How Old Was He Really?! Big Buck Hunters Talk Age vs. Score

[rafiki]

is travis gonna drop the pic of his buck with the "extra point"?

 

[robby denning]

is travis gonna drop the pic of his buck with the "extra point"?

lol! I've been trying for months. hahahahahah it's epic

 

[fatlander]

Deer aren’t different than people or any other animal. Some people hit huge growth spurts young, then never amount to much more. Most people hit their big growth spurt in early to mid teenage years. Some people hit huge growth spurts in college. And everything declines if it lives long enough, some decline early than others.

For the part of the world I live in, I’ve been incredibly blessed to kill some phenomenal deer. I’ve got multiples of what people around here call a “buck of a lifetime”, and the biggest deer on my wall is a 3 year old. To boot the biggest deer I’ve ever hunted was also a 3 year old when he died.


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[idelkslayer]

I probably could/should put that in there. I do it with the Wyoming data. I know that about 80% of these samples were basically OTC/General hunts, or 1-3 point units in Colorado. For example, only 2 of my 11 were from controlled/hard-to-draw areas.

@robby denning how many bucks in yours were from controlled hunts?

I figured the majority were OTC or low point tags. I appreciate this follow up.

Because some came from other states that limit NR but are open to residents, it's it's easier to say that of the five that were 200+, 4 came from 2pt or less/OTC units. One came from a 9 point unit (but I still hunted in secure country--not the heavily roaded stuff that is everywhere in the unit).

of the other 22 or so, it's about the same-- leaning toward OTC/less than 2pt or 25-50% odds.

three or so came from private property in OTC units, so not sure how to count them.

so I'll leave this at what I indicated in the episode: the good draws are 5-10% odds now (much less for the premo's) so just growing bucks I can't hunt isn't my preference. I just need to hunt where there is some security/balanced with getting a tag

Thank you both for responding and to Robby's point it becomes difficult to make strong correlations due to all the variables between public/private land, OTC for residents vs Controlled for NR.

I tend to support maintaining as much OTC opportunity as possible. Age data is emerging more an more as a data set that will help us understand how hunting pressure and management decisions affect the age demographics in our herds.

Fun podcast, and agree. For the individual hunter, getting age data is a fun extension of the hunt.

 

[WYHuntFishTrap]

After listening to the podcast, it’s really made me wish I knew about tooth aging sooner. I shot this buck about 3 years ago and know I’ll be haunted about not aging him. Heavy bases, split ear, blind in one eye, and was basically skin and bones at the end. I’ll throw up a pic of his molars but know that obviously doesn’t show much. View attachment 1030691View attachment 1030692

Ancient! 10+ year old. From what I understand after about 8 or so it's hard to tell for sure as they are just all worn out.

 

[Big Sky Guy]

After listening to the podcast, it’s really made me wish I knew about tooth aging sooner. I shot this buck about 3 years ago and know I’ll be haunted about not aging him. Heavy bases, split ear, blind in one eye, and was basically skin and bones at the end. I’ll throw up a pic of his molars but know that obviously doesn’t show much.

If you euro mounted him you can pull a premolar or molar and send in. We've done this on some dead heads we've found. Generally expected to be less accurate but will still be able to give you an age.

 

[graniteghost]

If you euro mounted him you can pull a premolar or molar and send in. We've done this on some dead heads we've found. Generally expected to be less accurate but will still be able to give you an age.

I actually ended up shoulder mounting him because he was such a cool unique buck. Wish I had euro mounted him sometimes so it was easier to play with the antlers lol

 

[idelkslayer]

Is it more impressive to kill an 8.5+ year old 150" buck that has seen it all or a 180+" 3.5 year old?

Tooth data definitely taught me how little I actually knew about aging deer. Antlers, body size, face shape, etc...all a crap shoot

This is a great question. Strong case to be made for the 8.5 year old 150" buck. Others might argue that buck only made it to 8.5 because he was passed up all his life for trending small in antler size. I tend to think that 90% of hunters wouldn't pass on a 150" buck though.

I know sheep hunters often prioritize age over trophy quality. Choosing to shoot an older ram with broomed horns if given the choice over a younger full curl ram.

Sadly mule deer don't have reliable external indicators of age. I just started aging deer last year on a 166" buck. Knowing he aged 6.5 years elevated the quality of that buck in my mind.

 

[ianpadron]

In general, I believe that to be true. On average for age, our bucks in MT are smaller antler wise
just based on the variability of nutrition. I think the entries into B&C bares this out as well.

Also, @Jaden Bales run that chart with the median age!

I dont buy into this notion, but I'm glad thats what guys seem to think about MT haha

 

[S.Clancy]

I dont buy into this notion, but I'm glad thats what guys seem to think about MT haha

I'm basing this on what I've seen and # of entries into B&C:

MT- 180 total (typical + non-typical)
CO- 1227 total
AZ- 225 total
ID- 544 total
NV- 166 total
NM- 257 total
WY- 331 total

MT is slightly (deer population) behind CO and about the same as ID. The rest of the states have deer pops quite a bit below MT.

 

[RockAndSage]

I'm basing this on what I've seen and # of entries into B&C:

MT- 180 total (typical + non-typical)
CO- 1227 total
AZ- 225 total
ID- 544 total
NV- 166 total
NM- 257 total
WY- 331 total

MT is slightly (deer population) behind CO and about the same as ID. The rest of the states have deer pops quite a bit below MT.

That's pretty surprising there are more MT B&C entries, than Nevada. Wondering if that's just a numbers thing, related more to total deer available to hunt each year?

 

[S.Clancy]

That's pretty surprising there are more MT B&C entries, than Nevada. Wondering if that's just a numbers thing, related more to total deer available to hunt each year?

It's a number thing. Even at the hey-day of NV populations it was like 60% of MT, now days more like 30%.

 

[horniac]

Thanks for putting the podcast together. I really enjoyed it as I have been lab aging all my group's animals (elk, deer, antelope) for the last 3 years.

I have been using a different lab however to age our deer and elk and they always give the results in 1/2 years i.e. 3 1/2, 4 1/2, etc. Based on your spreadsheet I am assuming Matson is giving you the results in whole numbers so if you have a deer listed as 3 that deer is actually 3 1/2 as opposed to 2 1/2 is that correct?

Also, I don't know if you guys have tried this but I have been taking a photo of the lower jaw and downloading it to ChatGPT for instant analysis. ChatGPT was right on what the lab results on 2 of the bucks killed. It was off by 1 year on one of the bucks and 2 years on the other. Small sample size of only 4 bucks though that I tried it on but I will continue trying it on our deer this year...

Horniac

 

[idelkslayer]

Thanks for putting the podcast together. I really enjoyed it as I have been lab aging all my group's animals (elk, deer, antelope) for the last 3 years.

I have been using a different lab however to age our deer and elk and they always give the results in 1/2 years i.e. 3 1/2, 4 1/2, etc. Based on your spreadsheet I am assuming Matson is giving you the results in whole numbers so if you have a deer listed as 3 that deer is actually 3 1/2 as opposed to 2 1/2 is that correct?

Also, I don't know if you guys have tried this but I have been taking a photo of the lower jaw and downloading it to ChatGPT for instant analysis. ChatGPT was right on what the lab results on 2 of the bucks killed. It was off by 1 year on one of the bucks and 2 years on the other. Small sample size of only 4 bucks though that I tried it on but I will continue trying it on our deer this year...

Horniac

Matson's gives the ages in half years as well. I think it was just easier to talk about by using whole numbers.

 

[robby denning]

Matson's gives the ages in half years as well. I think it was just easier to talk about by using whole numbers.

it was. I quit telling people I was Age+1/2 year when I was about 6, lol.

Jaden clarified in the episode the 1/2 year was dropped.

We're not statisticians, so not sure if that'd sway the numbers above adding it back in? Episode was designed to just give an estimate/share trends

I'm not even sure some of my buck's scores because I haven't measured them all...just estimates.