Idaho Unit 29 Fire

[Minute_of_Antelope]

Well this isn’t good

Hayden fire burns over 3,000 acres south of Salmon

The Hayden fire has burned over 3,000 south of Salmon and northwest of Leadore. The cause of the fire is still unknown.

www.kivitv.com

 

[packgoatguy]

Looks like it doubled in size over the weekend... over 7k acres now. Definitely not good.

 

[Minute_of_Antelope]

Looks like it doubled in size over the weekend... over 7k acres now. Definitely not good.

Yeah man; hard to stay optimistic

 

[packgoatguy]

It will be interesting to see what IDFG does. The fire closure map covers a huge portion of the huntable area in the lemhi zone... either hunters will need to be able to trade in tags for other zones like the beaverheads, pioneers, or IP... or it's going to be super congested in the rest of the zone... and that can't be good for the critters.

 

[Minute_of_Antelope]

It will be interesting to see what IDFG does. The fire closure map covers a huge portion of the huntable area in the lemhi zone... either hunters will need to be able to trade in tags for other zones like the beaverheads, pioneers, or IP... or it's going to be super congested in the rest of the zone... and that can't be good for the critters.

Have they ever done such a thing?

 

[packgoatguy]

Not sure. With the moose fire last year, I think that some were able to trade in tags. A problem I would see is that the sale of the capped zone tags has already happened... so hunters who would have voluntarily picked a different zone won't have areas like the sawtooths to choose from. But it's hard to compare though... the lemhi zone has relatively few places where elk are found during the archery season... as much of the landmass is lowland sagebrush blm or private... so it forces archery Elk hunters into a relatively few main access points. But even though the Moose fire was so big last summer, I don't think it affected the archery crowd with the salmon A tag, as they can't hunt 28 in Sept anyway... and they could hunt the non burned areas of 28 in Sept... Not to mention there is a lot more huntable area in the salmon zone to begin with. Something like 83% of the landmass in the salmon zone is Forest, where only 46% of the landmass in the lemhis is forest (out of roughly 1.7m acres in each).

 

[Minute_of_Antelope]

Not sure. With the moose fire last year, I think that some were able to trade in tags. A problem I would see is that the sale of the capped zone tags has already happened... so hunters who would have voluntarily picked a different zone won't have areas like the sawtooths to choose from. But it's hard to compare though... the lemhi zone has relatively few places where elk are found during the archery season... as much of the landmass is lowland sagebrush blm or private... so it forces archery Elk hunters into a relatively few main access points. But even though the Moose fire was so big last summer, I don't think it affected the archery crowd with the salmon A tag, as they can't hunt 28 in Sept anyway... and they could hunt the non burned areas of 28 in Sept... Not to mention there is a lot more huntable area in the salmon zone to begin with. Something like 83% of the landmass in the salmon zone is Forest, where only 46% of the landmass in the lemhis is forest (out of roughly 1.7m acres in each).

Interesting. I drew the October rifle tag (This is what I get for trying a new unit ), so I’m stuck with unit 29. Thankfully I also drew Montana and my daughter has a moose tag so I can focus on those. But I think the guys that were really counting on 29 are going to be hurting. It’s not a huge unit as it is, and this fire is right in the bread basket.

 

[packgoatguy]

Yep, my thoughts exactly. I'm sure the 137 non res guys that picked up a tag in December won't be happy unless IDFG makes some sort of an accommodation...maybe they can guarantee a tag for them next year instead. At least the resident hunters can buy a Beaverhead or Pioneer tag and still have a good hunt. Heck, i bet half of these elk in 29 will cross the highway and end up in the Beaverhead zone anyway. The herd is going to suffer big time either way. My understanding of the present fire management strategy is to let it burn within a wide containment area, and hope it doesn't jump the ridges into mill creek or Morse, or heaven forbid it makes it past bear Valley. It's so hot and windy up there right now... I wouldn't be surprised if they are fighting this thing well beyond the current closure area in the next month or two.

 

[Fullfan]

Not that I know of, 2 years ago we had Salmon zone A tags. 1/2 the zone was closed due to the trail creek fire. We watched as the closed boundary roads were patrolled by the Rangers. I know someone who went into a part of the closed unit. No fire was observed by this person. Just firetrucks and fire side by side riding around. Even watched a fire crew play a game of football.

Have they ever done such a thing?

 

[stephen_seeks]

IDFG will not re-allocate, period. Fires are a part of hunting in the west.

 

[Minute_of_Antelope]

Inciweb says it grew to 14k acres yesterday. Damn.

 

[TheTone]

A full month to go before archery season and I’m sure within the fire perimeter it’s not 100% scorched earth. I’ve talked to plenty of firefighters that were seeing elk around them while they worked and I’ve been into elk inside a perimeter within days of a closure being lifted

 

[Minute_of_Antelope]

A full month to go before archery season and I’m sure within the fire perimeter it’s not 100% scorched earth. I’ve talked to plenty of firefighters that were seeing elk around them while they worked and I’ve been into elk inside a perimeter within days of a closure being lifted

Hell yeah, that’s the positivity I’m looking for

 

[packgoatguy]

A full month to go before archery season and I’m sure within the fire perimeter it’s not 100% scorched earth. I’ve talked to plenty of firefighters that were seeing elk around them while they worked and I’ve been into elk inside a perimeter within days of a closure being lifted

I hope you are right in this particular case. However, this depends on the nature of the burn and how hot the fire gets. I've been in recently burned areas where the fire got so hot that nothing was left standing, and there were huge cavities in the earth where the root balls of trees where burned under ground. On the other hand, ive seen areas where the fire passed through quickly and literally just lightly scortched every other tree. I believe it is all dependent on conditions. Unfortunately for the country where this fire is burning is seeing the perfect conditions for a very hot and very consuming fire... extremely low humidity, high winds, hot weather, and years of build up tinder, deadfall, beetle kill, and long dry grass from a wet spring to fuel it.

 

[bevance]

I hunted that area for deer in 2019, we were there late Oct. Saw 500 plus at least elk down in the lowlands of the Pahisimeroi River valleys during that time. That might be a conservative estimate. It was quite a sight. I'd always assumed that when the bullets start flying on the Oct 1 opener they head down to the private sanctuaries.

Like others said, I'd say it all depends on how hot the fire is burning. Other than that I'd bet the elk are hunkered down in the valleys or in the adjacent units.

 

[packgoatguy]

I hunted that area for deer in 2019, we were there late Oct. Saw 500 plus at least elk down in the lowlands of the Pahisimeroi River valleys during that time. That might be a conservative estimate. It was quite a sight. I'd always assumed that when the bullets start flying on the Oct 1 opener they head down to the private sanctuaries.

Like others said, I'd say it all depends on how hot the fire is burning. Other than that I'd bet the elk are hunkered down in the valleys or in the adjacent units.

There in is the problem with the lemhis... those 500 elk are down on that private from mid August on. If you drive between Gilmore and leadore you can often see those elk in broad daylight. Almost always on the Beaverhead side of the road, and always on private land. Mid archery season you will see them in the private down low along Hayden cr as well. It doesn't take the bullets flying to push them onto the private... its the hundreds (literally) of archery hunters in there all at peak rut in a relatively small area. It can get pretty frustrating to drive past a couple hundred elk, only to hike your tail off and not hear a bugle or see fresh poo for miles on public land. Those elk are a lot more mobile than others I've experienced. They have no problem moving a couple drainages over with the slightest provocation. Contrast that with areas like Island Park, and you can hunt "pressured" elk that just go up and down the same mountain when they are being chased by a dozen hunters coming in from all sides. Low at night, high up by midday, and back to the same area they began in the night before.

 

[packgoatguy]

Whether the fire burns hot enough to displace the elk isn't the real issue in my mind. It's the area closure. If I'm not mistaken, the forest service didn't lift the area closure on the moose fire last year until the end of October... not because they were fighting the fire that long, but because of potential liability to people coming in too soon in the aftermath, and the potential to further damage roads and trails and other aftermath issues. Right now the closure order for the Hayden fire goes through the end of September. They are already prepping for human evacuations and moving livestock out of the area. Too many logistical issue to wrap up in the aftermath. Will take weeks i bet. If I were a betting man... I wouldn't be buying a lemhi archery tag in expectation that I'd be able to hunt Hayden creek in September, because the closure order will still be in effect, even if most of the blaze is out.

 

[Andrew12gauge]

Have they ever done such a thing?

Residents can trade elk zones anytime before season opens for something like $3.50, nonresident might be able to switch zones if they pick a zone where the nonresident limit hasn’t been met yet I know the overall quota sold out but some of the zone quotas don’t get met due to the overall quota


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Idaboy]

Given orientation of that range and prevailing winds, it will be less likely for it to sweep SE down the whole range......not sure if there are other old scars in there where it will run out of fuel

 

[packgoatguy]

Given orientation of that range and prevailing winds, it will be less likely for it to sweep SE down the whole range......not sure if there are other old scars in there where it will run out of fuel

Lots of rocky cliffs to stop it at the top of several of the drainages, but plenty of fuel getting over from Carol to Morse, and north into kadletz, and the EF into mill creek. If it gets past kadletz, i think they will run out of natural barriers to contain it beyond bear valley and basin creek. There is an old burn from the Tobias fire, but that has long since started to grow back... still plenty of fuel in there imo. I hope they catch whoever started this debacle.