Listen to guides when loading for big game

[BCDJR]

I've always heard goats were dumb but now you're telling me they're up-armoring with shale in their coats. Yeah, that could complicate things.

I won't comment on the rest until you show us the video.

How many goats have you shot personally? Also you dismiss the experience of the guides the poster hunted with. Sounds like he was also sheep hunting. Do you have negative experiences with the sheep guides on your hunts in BC or NWT?

 

[IDVortex]

They do exist....


I feel like folks would not be happy if they found out that once I draw a goat tag ill be taking a 6arc on the hunt with me...

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

I’m confused….

Do we listen to the guide that says 30-can minimum for elk?

Or the guide that says 77gr TMK will kill most everything?

Neither.

Go see for yourself and report back.

 

[Chris in TN]

How many goats have you shot personally? Also you dismiss the experience of the guides the poster hunted with. Sounds like he was also sheep hunting. Do you have negative experiences with the sheep guides on your hunts in BC or NWT?

I've never shot a goat. I don't have to shoot one to know that they don't wear shale armor plates. Stop trying to employ logical fallacies. And stop putting words in my mouth - to the best of my knowledge the OP's guides aren't posting here - he is.

But if we're going to pretend that shooting a goat imparts some esoteric gnostic ballistic secrets, please do tell us about the shale armor that *your* goats were wearing.

 

[IDVortex]

This happened this year and it did not come from a guide. I know a lot of people

Yes, that is exactly what this is about. Talk to a guide get his opinion and then evaluate whether it is a trustworthy source. I have encountered both trustworthy and worthless over the years. Here is an example of what I witnessed this year on a goat hunt. A guide that I later concluded told a hunter who was there that ELDMs were not the best bullet for long range shots at goats. His theory was they came apart too quickly when they struck a goat that has a thick winter coat full of ice, shale, dirt etc. He said he had seen them fail on goats several times. THREE days later I watched that same hunter shoot a goat at a long distance with the ELDMs and he hit where it should have killed the goat easily. Broadside shot. That goat was never recovered or found. It did not knock the goat down. You can see the bullet hit on the video. It just did not work as I would have thought. Do ELDMs kill animals? Yes, lots of animals are killed with them according to folks on here. Will I use them on goats in the future? No? Are goats killed with ELDMs? I am sure some are. But, back to my point this guide earned my respect and I would pay attention to what he has to say about bullets.

I wish you could post this video. Because it is direct opposite of what a lot of goat hunters with video and shown to work.

Granted, ive never shot a goat so im just a retard. But the amount of times and research ive gone into to them. If you cant kill a goat with a eldm or eld x, its something else, not the bullet. (I/e, incorrect muzzle velocity, actually a bad shot, to long of a shot, or just talking out of ones ass about actually hitting said goat)

 

[SDHNTR]

I’m confused….

Do we listen to the guide that says 30-can minimum for elk?

Or the guide that says 77gr TMK will kill most everything?

Neither. Like most all else these days, find the truth in the middle.

 

[BCDJR]

I've never shot a goat. I don't have to shoot one to know that they don't wear shale armor plates. Stop trying to employ logical fallacies. And stop putting words in my mouth - to the best of my knowledge the OP's guides aren't posting here - he is.

But if we're going to pretend that shooting a goat imparts some esoteric gnostic ballistic secrets, please do tell us about the shale armor that *your* goats were wearing.

Oh…never shot one? How about your BC sheep hunts? Zero there as well. So you are one of those internet experts the OP said his guides talked about. By the way did you have to go to class to create that childish goat cartoon you posted?

 

[35WhelenAI]

Lil-Rokslider, you shot one? I haven't, however that post doesn't further the discussion. It's taking low-hanging fruit and making a scene.

 

[BCDJR]

Lil-Rokslider, you shot one? I haven't, however that post doesn't further the discussion. It's taking low-hanging fruit and making a scene.

Yes I have shot one. As for your other comment that is your opinion. And your comment is not furthering the discussion on guides and the personal experience of the OP.

 

[omicron1792]

I’ve now been on three guided hunts, all successful. All were top notch and I consider my guides friends now.

That said, I knew waaaay more about modern ballistics, calibers, suppressors than any of them. They all picked my brain about my rifle, ammo, etc.

It’s similar to the sports world. Great players and great coaches are rarely the same person.

 

[Rich M]

I respect guides but find them very niche. A lot of folks will take a guide’s advice and do well. Just be selective.

I took a waterfowl guide duck hunting from X. He was wanting some diff species and we put him on them. He couldnt shoot and needed help chosing when to shoot. Spent more time changing chokes out….

 

[Chris in TN]

Oh…never shot one? How about your BC sheep hunts? Zero there as well. So you are one of those internet experts the OP said his guides talked about. By the way did you have to go to class to create that childish goat cartoon you posted?

I've shots hundreds of animals. But a guy with exactly zero shots on big game could still grasp - merely through the apparent superpower of reading, without being an 'internet expert' - that goats don't have shale armor.

The OP made a ridiculous post and then doubled down and started attacking people who called him out. And you're defending him and siding with him. That's a character issue, not a lack of knowledge, and you'll never shoot enough goats to fix it.

 

[WVELK]

I've shots hundreds of animals. But a guy with exactly zero shots on big game could still grasp - merely through the apparent superpower of reading, without being an 'internet expert' - that goats don't have shale armor.

The OP made a ridiculous post and then doubled down and started attacking people who called him out. And you're defending him and siding with him. That's a character issue, not a lack of knowledge, and you'll never shoot enough goats to fix it.

Yes, Chris you are the king. You win you know all. You have killed hundreds of goats. You are the best hunter on Rockslide. We get it. Thank you for letting us live in your world. “Hundreds of animals” wow!

 

[Chris in TN]

Yes, Chris you are the king. You win you know all. You have killed hundreds of goats. You are the best hunter on Rockslide. We get it. Thank you for letting us live in your world. “Hundreds of animals” wow!

I'm not the king of anything and certainly don't know everything, but I know a strawman when I see one, and I know *why* people make strawman arguments.

So keep going. Make the thread about me. Make it about anything on earth except the video of the armored goat that was hit broadsided in the vitals at long range with an ELDM and not recovered and somehow it's the bullet's fault.

Right?

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Yes, Chris you are the king. You win you know all. You have killed hundreds of goats. You are the best hunter on Rockslide. We get it. Thank you for letting us live in your world. “Hundreds of animals” wow!

It’s interesting that you use an appeal to authority argument as the basis for this thread, stating that a guide “sees 20 animals killed in a year”.

Yet then when members who are killing that many animals per year or more, and happen to completely disagree with you based on what they’ve seen, you then get very defensive and then result to mocking.

Sad.

 

[JohnJohnson]

Yes, Chris you are the king. You win you know all. You have killed hundreds of goats. You are the best hunter on Rockslide. We get it. Thank you for letting us live in your world. “Hundreds of animals” wow!

Hey man did you get that video uploaded yet?

 

[omicron1792]

You lost me at shale armored goat…

 

[WVELK]

I've shots hundreds of animals. But a guy with exactly zero shots on big game could still grasp - merely through the apparent superpower of reading, without being an 'internet expert' - that goats don't have shale armor.

The OP made a ridiculous post and then doubled down and started attacking people who called him out. And you're defending him and siding with him. That's a character issue, not a lack of knowledge, and you'll never shoot enough goats to fix it.

Chris,

Also please accept my sincere apology for simply posting a piece that could be useful to hunters who have not shot “hundreds of animals”. If they don’t know what bullet to use, there are a lot of sources out there to assist with their learning curve. Whether you like it or not, some guides have seen a lot of big game animals killed by hunters who have not killed “hundreds of animals”. They are average everyday love to hunt guys who do not claim to know it all, or to have killed hundreds of animals. Going forward, if you just send me you cell phone via private message, I will just refer everyone that has not killed “hundreds of animals” to you and you can give them the definitive answer to all questions. Have a great day.

 

[fngTony]

I haven’t read this entire thread to know if it’s worth keeping open but the bickering needs to stop.

 

[Billy Goat]

I haven’t read this entire thread to know if it’s worth keeping open but the bickering needs to stop.

Avatar doesn't fit.