 ton.

Truck:
2017 F150 w/ 3.5 eco boost and the max tow goodies and 3.55 gears
12,200 Tow rating
1,725 Payload
17,100 GCWR

Current trailer:
18' box, 21' total length
3,660 dry weight (no slides)
382 dry hitch weight
35 gallon fresh water tank (drive with it full a lot...~280lbs)
2 20lb LP tanks (60lbs full) + 2 AGM batteries upfront (~100lbs)
14k Equalizer hitch (105lbs)

New Trailer:
23' box, 27' total length
6350 dry weight (includes all options, I would likely be a touch lighter with out some goodies)
695 lb dry hitch weight
80 gallon fresh water tank (I think around ~40-50 gallons would fit most trips, but up to max 640lbs of water)
2 30lb LP tanks (110lbs) + 2 AGM batteries upfront (~100lbs)
14k Equalizer Hitch (105lbs)

I think the truck will have plenty of power to pull it, even in Colorado, but the payload is what's got me concerned that a new trailer might = new truck.

New trailer setup would put about 1,000 dry on the hitch (including the hitch itself) leaving me with about 725 payload to spare. Me + Wife + Kids probably total 450lbs being generous, so now I have ~275lbs of gear I can add. We like to haul firewood, chairs, and bikes/kayaks in the bed of the truck that I can't imagine being 275 total pounds, but its probably 150-200 or so, which doesn't leave much room. Then throw some recovery gear and a few other things in the cab and I think I would be at max payload if I loaded like I normally do today.

I think you would be fine pulling the bigger trailer in dry conditions. You might need to adjust the weight distribution of your load in your truck/trailer to not have too much tongue weight/cargo weight in the truck. And, if the trailer brakes are functioning properly, they'll help stop you too.

I have a 2018 F150 rated to pull about the same as your truck. However I am concerned about trailering in bad weather and slick conditions-like are often encountered during hunting seasons.

I have a landscaping business and we were towing about 10,000# (trailer and gravel) with a 2500hd shortbed onto a slightly sloped grass area for a project. The ground was frosted, and when we tried to stop the weight of the trailer started pushing the back end of the truck sideways downhill. We were able pull out of the slide and onto a flatter area, but I thought I was going to have an insurance or workers comp claim.

I think if you're going to tow in adverse weather/difficult terrain you're gonna want the bigger, heavier tow vehicle.

 

[crich]

Weight of the tow vehicle is a huge factor. Thats a much bigger rig to pull. Sure a 1/2 ton will pull it no problem but a 3/4 ton will do it in stride without being pushed around as much.

 

[Brightwhite]

Definitely agree to not use the published dry numbers, and ORV's are heavy. I usually take the same ratio of dry hitch weight to dry trailer weight compared to an estimated wet hitch weight to trailer GVWR. For a 23DBS, that should be around 1,117 (with an extra 100# for a WDH).
For a short season, you could probably get away with running close to payload. But long term a move to more payload would be ideal.

The 23DBS is the model I’m looking at. Yeah, if that really is real world weight then it certainly changes things.

 

[Brightwhite]

I tow a ORV 23 DBS with a 3/4 ton diesel, and
wouldn’t want to tow it with less. It definitely pushes me around a bit, can be jarring on the bumps and you can tell it’s back there. I wouldn’t hesitate to tow any of the other trailers we have had with a properly set up 1/2 ton, but this one is a significant step up from our last trailer that was 5K dry. I am sure you could, but I think you would be pushing the envelope a bit and would be looking at new pickups after the first trip.

Something else to consider is that they are really high off the ground, and i am about out of adjustment room on my hitch height.

Trailer is awesome by the way!!

Thanks for the feedback, the 23DBS is what I am looking at and that’s great to understand from someone towing that exact model. I’m jealous of your rig!

I really don’t want to go diesel due to the cost and the weight and loss of off road ease of use….but I’m not sure the 7.3l gas engine ford offers is much lighter.

 

[Gone4Days]

Personally, I wouldn’t tow that new trailer with any 1/2 ton.

 

[Brightwhite]

Weight of the tow vehicle is a huge factor. Thats a much bigger rig to pull. Sure a 1/2 ton will pull it no problem but a 3/4 ton will do it in stride without being pushed around as much.

Good point. I really like the Ram power wagon, which on paper has less payload and less tow capacity than my F150, but I see people towing bigger trailers with them all the time. The weight of the bigger truck probably just handles it better than the manufacturer specs would say.

 

[NYyotekiller]

People pay WAY too much attention to what manufacturers claim that these new 1/2 tons payload and towing capacities are. No way in H that I would be towing anywhere near 12K with any 1/2 ton pickup. Just because it has the horsepower to pull it doesn't make it safe.

Go with a 3/4 or 1 ton and know that you are safe. Having towed heavy with both 1/2's and 3/4 tons, there is simply no comparison. Try it for yourself and then you'll know you'll be making the right choice to go with a 3/4 ton truck.

 

[Brightwhite]

Thanks everyone for replying. Still seems about 50/50 on opinions, but I’m leaning towards new truck or different trailer. I’ve pulled in snow and ice, in crazy winds on I-80 in Nebraska, and have done 2-3 mountain passes in a day…I’ve not felt under trucked with my current trailer but don’t think I’d enjoy that feeling with the new one.

With my current truck that would also rule out the Nash 24B, the only other 2 I have on my short list are the Grand Design 2400BH or the XLS 23BHE.

Those grand design models are both -1k lbs lighter dry, have -2.5k lb lower GVWR and stated hitch weights around 500lb…and they both offer all the reasons I want to go to a bigger trailer. It’s just not an ORV or a Nash!

If anyone stumbles onto this thread and is towing one of those grand designs in a 1/2 ton I’d love to hear from you.

 

[BuckRut]

If you are going to tow any significant amount I would go with a 3/4 ton. The 1/2 ton can do it but everything about the 3/4 ton is more well suited for the task. Especially the transmission and differential.

 

[TAArrowood]

Good advice here.. Can't ever forget that you'll have your wife and kids aboard.. Safety should always be your first concern.. I think your truck will easily pull either trailer, although your turbo setup is going to be constantly kicking in, especially on inclines... I think that you will be pushing the limits at several levels and drastically decreasing your margin of error just in case the situation gets dicey.. I was in your position a few years ago and did dozens of hours of research before committing to my setup... I ended up with an F-250 extended cab, 4x4, 6.7 powerstroke and Airstream 25' trailer... The trailer is light for it's size, very aerodynamic and pulls like a dream.. I've had it all over the country (truck/trailer) and never felt like I was pushing any limits.. It can change you're whole outlook on camping if, every time you leave home, you have to plan your trip around things you want to do in order to take the least demanding route... I think I've found the perfect setup for me and my family and sure hope you find what works for you.. Just err on the side of safety.. Nobody enjoys trips that require you to have constant white knuckles with every turn or looking over at your wife thinking "I sure hope we get across this next pass without incident" (been there, done that)... Good luck and all the best in your decision making process..

 

[Unckebob]

Rent a similar sized/weight trailer for a trip and take it for a weekend.

I think you’ll be fine, but you might not like how it “rides.’

 

[sawsington]

People pay WAY too much attention to what manufacturers claim that these new 1/2 tons payload and towing capacities are. No way in H that I would be towing anywhere near 12K with any 1/2 ton pickup. Just because it has the horsepower to pull it doesn't make it safe.

Go with a 3/4 or 1 ton and know that you are safe. Having towed heavy with both 1/2's and 3/4 tons, there is simply no comparison. Try it for yourself and then you'll know you'll be making the right choice to go with a 3/4 ton truck.

These just aren't manufacturer claims. They are SAE tow ratings that are standardized and tested. Current 1/2 tons are lightyears ahead of where they were even a decade ago. Most have the same payloads and capacities of 2000's 3/4 tons. Yes, this even means they can stop the weight. My 1/2 ton truck's brake calipers are larger and more powerful than some current 3/4 tons.

The biggest issue is the payload, and larger trailers need a heavier tongue weight. In order to pull a 12k trailer, you would need a minimum of #1,200 on the tongue if distributed properly. This is pushing most 1/2 tons payload to the max.

 

[Mds2004]

Go weigh your truck with a full tank and your family to see where you really are at.

Also FWIW, I would go F-350 if your state doesn't penalize you too much in registration fees. My biggest regret is not going with F-350 vs F-250. My 2021 F-250's payload is only at 2800lbs with the 10,800 GVWR. An F-350 would give me an extra 600lbs payload with an 11,400 GVWR. Many F-250s are even derated further to 10,000lbs which would only give my truck a 2,000lb payload. Numbers may also vary more by configuration (ie. CCSB, CCLB, SCLB, etc).

Also, the above numbers are with the diesel. The 7.3L gas would net you higher payload numbers because the diesel is heavier.

 

[Alpine4x4]

You will be over payload if you only have 575lbs left with a dry camper. Two people and gear will take you over that with ease. Not to mention thats a bit of weight to pull behind a 1/2 ton. I have a Ram 3500 diesel and haul a 3600lb dry slide in camper and a ~5000lb boat package routinely and thats pushing this trucks abilities (the camper, the boat not so much). You really need to hook up to one and see how comfortable you are and how the truck handles it. You're at the point where the truck will pull it, but can it stop it or handle it during an evasive maneuver?

 

[crich]

Good point. I really like the Ram power wagon, which on paper has less payload and less tow capacity than my F150, but I see people towing bigger trailers with them all the time. The weight of the bigger truck probably just handles it better than the manufacturer specs would say.

I like to think worse case... youre driving on a windy high altitude section of road and a big rigs wind wash sends your trailer a foot and a half to the right as it blows by. A heavy vehicle with my family in it puts me (and the trailer) more at ease. A good distribution hitch with sway control only does so much, albeit a lot honestly.

 

[Don Fischer]

I think probably you really don't need a diesel engine. Most people don't. If you were pulling heavy a lot it's a different story. Diesels are made to work, pulling an RV you probably won't do 50,000 miles a year, likely far less. Probably won't wear out a diesel in your life time. Met a guy from Minnesota pulling RV's for a living and he was running an old pre turbo Cummins he had 1 million miles on. He was running Minnesota to Southern California three and four times a month. He had the need! Guy I got my old 1983 ford F250 with a diesel got it to pull a trailer from Central California to Texas for winter's. Great if you can afford it but he sure didn't need it! Pretty much everything with motor vehicles boils down to cost per mile and heavier you get, more it cost per mile. You get a diesel to pull your RV and probably get fair fuel Milledge pulling. But how much do you expect to be pulling. Diesel running MTY should get about as good or close to it as a newer gas engine. Where you make it up would be in the life span of the engine itself. Life span of the diesel destroys that of a gas engine. If I remember right, cost to rebuild most diesels runs about $1,000 per cylinder. My old Ford diesel has over 350,000 miles on it now, not many gas engines last that long!

 

[Don Fischer]

I like to think worse case... youre driving on a windy high altitude section of road and a big rigs wind wash sends your trailer a foot and a half to the right as it blows by. A heavy vehicle with my family in it puts me (and the trailer) more at ease. A good distribution hitch with sway control only does so much, albeit a lot honestly.

Pulling an RV and boat in weather that the draft of a road truck will bother it much won't probably happen that much. The draft certainly can be spooky but unless the road in icy or your in a down pour, isn't gonna wreak you. Bad thing would be getting a dually. On icy roads and probably even real wet roads the two extra tire's act pretty much like driving on plywood. Another thing about duals is all four of them wear about the same and when replacing them it becomes six new tire's rather than four! My 1983 is a dually but I don't use it a lot except for around home. Couple trips to town a year for pellet stove pellets and that is really about it! I have absolutely no need for a diesel PU other than when I got it, it was a really good price and I needed something to pull a 40' 5th wheel home with. The over whelming number of people have really no need for a diesel engine PU. Another thing to think about in costs. I have to keep mine plugged into the electricity for the engine heater all winter to be sure it starts easily. Break down on the side of the road somewhere and it could get cold enough not to start when you get back in which cast you not only need starting fluid but also a jump! Don't get me wrong, I like diesel engines but thrifty is not a word that goes along with diesel unless you really have a use for one.

 

[TJ427]

Your F150 ecoboost is certainly capable on paper. I use an F350 (2023) long box high output diesel to tow loaded weight 9000 lbs 38 foot gooseneck. We tow that in search of snow and frequently drive through winter storms. The winds and conditions are mainly what make the F350 with air bags much safer vs a smaller truck. On paper it isn't necessary but there are times that a truck designed to tow has saved us from more than one accident. The turbo certainly helps at elevation with less power loss, but control would be my concern.

We mainly tow out West at elevation so my bias is a bigger truck that makes the drivers life less stressful and safer for my family while towing. The F150 will certainly move the load but controlling it with crosswinds and inclement weather will be the challenge. If you stick with the F150 air bags could make it handle better with your new trailer.