How many?

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Dec 31, 2021
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Western Montana
Every year around new years, I clean all my guns, sort all my tools and do an inventory of ammo on hand. I like to reload but this year I look at my inventory and I have a couple hundred shells for each caliber. I live in a low humidity environment and have cool, dry storage but some shells are coming up on 10-15 years.

I've never seen a failure to fire but I'm curious. What do you folks do?
 
I have gone from hoarding for a rainy day to aggressively shooting older stuff and trying to maintain a smaller, but reasonably fresh inventory.

I started this after I had issues with good factory ammo stored in original packaging and sealed ammo cans show degradation after sitting around for 20+ years. The ammo appeared fine externally, but each time I fired it, the ammo was wildly unstable and split the cases. I still have a lot of older ammo, but I am working through it as well as I can. It’s a balancing act between being prepared for the next shortage and having ammo on which I can rely. It doesn’t do any good to have 20k rounds on hand if you can’t rely on it if you need it.

This generally means that I buy ammo more frequently, but in smaller quantities than in the past.
 
I shot some 30.06 hot game reloads that were 42 years old this year. They still go exactly where they are pointed. I had one split case but it was clearly used a few times. This was at the range out of my 50 year old Interarms Mark X Mauser.
 
Temperature and humidity are the demons that ammunition (and powder & primers) doesn't like. I have shot ammunition I have loaded over 20 years ago with no problem. I have had problems with old rimfire ammo that didn't fire. I store my ammunition, powder & primers in an airconditioned building.
 
I still have Greek 8mm ammo from 1940 and Yugo from 1942. Still seems fine but I certainly wear eye protection while shooting it.
I have had a pound of powder bulge and smell rancid / ammonia like that was less than 20 years old.
 
A few weeks ago I shot some really old turkey loads in my 12ga. These were "old" shells my dad had when I was a kid and I'll be 37 a in a few weeks. I was just kind of tired of looking at them in my ammo tote.

I had just replaced the carrier spring from my other thread and wanted to see how she cycled so I pulled the plug out of the magazine and loaded them up. Then, I proceeded to run it as fast as possible.

My lady was at the range with me and said "that looked like it hurt" and it did, but they all went off flawlessly.

I've also been working through a few similarly ancient boxes of .243 with no issues.
 
I have gone from hoarding for a rainy day to aggressively shooting older stuff and trying to maintain a smaller, but reasonably fresh inventory.

I started this after I had issues with good factory ammo stored in original packaging and sealed ammo cans show degradation after sitting around for 20+ years. The ammo appeared fine externally, but each time I fired it, the ammo was wildly unstable and split the cases. I still have a lot of older ammo, but I am working through it as well as I can. It’s a balancing act between being prepared for the next shortage and having ammo on which I can rely. It doesn’t do any good to have 20k rounds on hand if you can’t rely on it if you need it.

This generally means that I buy ammo more frequently, but in smaller quantities than in the past.

I saw you mention this in another post awhile back, with 30-30 ammo, IIRC, and have been wondering about it. Because it's extremely anomalous, especially if it happened with a bunch of stuff, or more than a few different boxes. And I fully believe your account - I'm just really scratching my head about why it happened.

DOD did studies on ammo storage, multiple times over decades, and found that as long as small-arms ammo is stored in a cool, dry place, it lasts, quote, "indefinitely". When I was a kid, friends of mine and I actively hunted down the oldest ammo we could find, between gun shows, garage sales, and our dads' stashes. We shot stuff that was pre-WWI, and it went bang, reliably. Every once in a very, very long while there would be a dead primer, but I want to say it was less than 3 times, between all of us. But we never had any split cases. The only time we did have problems with any ammo, was paper-hulled shotgun shells. It was common for them to be hit or miss in going bang, reliably. The only asterisk is that we lived in the high desert, so it's dry here. But, that doesn't mean the ammo was always here, and this part of the country swings from sub-zero to 100F over the year, commonly.

The only time I've personally seen ammo "go bad", is when it's been left in the sun in a window, like on a work bench or the like, out in a shop. Meaning, extreme heat and cold swings over the course of a year or so, plus sunlight.

The only time I can recall anything similar to what you're sharing, is a DOD study on what happens to ammo when it gets heated. Can't recall if they did multiple cycles, but they did heat ammo up, and, again, IIRC, to decrease its humidity. And at some point, guns started blowing up. The ammo ignited fine, but with less humidity and/or changes in the propellant, the cartridges just started detonating actions.

So what you're experiencing is a big, anomalous mystery to me, and I'm extremely curious about it. The only things that come to mind are possibly that the ammo got heated, the ammo was severely desiccated from desiccants, or something was wrong with it from the factory. Even the desiccant thing is pure conjecture and speculation, as I'd suspect it would take cycling desiccants out over years to decrease humidity that much in powder for it to detonate. Can't think of any other variables or possibilities, based on what you've described though. But I would very much like to figure out what might have happened.

Was this just one box of 30-30, or did it happen with a bunch of other stuff?
 
Every year around new years, I clean all my guns, sort all my tools and do an inventory of ammo on hand. I like to reload but this year I look at my inventory and I have a couple hundred shells for each caliber. I live in a low humidity environment and have cool, dry storage but some shells are coming up on 10-15 years.

I've never seen a failure to fire but I'm curious. What do you folks do?

My personal experience, research, and perspective are basically that ammo just doesn't go bad, unless it's stored in really wonky, extreme environments. The only point of hesitation would be unsealed shotgun shells stored in the open. But I just shot up a bunch that had been missmatched randos accumulated by family over decades after each season, as partial boxes that just got dumped in ammo cans, and they all fired fine. Might be different if I lived in a swamp, but in the Great Basin, all good. I wouldn't hesitate to rely on 15 year-old ammo properly stored, it's practically new. In the 1990s I was firing mil 7.62 ammo by the pallet made in the 1970s.
 
Every year around new years, I clean all my guns, sort all my tools and do an inventory of ammo on hand. I like to reload but this year I look at my inventory and I have a couple hundred shells for each caliber. I live in a low humidity environment and have cool, dry storage but some shells are coming up on 10-15 years.

I've never seen a failure to fire but I'm curious. What do you folks do?
I think if they are stored properly, you should be fine. I have been shooting some of grandpas paper shotgun shells and 270 loads from the 60’s and 70’s. Haven’t had a failure yet. They were stored inside the house.
 
Blasting and emergency ammo? I'm fine with indefinite storage given good conditions. I've shot ammo older than I am (50) and regularly reload with canister powders that are older than me. Not for precision rifle, mind you, but I absolutely still use *olllllldddddd* powders for shotgun and handgun loads, after careful initial testing was done when I first picked them up.

Practice ammo? Maybe 10 years.

Hunting/precision ammo? Hunt with it the year it was loaded, if possible. I've broken that rule badly with no ill effects, though.
 
I bought a cpl hundred hand loaded rounds of ammo several years ago, and a whole lot of them were cold welded so bad I could barely get the bullet out. I now use dry lube on the bullet and only load what I'll shoot within a cpl weeks. No idea how old nor the conditions they were kept in.
 
I saw you mention this in another post awhile back, with 30-30 ammo, IIRC, and have been wondering about it. Because it's extremely anomalous, especially if it happened with a bunch of stuff, or more than a few different boxes. And I fully believe your account - I'm just really scratching my head about why it happened.

DOD did studies on ammo storage, multiple times over decades, and found that as long as small-arms ammo is stored in a cool, dry place, it lasts, quote, "indefinitely". When I was a kid, friends of mine and I actively hunted down the oldest ammo we could find, between gun shows, garage sales, and our dads' stashes. We shot stuff that was pre-WWI, and it went bang, reliably. Every once in a very, very long while there would be a dead primer, but I want to say it was less than 3 times, between all of us. But we never had any split cases. The only time we did have problems with any ammo, was paper-hulled shotgun shells. It was common for them to be hit or miss in going bang, reliably. The only asterisk is that we lived in the high desert, so it's dry here. But, that doesn't mean the ammo was always here, and this part of the country swings from sub-zero to 100F over the year, commonly.

The only time I've personally seen ammo "go bad", is when it's been left in the sun in a window, like on a work bench or the like, out in a shop. Meaning, extreme heat and cold swings over the course of a year or so, plus sunlight.

The only time I can recall anything similar to what you're sharing, is a DOD study on what happens to ammo when it gets heated. Can't recall if they did multiple cycles, but they did heat ammo up, and, again, IIRC, to decrease its humidity. And at some point, guns started blowing up. The ammo ignited fine, but with less humidity and/or changes in the propellant, the cartridges just started detonating actions.

So what you're experiencing is a big, anomalous mystery to me, and I'm extremely curious about it. The only things that come to mind are possibly that the ammo got heated, the ammo was severely desiccated from desiccants, or something was wrong with it from the factory. Even the desiccant thing is pure conjecture and speculation, as I'd suspect it would take cycling desiccants out over years to decrease humidity that much in powder for it to detonate. Can't think of any other variables or possibilities, based on what you've described though. But I would very much like to figure out what might have happened.

Was this just one box of 30-30, or did it happen with a bunch of other stuff?

So far, I have only observed it in .30-30 Winchester ammo made in the mid-1990s. Brands were Remington and Winchester - so not just one brand. But it happened with some of mine, my brother’s, and my dad’s. Which have all been stored separately for a long time. If it was all in ammo stored in one spot or container, it would be easier for me to understand. And it happened in three separate rifles, all in good repair. I can’t explain it.

I didn’t see the same thing from .270 stored in the same box, but that wasn’t nearly as old since I shot that rifle a lot.

I still need to test out some of the other old stuff.

It’s just made me very skeptical about relying upon old ammo. Even though I have previously fired military ammo from WW II.
 
So far, I have only observed it in .30-30 Winchester ammo made in the mid-1990s. Brands were Remington and Winchester - so not just one brand. But it happened with some of mine, my brother’s, and my dad’s. Which have all been stored separately for a long time. If it was all in ammo stored in one spot or container, it would be easier for me to understand. And it happened in three separate rifles, all in good repair. I can’t explain it.

I didn’t see the same thing from .270 stored in the same box, but that wasn’t nearly as old since I shot that rifle a lot.

Man, that really is a weird one. Especially with 3 different rifles, from 3 different storage lots, yet not happening with the .270. I'd pay money to know exactly what the problem was.
 
I'm guessing the older stuff that stayed stable was loaded with nitrocellulose-based powders.

If you're meaning single-base powders vs double-base, that might very well be a factor in what @Q_Sertorius experienced. My understanding is that the single-base powders are more stable, so I think I'm going to spend a little time looking into double-base longevity.
 
Since no one has mentioned it (can of worms), but my experience is that on precision rifle ammo the ES goes up if it’s stored for any length of time. The pressure and velocity always seem to go up. I used to think it was from the powder getting pulverized from riding around in my truck, but now I’m starting to think it’s from changes in neck tension or bullet to case bond.

I’ve noticed that some f-class and benchrest guys seat their bullets long, then finish seat them at the range.


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