Howa Mini 6 Dasher

[Tanner]

That’ll do donkey, that’ll do!

 

[UnckleBob]

Very nice

 

[MTNGUY]

Do you have any plans to try out the Jefferson Bottom metal? I am thinking about doing this to my Howa Mini, but I have a Jefferson Bottom metal in mine currently.

 

[KyleR1985]

Do you have any plans to try out the Jefferson Bottom metal? I am thinking about doing this to my Howa Mini, but I have a Jefferson Bottom metal in mine currently.

Yes.

I’m waiting on him to build mag box and follower. He’s waiting on material supplier. Soon as it’s done I’m paying him and he’s shipping it. I think!

I currently have his metal for factory mags installed and it’s working great on the dasher.

I have the oregunsmith metal with the Jefferson mag box and follower for .223. The box is too narrow so only two dasher rounds fit, and the geometry and spring doesn’t work together to feed dasher.

Hopefully he can make one work for me - I’m pretty sure he can make a box to fit 3 rounds. I can only fit 4 in factory mag, so this would be my preferred way to go.

 

[KyleR1985]

Do you have any plans to try out the Jefferson Bottom metal? I am thinking about doing this to my Howa Mini, but I have a Jefferson Bottom metal in mine currently.

Also, to be more clear - he can definitely make a hinged metal work with two rounds. It’s really just being able to fit 3 (or 4, maybe I am measuring wrong) in the mag box that is the unknown to me right now.

I suspect I’ll have something from him in the next couple of weeks.

 

[KyleR1985]

Have around 70 loaded up for next range trip. Some 2nd firing, some more virgin brass.

Jefferson outdoor hinged metal with first draft of dasher box and follower on the way should be here Saturday if no delays.

Looks like the 95tmk’s hit the lands around 2.375” OAL. Have some loaded from 2.3-2.6 to see what shoots best.

I’ll be verifying the good 108 eldm load that shot .68 first time around too.

Some of both over Lever as well to look at velocity.

After chatting with @83cj-7 about success with the 87Vmax, I’m looking to see if I can develop a really low/slow load with those for this gun. May end up being a good option for the close quarters whitetail work I usually do. Want to see if I can get it shooting well down around 2600-2700MV.

Thinking this will be a very versatile low recoil hunting rifle, that I can take to distance if I can find the time to shoot enough to be comfortable.

The cartridge seems to be really simple to load for. And the gun is pretty great so far too. I think the hinged metal Will make it an easier one to carry huntjng.

 

[KyleR1985]

Managed to pack gun with me to Utah for a work trip and got to range for an afternoon.

Lever added about 40fps to the 108’s over Varget, and still printed 7 under an inch at 100yds, with two different primers (cci41 and f205)

I think I can count on the 108’s being a great option out of this gun with either powder.




With the 95TMK’s, my first shot was almost off paper. I dialed windage to adjust, then shot 4. 3 shots were inside 1/2”, and I was getting really excited then the last shot was about an inch low of that group. Looked at chrono and it was 40fps slower than the slowest of the other 4 shots. If I take that round out, 2925fps avg. heavy bolt lift though. I had a slower load (2800fps) that shot 5 right at an inch, no sign of pressure, at a shorter OAL. I’m going to have to play with the TMK a little more and find right seating depth and speed. Will probably land around 2850fps by the looks of it. Hoping I can get this one to fly right - just may take a little extra work.

Slow load with 87vmax at 2700fps shot under an inch too. Thinking this will be a good option for 0-200 yard work which is most of my whitetail hunting. And save barrel and powder!


I shot 70 rounds or so, pretty much every load I tried was under 1.5moa for 3 or 5. I didn’t see any change in precision as barrel got smoking hot - all rounds were fired in about an hour, maybe 1:15. So my bedding job must have been somewhat successful.


I had a lot of heavy bolt lift across loads I would have assumed to be middle of the road. I was half doing load development, half getting fire formed brass.


I think there’s a good chance of having the 108’s at 2700-2750, 95’s at 2800-2850, and 87’s at either 2700 or 3000 or both, all around 1moa for 10 at the end of next round of shooting.

I’ll load up a bunch once I’m there and go try to get some distance shooting in.


this gun is fun as hell to shoot.

 

[KyleR1985]

Goal was under 7.5lbs scoped and suppressed, 2800fps with 95tmk , 2700 with 108Eldm.

16” barrel, SWFA 3x9, DD Wolfhunter, Stocky’s VG, and four rounds came in at 7lbs 4oz.

I made my own recoil pad out of 3 layers of boat decking to shave an ounce, at same LOP as the standard stockys pad. However, I’m 4 ounces under weight, and need an extra inch or more of LOP.

I’m going to buy or make a spacer to give me what I need thay doesn’t add too much weight.


Had to do a little polishing on bolt face, I was shaving brass - this may have been the culprit of some of the heavy bolt lift last trip to the range. Got that cleaned up, broke rifle down and cleaned all parts im supposed to.

I also need to upgrade scope rings which will likely add an ounce or two.

Rifle balances at or just in front of the front action screw.

Hoping to have one more range session for load development in the next week or two, then loading up a couple hundred to start having fun with it!

 

[MEdude]

@KyleR1985
FYI… I don’t have anything valuable to add, but have been following this thread from early on.
I do have a mini in .223 & 6 ARC… Eager to see differences between the ARC & your Dasher.
Genuinely appreciate how you are sharing your journey. Perhaps I’ll get to follow this path in the future.
Thanks.

 

[KyleR1985]

@KyleR1985
FYI… I don’t have anything valuable to add, but have been following this thread from early on.
I do have a mini in .223 & 6 ARC… Eager to see differences between the ARC & your Dasher.
Genuinely appreciate how you are sharing your journey. Perhaps I’ll get to follow this path in the future.
Thanks.

I’m getting 22” barrel ARC speeds in 16” dasher barrel. Maybe as much as 50fps more if/when this barrel speeds up. I’m approaching 100 rounds now. Without having to press on the gas too much with max loads to do it.

That was the conservative goal - get a 500 yard 16” barrel with as little recoil as possible.

32gr Varget 108Eldm is a “what a pro uses” type load - and it shot 2700 and sub moa. Lever added 50fps and it was still sub moa.

I can’t wait to shoot it with the wolfhunter.

 

[MEdude]

Thanks for the very direct comparison. That is the exact relationship I was looking to define.

 

[KyleR1985]

Shaved another half ounce at the expense of one round in an unmodified 6ARC mag(3vs4).

I’m not sure the Jefferson hinged metal is going to work. If it did, it would only hold 3 at best, possibly only 2. Will run it to ground, but not hopeful.

So in the meantime, I compromised and cut off bottom of mag, modified follower and bottom spring plate, and fit 3 that seem to feed just fine with limited testing.

I also slowly sanded the bottom plate where it now interferes with the bottom metal and doesn’t allow it to catch. I went very slow, so that once it caught, I just sanded a little bit more. This keeps the mag from being loose in the bottom metal. Big improvement on feel and look of rifle in my opinion.

 

[Stocky]

Shaved another half ounce at the expense of one round in an unmodified 6ARC mag(3vs4).

I’m not sure the Jefferson hinged metal is going to work. If it did, it would only hold 3 at best, possibly only 2. Will run it to ground, but not hopeful.

So in the meantime, I compromised and cut off bottom of mag, modified follower and bottom spring plate, and fit 3 that seem to feed just fine with limited testing.

I also slowly sanded the bottom plate where it now interferes with the bottom metal and doesn’t allow it to catch. I went very slow, so that once it caught, I just sanded a little bit more. This keeps the mag from being loose in the bottom metal. Big improvement on feel and look of rifle in my opinion.

View attachment 874070View attachment 874071View attachment 874072

The jeffersons magazine is wider than factory (as its in line with the factory bottom metal walls not the factory magazine walls so is about 3mm a side wider) and is a true double stack. The 223 one easily holds 6 rounds when completely flush vs 5 in the cut down factory that sticks down 15- 20mm. I'd be shocked if it didnt match the capacity of your cut down magazine even in the dasher. You may actually get more as the 223 mag insert has ribs to make it narrower to hold the rounds in more for feeding.

Look at a 10 round aics vs AW mag and you see how much of a difference double stack makes

 

[KyleR1985]

The jeffersons magazine is wider than factory (as its in line with the factory bottom metal walls not the factory magazine walls so is about 3mm a side wider) and is a true double stack. The 223 one easily holds 6 rounds when completely flush vs 5 in the cut down factory that sticks down 15- 20mm. I'd be shocked if it didnt match the capacity of your cut down magazine even in the dasher. You may actually get more as the 223 mag insert has ribs to make it narrower to hold the rounds in more for feeding.

Look at a 10 round aics vs AW mag and you see how much of a difference double stack makes

I bought a hinged 6ARC metal from Jefferson’s. He built a dasher follower to with it.

3 rounds puts that spring in a major bind. It double feeds every time. With 2 or 3 in the mag box.

My last email with Chris indicated that he doesn’t think we can make it work.


It would require a much softer spring, and a completely different mag box.


I’m stuck at eating 200.00 to try and modify spring and mag box myself, or taking him up on returning it.

 

[Stocky]

I bought a hinged 6ARC metal from Jefferson’s. He built a dasher follower to with it.

3 rounds puts that spring in a major bind. It double feeds every time. With 2 or 3 in the mag box.

My last email with Chris indicated that he doesn’t think we can make it work.


It would require a much softer spring, and a completely different mag box.


I’m stuck at eating 200.00 to try and modify spring and mag box myself, or taking him up on returning it.

That's rough a wider mag box alone might solve it how thin are the side walls currently? If it was in NZ I'd say I'd make you up a mag box for free to try. Could try have one folded from sheet metal or fold one roughly yourself. They can be pretty low tech to test function. I just did this for a Kimber to make up a way to convert a hunter. I also made a thinned the follower for my kimber hunter mag to give more room for spring compression in my faulty mag (the originals were extremely tight with 3 rounds).

I hate to say it but the kimbers apart from after market availability are better for this type of build (308 bolt face) as they are lighter than a mini. Have a factory bolt face and the extended action length is all behind the magazine from a shorter rear bridge so total rifle packages is smaller. It's a shame that there's not good stock options available.

I keep wishing my 223 howa mini was just a bit nicer. But 223 kimbers are very rare here in NZ and have a shit twist.

 

[KyleR1985]

That's rough a wider mag box alone might solve it how thin are the side walls currently? If it was in NZ I'd say I'd make you up a mag box for free to try. Could try have one folded from sheet metal or fold one roughly yourself. They can be pretty low tech to test function. I just did this for a Kimber to make up a way to convert a hunter. I also made a thinned the follower for my kimber hunter mag to give more room for spring compression in my faulty mag (the originals were extremely tight with 3 rounds).

I hate to say it but the kimbers apart from after market availability are better for this type of build (308 bolt face) as they are lighter than a mini. Have a factory bolt face and the extended action length is all behind the magazine from a shorter rear bridge so total rifle packages is smaller. It's a shame that there's not good stock options available.

I keep wishing my 223 howa mini was just a bit nicer. But 223 kimbers are very rare here in NZ and have a shit twist.

Is this a good time to tell you I sold a Kimber 84m 7mm-08, right before building this gun?

Come to think of it, I sold it to the guy who did the chamber work. Hey @Bert01 was this your evil plan all along?!

 

[KyleR1985]

The jeffersons magazine is wider than factory (as its in line with the factory bottom metal walls not the factory magazine walls so is about 3mm a side wider) and is a true double stack. The 223 one easily holds 6 rounds when completely flush vs 5 in the cut down factory that sticks down 15- 20mm. I'd be shocked if it didnt match the capacity of your cut down magazine even in the dasher. You may actually get more as the 223 mag insert has ribs to make it narrower to hold the rounds in more for feeding.

Look at a 10 round aics vs AW mag and you see how much of a difference double stack makes

Also, legacy the importer for Howa in US has 450 bushmaster bolts for the mini in stock. So factory bolt is no problem. If you’re willing to ship it to an FFL - they won’t sell to someone on the street.

 

[Stocky]

Also, legacy the importer for Howa in US has 450 bushmaster bolts for the mini in stock. So factory bolt is no problem. If you’re willing to ship it to an FFL - they won’t sell to someone on the street.

Yeh bolt face was more an issue for the Kimber to go smaller rather than larger with howa

 

[Te Hopo]

That's rough a wider mag box alone might solve it how thin are the side walls currently? If it was in NZ I'd say I'd make you up a mag box for free to try. Could try have one folded from sheet metal or fold one roughly yourself. They can be pretty low tech to test function. I just did this for a Kimber to make up a way to convert a hunter. I also made a thinned the follower for my kimber hunter mag to give more room for spring compression in my faulty mag (the originals were extremely tight with 3 rounds).

I hate to say it but the kimbers apart from after market availability are better for this type of build (308 bolt face) as they are lighter than a mini. Have a factory bolt face and the extended action length is all behind the magazine from a shorter rear bridge so total rifle packages is smaller. It's a shame that there's not good stock options available.

I keep wishing my 223 howa mini was just a bit nicer. But 223 kimbers are very rare here in NZ and have a shit twist.

Chris Murphy did a tidy job of bushing a Christianson Arms 308 bolt down to 223 for a mate of mine.
Wonder how hard it'd be to rework a Kimber, I guess the extractor would be the big issue?

 

[KyleR1985]

Out of Varget, so I loaded up 20 rounds of 95tmk, 108eldm, 87vmax over Lever.

No matter what i do the 108’s seem to shoot sub moa.

I can’t get the TMKs to behave. I may stop messing with them and just roll with the 108’s and make the gun happy.