Imr 8208 xbr substitutes?

[JjamesIII]

My ar-15 loves this powder, as do I. However, my patience is over waiting for it to become available. It’s been over a year, with no encouraging signs of it becoming available anytime soon.

What are some equivalent powders that work well? I want something that is clean burning in a DI gasser, temp stable, and is fast enough to work well with 70 grain bullets out of a 16” barrel. Varget is my back up powder, but it doesn’t check the box as a clean burning powder.

 

[doverpack12]

Check out Alliant AR Comp.
I use it in 6.5 Grendel and with 77 TMK in 223 because I never could get 8208 XBR

 

[wind gypsy]

Hodgdon benchmark is one that comes to mind. It's a little faster burning. I don't know if it's "clean burning" if varget isn't for you though.

 

[JjamesIII]

Hodgdon benchmark is one that comes to mind. It's a little faster burning. I don't know if it's "clean burning" if varget isn't for you though.

I’ll look into that one. I like varget a lot for bolt guns, that and h-4350 are my go-to powders for almost everything I own. The bcg gets a lot of carbon with varget, and it’s super crunchy in a thrower for progressive reloading for turning out big batches of 5.56.

 

[hunting1]

AR Comp, W748, and TAC will be close and even maybe CFE223.

 

[FLS]

H4895

 

[JjamesIII]

AR Comp, W748, and TAC will be close and even maybe CFE223.

I considered tac- way to temp sensitive, as is w748.

H4895

that’s what I’m coming up with as well. It’s also readily available. I’m going to start load work ups with that. I haven’t tried that in a gasser. Is it cleaner than varget?

 

[Firth]

I considered tac- way to temp sensitive, as is w748.

that’s what I’m coming up with as well. It’s also readily available. I’m going to start load work ups with that. I haven’t tried that in a gasser. Is it cleaner than varget?

Is your statement on TAC just based on it being a ball powder or have you tested it? Testing from John Barsness suggests it's actually pretty good.

https://www.handloadermagazine.com/rifle-powder-temperature-sensitivity

 

[FLS]

H4895 is very clean burning and you can load almost everything with it.
Also, I shoot a bunch of TAC. I load near the top end of 556 data in my ARs and bolt guns and have had zero issues winter or summer.

 

[hunting1]

Too many people read it on the internet. I shoot from 10-100 degrees and the curve is not that much. Not sure the caliber but the powders mentioned I am using them in several calibers near max charges and it is very little the difference.

 

[SamsonMan22]

So far TAC has been the best replacement for me that is readily available. It is doing well enough that I’m not sure I will even try to find xbr unless it becomes easily available. H4895 and Ar-comp are my other picks for ideal powders with the 223 and 77tmk but they are both just as hard to get. I tried benchmark but I never could get the accuracy I was looking for with it, n135 has been ok but not as good as TAC. You might want to try TAC before you worry about the temperature stability, so far it has done well for me. Never enough change to cause problems making hits out to 600yds on 1.5-2moa targets over a wide temp range.

 

[JjamesIII]

Is your statement on TAC just based on it being a ball powder or have you tested it? Testing from John Barsness suggests it's actually pretty good.

https://www.handloadermagazine.com/rifle-powder-temperature-sensitivity

I ran across a chart showing temp sensitivities of various powders. Tac had some significant velocity variables based on temp. Most especially compared to varget and h-4350, which are amazingly stable relative to many other powders. I can only take the study at face value, for I have zero data of my own regarding tac.
I do have a lot of experience with the other two, and can say they have been very consistent with my testing via a magnito speed chrono.

 

[JjamesIII]

I ran across a chart showing temp sensitivities of various powders. Tac had some significant velocity variables based on temp. Most especially compared to varget and h-4350, which are amazingly stable relative to many other powders. I can only take the study at face value, for I have zero data of my own regarding tac.
I do have a lot of experience with the other two, and can say they have been very consistent with my testing via a magnito speed chrono.

I read that article, I agree with some of those points. At long range - barometric pressure has a lot more to do with dope than small velocity changes. I like the temp stable powders because I want to limit all the variables I have control over. I also don’t want spikes in chamber pressure from a hot AR cooking a chambered round.

The author also used an optical chrono which I find to be very inconsistent with different lighting conditions, compared to other methods of measuring velocity such as Doppler or the magneto speed. The only reason why I keep my pro Chrony around is for my archery test.
I’m not saying tac powder is garbage, I am just taking other people’s anecdotal experiences with it, and a couple of test that seemed to be valid, into account regarding the temp variability.

 

[Bulldog&Moose]

AR Comp, W748, and TAC will be close and even maybe CFE223.

Be careful with cfe223. Great powder but it's pretty sensitive to heat. I hunt in lows of 20's-30's and highs over 100. I'm switching to other powders for my 308 now because of the sensitivity.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

 

[FLS]

TAC Is a great powder in .223. I shoot it year round from the teens to the 90s without issue. Ive shout thousands of 77 SMKs over 24.5 grains of TAC in LC and Federal AE brass loaded to 2.26” out of gassers and bolt guns without issue. That load is so consistent for me I set up a Dillon 550 to load it on.

 

[Fotis]

TAC

 

[backcountryguide]

I agree with the above statements about Tac. I have not found it to be nearly as bad as the internet led me to believe. In Nevada we can have wild temp swings pretty much any time of year and it has not held my setup back.

 

[JjamesIII]

I agree with the above statements about Tac. I have not found it to be nearly as bad as the internet led me to believe. In Nevada we can have wild temp swings pretty much any time of year and it has not held my setup back.

That’s encouraging, I’m going to give TAC a run. I always sweat accuracy. But honestly, this load work up is for a compact ar with a lpvo 0-8x optic. It’s the one rifle I have not dedicated to long range work, so 1 moa is good enough for a <500 yard rifle. The only use for a 223 wylde in my opinion, three gun tacticool stuff and eastern predator hunting.

 

[FLS]

TAC was made for shooting heavies out of ARs. 77 SMK 24-24.5 Grains of TAC, SRP, loaded to 2.26” and let it eat. If you can’t find SMKs, Hornady 75gr BTHPs shoot well out my ARs. I’ve shot a bunch of both out of 1-8 twist ARs for DMR style matches and long range stages at 3 gun matches.

 

[JjamesIII]

TAC was made for shooting heavies out of ARs. 77 SMK 24-24.5 Grains of TAC, SRP, loaded to 2.26” and let it eat. If you can’t find SMKs, Hornady 75gr BTHPs shoot well out my ARs. I’ve shot a bunch of both out of 1-8 twist ARs for DMR style matches and long range stages at 3 gun matches.

I’m sending 73 eldm’s out around 2550 fps with the hogedon xbr. I’ll switch to see if it likes tac