Keto and endurance type work

[InDeep]

I'm curious to hear from any one that does endurance type workouts . That is possibly doing keto. How has it worked for you. I get some mixed results online ( of course). But from a hunters stand point how have you made it work, not had it work?

 

[jorgensen.travis]

The only problems I’ve had are dehydration and cramping. It doesn’t happen very often, but it’s now something I try to stay ahead of by drinking plenty of water and adding electrolytes at times. I never had a problem of lack of energy or anything like that.


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[Coach Chris]

I've never followed a keto diet during hunting season.
I did research and development for a backcountry ski company for 8yrs. For three seasons I followed a keto diet. My endurance and recovery was solid. In fact I could break trail and ride all day long without eating or bonking.
The one thing that did suffer on a keto diet was power development. My squat and deadlift numbers stayed consistent. Cleans, sandbag shouldering, etc... really suffered. In the mountains I noticed it when I had to cross avalanche paths and other sketchy areas in a big hurry. I just had no acceleration.

As a Strength & Conditioning coach who works with world class endurance athletes I discourage my athletes from following a ketogenic diet. The consensus is studies point to a decrease in athletic performance. From my own personal experience I have to agree.

 

[Ray P]

Great info! Thanks

 

[InDeep]

Wow , thanks for the info. I have been in ketosis (55) days. D I can say so for that power output seems to have changed. But it makes up in alot of areas too. Thanks for the info

 

[npaden]

There is a guy on a running forum that I frequent that does 24 hour races (and even longer) that stays in Keto the entire time. It is unusual but it works for him. I think he set the American record last year for 24 hours for a 50+ year old with 152 miles in 24 hours. That's an average pace of 9:28 per mile for 24 hours straight.

Try it and see what works for you.

 

[IanCOLO]

I did high fat low carb last year when I was training for a couple ultras. I wasn’t super strict and just kind of dabbled until I found what seemed to work well for me. I ate low carb and high fat for breakfast and lunch and then ate whatever for supper, still sticking to mostly whole, nutrient dense foods. I did most of my training in the afternoon/evenings so I was going into training sessions with limited glycogen stores. My high intensity sessions were a challenge but my body did seem to adapt over time. Taking in carbs afterwards for recovery was a must for me. My macro tracking seemed like 30% carbs 50% fat and 20% protein was what worked best for me.

I’m slowly trying to get back to that this year but am mostly just trying to get my calories right so I don’t lose 10lbs right away this year. Hoping to stay close to the body weight I’m at until I get closer to my ultra. After I get my calories dialed I will start working on getting my macros balanced closer to what worked last year.

Doing fasted long slow workouts is a must I think. Getting your body to pull off of fat stores instead of glycogen is important no matter what kind is nutrition plan you follow.

 

[steelheadmike]

I've been doing keto with 18/6 IF for a little over a month now and I can already tell that is gonna work well for hunting season. I can lift for almost an hour, go for a 4-5 mi weighted pack hike, then walk the dog for an hour and not feel one bit hungry. I almost have to remember to eat. Where I can really see this going is not having to run a stove doing lo carb. I'm pretty happy have tuna or salami, olive oil, mac nuts, and some sort of grain free bar.

I'm going to try to do some longer 5-8 mi hikes to keep testing.

The most important thing I have found is to keep up on my electrolytes.

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[Muley_Julie]

With carb intake it's all about eating the RIGHT carbs. Your body was made to run on complex carbs and protein. It's the simple carbohydrates that will screw you over. Personally I think the keto diet sounds like a horrible idea for a long term diet but I have seen people shed a lot of weight on it. It just doesn't sound sustainable to me. My two favorite things in life are hunting and lifting weights in the gym. I make sure to get in plenty of protein but I'd be lying if I said I paid much attention to my carb intake (aside from choosing complex over simple carbs). Good luck!

 

[steelheadmike]

Got out for a long-ish hike on Sunday (8.25mi, 1300'+, 3:00, 50lb pack) and went home and did yard work for 2 hrs after that. Didnt eat anything before and didn't get hungry until later in the afternoon. I was shocked at how I was feeling after all of it: a) didn't feel the need to gnaw my arm off b) my energy level stayed pretty consistent (My feet were a little sore and I was ready to take the pack off but I wasnt EXHAUSTED).

I'm going to try to string together a couple days of extended hikes along with eating similar as I would hunting to see how it progresses.

 

[Poser]

I've never followed a keto diet during hunting season.
I did research and development for a backcountry ski company for 8yrs. For three seasons I followed a keto diet. My endurance and recovery was solid. In fact I could break trail and ride all day long without eating or bonking.
The one thing that did suffer on a keto diet was power development. My squat and deadlift numbers stayed consistent. Cleans, sandbag shouldering, etc... really suffered. In the mountains I noticed it when I had to cross avalanche paths and other sketchy areas in a big hurry. I just had no acceleration.

As a Strength & Conditioning coach who works with world class endurance athletes I discourage my athletes from following a ketogenic diet. The consensus is studies point to a decrease in athletic performance. From my own personal experience I have to agree.

Kind of similar experience when I experimented with it. It seems to be the case that it’s really hard to build or increase strength without carbs and the fuel limitations for anaerobic output, especially if you’re in a sustained anaerobic state or in and out of one for a sustained amount of time, are that you can’t burn fat fast enough to supply your body with the energy it needs in that state.

It does seem to work well for sedentary people as well as moderate effort output and I know some people, with much time and effort, are able to push the anaerobic threshold slightly, but the feeling of having no energy for anaerobic efforts is just so easily and efficiently overcome with carbs that the choice to use carbs was an obvious one for me.

Spent a good amount of time on Paleo, Keto and then Paleo + slow carbs between 2013 and 2016. My conclusion was that I need a healthy dose of fat, protein and carbs to perform and I can go longer, harder and faster on a giant bowl of oatmeal + butter with a small dose of fast carbs every hour or so and a PBJ for lunch then I can on bacon and avocado. I can appreciate the merits of not having to carry food and the idea of needing to consume less water on a sustained effort, but carbs are almost always easily available, relatively cheap, not cumbersome to carry and psychologically rewarding. Plus, you get those gainz

 

[Cedarsavage]

Take everything I say with a grain of salt. I tried it last winter. From the research I did it sounds like performance decreases for six months then PR's of up to 10% happen for elite endurance athletes. I do kind of a crossfit meets powerlifting type routine. Prior to keto I had solid mile and half mile times (under 2:30 at 250 bodyweight). After a few months those dropped substantially, I lost 17 lbs, and my strength dropped alot up to %25 in some lifts. Some days I couldn't even run a half mile. I don't think it was too do with the weight loss because I had lost over 40 before and maintained big numbers on the big lifts. My conclusions, you can't dabble in keto you have to go all in, high fat made it hard to limit calories (I'm a natural fatboy), I don't think I got enough protein to support the frequency of heavy lifting I did, I was still hungry and I think if you're repping 500lb deadlifts you're gonna be hungry regardless of if you eat fat, protein or carbs. I can't say how it would work for an endurance athlete, but I have to think it would be better than my experience. I wouldn't attempt it again unless I was willing to not slip up on a single meal for 6 plus months, since anytime I did I felt like crap for a day or two. also make sure you get plenty of electrolytes and salt or you'll feel like garbage. It makes it really hard in social situations, especially at work where sometimes you have to eat junk food to be polite.

 

[NMMuledeer777]

Haven't had any problems as long as I am properly hydrated. I usually wake up and take 5000mg of EAAs first thing with 16oz of water 1tbsp of celtic sea salt and some lemon. Able to push through morning endurance work without any issue. Then have a high fat "meal" of some kind and keep on truckin

 

[ChrisA]

The first time I went Keto was three years ago. I seemed to crash about early to mid-afternoon on. I just ran six weeks Keto again and didn't crash much at all. The only difference I can see is that I did IF and usually broke fast from 11am-noon, which would have given me energy for the remainder of the day.

Chris

 

[_raz_]

From my experience, endurance workouts & keto absolutely do mix.

Personally, I shed 20+ kilos, practiced for & ran my first marathon while on a pretty tight Keto diet. Took 18 months from decision to crossing the finishing line. I was in super shape, but being a novice marathoner, I f'd up the last days diet (carb-loading, anyone?).

I think the big thing here is conditioning, for any endurance event you need to factor in that it takes a long time to convert from a carb-burning person to a fat-burning person who's able to do high-intensity endurance stuff. The workouts can feel either horrible, or just lovely.

Later found the optimal diet to be just sticking to keto when you train and accepting the hardships (crashing on a long hike / run) every now and then. Some cheat days when you feel like it, and possibly carb-loading for one day two days before the event are just brilliant. And some sort of I don't know, honey/nut bars, Energy gels, or ecen Snickers bars for when you need that quick pick-me-up during the race itself and just in case when you're doing a long workout.