Hunting Vs "Shooting"

[lif]

Ethical is the wrong word. As posted earlier, ethics are generally personal. Culture creates ethics. And cultures vary. I don’t like long range shooting, but it is ethical as long as the shooter is efficient. I think the biggest question around long range shooting is how it is, and will, effect the hunting world. And I believe we have yet to see the answer to that question. I was recently lectured by a bow hunter about the fact that using a rifle isn’t ethical for the animal. So I think we need to all accept that there is some gray area in hunting ethics.

And I would really like to see people stop using the animal as their justification for their opinion on ethics. I’m quite certain that other than suffering a slow death, most animals are not going to Have a real strong opinion on how they would like to die. Morality and ethics are almost always personal.

 

[ttucci16]

What is it with everyone trying to force their opinions on everyone else?

Not sure what's setting everyone off on the few guys who do long range shooting but the internet is a funny machine. Maybe just not watch the self proclaimed experts and their antics?

I don't shoot long ranges but have no problem w guys and gals who do.

Not set off really. More concerned about how many deer/elk i see being gut shot, and how that has the possibility of rubbing off onto people who either don't hunt, or people that want to get into hunting and are disgusted by those ethics. In my opinion getting in close is hunting. To each their own.

 

[ttucci16]

Ethical is the wrong word. As posted earlier, ethics are generally personal. Culture creates ethics. And cultures vary. I don’t like long range shooting, but it is ethical as long as the shooter is efficient. I think the biggest question around long range shooting is how it is, and will, effect the hunting world. And I believe we have yet to see the answer to that question. I was recently lectured by a bow hunter about the fact that using a rifle isn’t ethical for the animal. So I think we need to all accept that there is some gray area in hunting ethics.

And I would really like to see people stop using the animal as their justification for their opinion on ethics. I’m quite certain that other than suffering a slow death, most animals are not going to Have a real strong opinion on how they would like to die. Morality and ethics are almost always personal.

I think you make a fair point. I wonder if there will ever be a time where states possibly change their "fair chase" rules and define a yardage that gives the animal a "fair" chance. That question is what I'm trying to get at with thia discussion.

 

[30338]

I get a lot of calls from people wanting me to track archery wounded deer and elk with my dog. That is a short range proposition, probably close to what you call hunting vs shooting. I think the world has enough Karens in it. I'll hunt my way, you hunt yours.

 

[realunlucky]

Not set off really. More concerned about how many deer/elk i see being gut shot, and how that has the possibility of rubbing off onto people who either don't hunt, or people that want to get into hunting and are disgusted by those ethics. In my opinion getting in close is hunting. To each their own.

If getting close is what makes hunting, why you flinging them at 350? Why haven't you set your personal limit lower?

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[ttucci16]

I get a lot of calls from people wanting me to track archery wounded deer and elk with my dog. That is a short range proposition, probably close to what you call hunting vs shooting. I think the world has enough Karens in it. I'll hunt my way, you hunt yours.

Lmao. Solid on the karen jab. No worries. What kind of wound loss are you looking at? Percentage wise how often are you recovering the animal?

 

[ttucci16]

If getting close is what makes hunting, why you flinging them at 350? Why haven't you set your personal limit lower?

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350 is just my personal fair chase limit. I think 350 is where i feel the animal has just as much of an advantage as i do. They can smell me, see me, etc. Never had to shoot over 159 yards at mule deer or elk. My fair chase limit is where my ethical limit meets which is why i call it at 350.

 

[robtattoo]

I used to be a traditional bow only guy. Frequent a couple of forums where ethics was constantly brought up & discussed ad nauseum & I came to a conclusion:
My ethics are mine. Yours are yours. You don't get a say in mine, I don't get a say in yours. Neither of us is wrong.

Saved me a whole hell of a lot of arguments once I pinned that down.......

 

[ttucci16]

I used to be a traditional bow only guy. Frequent a couple of forums where ethics was constantly brought up & discussed ad nauseum & I came to a conclusion:
My ethics are mine. Yours are yours. You don't get a say in mine, I don't get a say in yours. Neither of us is wrong.

Saved me a whole hell of a lot of arguments once I pinned that down.......

Im behind you all the way. I probably should've worded it more towards fair chase instead of the ethics of it all.

 

[Kimber7man]

I think you make a fair point. I wonder if there will ever be a time where states possibly change their "fair chase" rules and define a yardage that gives the animal a "fair" chance. That question is what I'm trying to get at with thia discussion.

So you start off by blasting a ton of hunters, calling us lazy, unethical and an embarrassment. Then you ask for a civil discussion. Then you talk about “fair chase” and a “fair” chance. Well, you had your fair chance and you blew it. Everyone can see your backpedaling now.

 

[sndmn11]

Is the lazy limit 350 horizontal or line of sight?

 

[Kimber7man]

Is the lazy limit 350 horizontal or line of sight?

If you can’t use a rangefinder because its not “fair chase” how will you know if it’s 350 yards?

 

[mtnwrunner]

As I said earlier, these threads don't end well. And we are only at 4 pages.

Randy

 

[Logan80]

Im behind you all the way. I probably should've worded it more towards fair chase instead of the ethics of it all.

I think being a WA hunter also may influence your idea of what's fair and reasonable.

I live in Western WA. Any shot where I hunt that's over 100 yards would be pretty rare. I mean, if you sat on a clearing you might get a couple hundred yards, but most of the places I find myself are 20-80 yards tops.

I could see how someone that experiences the type of terrain I hunt in would see 800 yards as insane, since it's unimaginable in my environment. For people that grew up hunting in places where those ranges are far more common, it's not at all weird to think about....

 

[sndmn11]

If you can’t use a rangefinder because its not “fair chase” how will you know if it’s 350 yards?

I can't use a rangefinder to be ethical either? This is getting fo-real!

 

[TK-421]

 

[ttucci16]

So you start off by blasting a ton of hunters, calling us lazy, unethical and an embarrassment. Then you ask for a civil discussion. Then you talk about “fair chase” and a “fair” chance. Well, you had your fair chance and you blew it. Everyone can see your backpedaling now.

Im guessing you're a part of thr long range crowd because you used "us". You obviously want to argue instead of explaining why I'm wrong. Either add some substance or move along.

 

[ttucci16]

Is the lazy limit 350 horizontal or line of sight?

Haha. Im go with 350 of vertical since im in WA state.

 

[ttucci16]

I think being a WA hunter also may influence your idea of what's fair and reasonable.

I live in Western WA. Any shot where I hunt that's over 100 yards would be pretty rare. I mean, if you sat on a clearing you might get a couple hundred yards, but most of the places I find myself are 20-80 yards tops.

I could see how someone that experiences the type of terrain I hunt in would see 800 yards as insane, since it's unimaginable in my environment. For people that grew up hunting in places where those ranges are far more common, it's not at all weird to think about....

Im hunting eastern WA. I live in western, but really don't like hunting the western side. I'm 100 percent spot and stalk, so im usually up in the alpine or the lower eastern slope of the cascades or blue mountains with miles of open terrain.

 

[Marble]

Man oh man some opinions here....

Some real knowledgeable and some well...

I dont like to tell someone else what is and isn't ethical when it comes to cartridges and distances. If I get asked then I'll let them know what I think. IME, those that I have known that can shoot really far put a lot of time, money and effort into it. And the same goes for guys that can get close.

I'm an equal opportunity killer. Last year I killed my buck at 650. Shot him twice.

This year, 45 yards sleeping in his bed.

Seems like the OP doesn't know what he doesn't know. With all due respect...

And to think an elk can't hear, see or smell you at 350 yards....

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