Longbows with carbon limbs. (Input needed)

[Wellsdw]

So I’m in the market for a longbow, looking at a widow PL or Toelke Whip. I’ve found a carbon PL right at my specs but the thought of carbon limbs a longbow makes me cringe. That said I know that a crazy amount of precision goes into this “primitive” weapon. And even the wooden longbow is glass backed. But I’m just having a hard time getting passed the idea of carbon. What’s everyone else’s thoughts?

 

[Montana Slim]

I'm sure the carbon is awesome... not my thing.

Toelke makes a nice bow.

 

[Wilderlife]

I've got a SPL Mushin Styk with carbon on the back and it's an amazing longbow. Very quiet, stable, and fast. I pull about 55# with it and it launches a 600gn arrow at around 170fps.

Here's a video about it, if you care to watch. I haven't done much with it since making this video as I've been shooting my wheels more, but I'll get back into my longbow game shortly.

 

[mgmicky]

If it’s durability you are worried about, I don’t think that would be an issue with a PL because they are built like tanks. I have a 2 piece A&H and a Harrison HSS both with carbon limbs and they are both smooth, great shooting longbows. The sound is a little different than my glass bows, but it isn’t bad. Definitely not as pretty as fancy wood veneers, but no less so than black glass.

 

[lelliott8]

I have carbon on a hurst and I like it a lot. The carbon definitely looks a bit strange but I like how it shoots. I would say if you are hesitant at all of carbon on a trad bow you should go Toelke and never look back.

 

[oldgoat]

I'm just going to go ahead and say it~There's lots of Carbon in wood!
But I'm always going to go with recommending Toelke's, I'm kind of a fanboy!

 

[nevadabugle]

I shoot carbon limbs. What's the difference between Carbon and Fiberglass? How about is a carbon arrow that much different than a Microflyte arrow from the 70s?

Shoot what makes you happy. If that's a self bow, cool. If that's a fiberglass backed bow from the 70s, cool. If it's a metal riser with carbon limbs, cool.

 

[Beendare]

If you are worried about the Trad aspect- and how other view in...I can't speak to that.

I do know that adding Carbon to the Black widow recurves only added 2-3 FPS...so not much of a performance gain.

My bet is it's the same with a longbow- UNLESS you are talking about the Border longbow-Mosstrooper or something- that was designed for carbon. The Centaur Longbows are also designed for Carbon- not just a backing.

Most guys shooting LB's don't worry so much about performance and FPS [especially a couple FPS] ...they look for a bow that points and shoots well. Shoot what you like and screw everyone else.

 

[Beendare]

FWIW, I shoot a ILF Recurve with Carbon limbs....not because they are carbon...but because they are quiet, low vibration and fast.

 

[Wellsdw]

I appreciate the input, kinda feel stupid as I shoot carbon arrows but the thought of a carbon trad bow was un American to me haha. May pull the trigger on it!

There is no hunting community the the trad community. Let’s keep it that way.

 

[Wrench]

A whip is not meant to be super fast, it's forgiving, light, quiet and elegant. The take down version is the ultimate in the longbow hunting world.

If you want fast the new limbs that south is making are supposed to be awesome. I have a coyote on the shelf and have considered a set for it.

 

[lelliott8]

Not that it matters or was the original question, but what do you suppose the fastest longbow out there is?
A short centaur or big stick?

 

[Beendare]

Carbon adds torsional stability. In a conventional design, it doesn’t add speed. Its when bowyers can tweak the design, adding more preload, making tips thinner/ lighter is when carbon helps. If the design stretches the parameter where fiberglass cannot maintain its stability, then carbon adds performance.


I have a set of the Dryad acs longbow limbs. They were a few FPS faster than a Big Jim LB I had at the same weight…but nothing noticeable like the difference between std recurve limbs and Borders…

Ive seen a Black swan that was a few fps faster than a regular LB, , then it broke…and the replacement broke too. My buddy gave up.

I’ve only seen a few Centaurs,I’m a lefty and never found someone with a lefty version I could shoot. I’ve seen comments that they are faster.

Call Black Widow I think they will make you a PL with carbon and they are honest….they can tell you how much faster it is, if at all.

 

[wytx]

This bow has carbon lams in the limbs, 3 . Can't tell them from fiberglass by looks.
I have the same bow without carbon lams and really like the carbon lams beter.
Seems to be smoother, easier draw and cast a bit differently than the non carbon bow. Not exactly faster but snappier if that makes sense.
It is much easier to shoot than the other bow.

 

[thinhorn_AK]

I shoot an ILF longbow so tradition is sort of a non issue for me. If I were buying a new bow, I’d get a 100% blacked out toelke whip, 64”, 60lbs @ 28”

 

[North Idaho Stickbow]

Carbon adds torsional stability. In a conventional design, it doesn’t add speed. Its when bowyers can tweak the design, adding more preload, making tips thinner/ lighter is when carbon helps. If the design stretches the parameter where fiberglass cannot maintain its stability, then carbon adds performance.

This is what I’ve heard all the bowyers say too. Carbon is more about the ruggedness and not so much the performance. It’s seems totally worth it on a recurve to keep the limbs from twisting around or going side to side. On a thick-limbed longbow I don’t think it’s going to do much for you.

 

[Kentucky]

I’ve had both…. Personally I’d go with a glass longbow and carbon recurve… as others have said it helps with stability, ie. crappy release with glass recurve limbs could be 6” off, same shot with carbon limbs 3” off…in recurve it make ton of difference…

I also shoot a (2018) 58” dryad Orion with acs carbon/glass longbow limbs… super quiet and reasonably fast… not as fast as my (2006)winex carbon ilf conventional recurve limb.

It’s all in what you like…it addictive, if I think I like it I’ll buy it and try it out… and sell if not what I was hoping… resell value is good in trad gear…as long as you get a good deal initially.

 

[Undomesticated]

Not that it matters or was the original question, but what do you suppose the fastest longbow out there is?
A short centaur or big stick?

One of the trad sites did a big longbow shoot-out a couple years in a row. Centaurs were the fastest both years running.
I'd guess they still are, though Stalker's new ACS limbs with carbon might be faster.

 

[Undomesticated]

So I’m in the market for a longbow, looking at a widow PL or Toelke Whip. I’ve found a carbon PL right at my specs but the thought of carbon limbs a longbow makes me cringe. That said I know that a crazy amount of precision goes into this “primitive” weapon. And even the wooden longbow is glass backed. But I’m just having a hard time getting passed the idea of carbon. What’s everyone else’s thoughts?

Is your hang-up the idea of carbon, or the look of it?

If it is the look, you can always paint over it, put on a real snakeskin or a limbsations-type snakeskin or wood grain sticker. Some bowyers will do wood veneers over carbon.

If it is the idea of carbon being "modern," I would say that most "trad" bows really are quite modern tools. Fiberglass is a modern material, as is the glue that is needed to adhere the laminations of a bow. Fiberglass bows weren't a thing until the 1950's; for reference the 30/06 had been around for almost half a century by that point. It is quite a stretch to consider a fiberglass laminated bow as "traditional" considering the gigantic chain of modern factories and materials necessary to get that bow into your hand.

There is a reason Nels Grumley quit Bear archery. In the Traditional Bowyers Bible, some of the authors talk about fiberglass bows like "trad" guys talk about wheel-bows. They have a point.

You just gotta pick what is OK for you. Even with modern materials, the shooting process is the same. I like my self-bows, but my ILF set-up sure is nice. I shoot them the exact same way, but the ILF is an optimum system. I took an ILF recurve on my elk hunt this year. Self-bow success is certainly more satisfying, however.

If you don't want that carbon PL, can you hook me up? I've wanted one for a while

 

[Arcus Venator]

Stability, not speed is the reason I decided to try carbon.

I have a Black Widow PSA carbon. I really like it. Quietest recurve I have shot.

I am a longbow guy to the core. Have built selfbows and shot most every longbow out there.
I am a big fan of the Sarrels Blueridge SR"s. (Five in the house currently) Have been shooting them for quite a few years.

I recently got a Sarrels Blueridge SR with carbon under green glass. 41#@28. I really like the carbon in the limbs. It is quieter, but a different sounding quiet. When shooting it feels more confident. If you understand that. I have another one coming from Sarrels that is going to be 50#@28.

I just recently got done messing around with a Centaur triple carbon. It really shot an arrow. It was quiet and the noise was much more unique, tin like, higher pitch.

I did not chrono any of the bows, so I do not have any speed data.