Help with possibly bad scope or bad rifle problem

[LastShot90]

First time poster so I apologize in advance if I don’t give adequate info or have posted in the wrong area. I bought a NightForce nx8 2.5-20x50 F1 .25” moa/click a month and a half ago. It’s going to go on my first precision rifle but I can’t decide on which direction I want to go so I still haven’t built the gun. Never got into target shooting until recently and I strictly hunt north Florida where most shots are well below 300 yards so this is my first f1 scope and dialing turrets.
The scope is mounted on a ruger American ranch gen2 5.56 that I picked up a few weeks ago while I figure out my rifle build and what optic I want to get for the ranch. I have it zero’s at 100 and it’s surprisingly a shooter. It’ll do 3/4- 1 moa groups no problem and could honestly do better if I was better. I have about 150 rounds thru the gun no problems at all. This morning I go shoot and the first two shots are 1/2” low so I thought I pulled them. Next two shots same thing so I dial up two clicks from my zero and send a 5 shot group that measured just under 1moa. Could’ve been closer to 1/2 moa but my last shot was a flyer that I rushed. I shot a few more groups and accuracy and precision stayed where it should be. Backed out to 200 dialed to what I thought would be close and fired for effect and it was 3” low I kept correcting and they would walk closer to point of aim but not per the amount of clicks. I ended up going back to 100 yards because I was having trouble seeing my hits on the target background at 200 without a spotting scope and the walking got old quick. At 100 I dialed back down to 2 clicks above my zero so I should’ve been driving tacks again. First two shots 1/2” low and same for the third so I dialed up another two clicks to 1 moa and send a 5 shot group that measured just over 3/4 moa. Shot 5 more groups and everything performed as usual except for the having to click up two from my zero stop this morning then having to go up another two from that after going out to 200 and back to 100 yards. All factors have remained pretty constant,same rest, same Hornady black 62gr ammo, same location.
Is this a gun problem or a scope problem? I feel like the gun is pretty solid for what it is. I get the accuracy I expect out of it and now that I’ve found the ammo it likes I can already start to tell when I am doing something wrong or different because the thing just shoots for a 500 dollar gun. I’m leaning towards the scope since once I dialed up two clicks each time I got accuracy and consistency. I’m sorry for the long winded post! Any help/opinions/advice is much appreciated

 

[LastShot90]

Also for what it’s worth I know everything is still tight from its original torque. I have tattle-tales on every bolt/screw on the gun and rail/rings. I checked and all witness marks were still aligned

 

[LongWayAround]

Scope mounting to maintain zero

After multiple requests for an explanation of how to mount a scope in order to have the lowest possibility of loss of zero, a discussion of a scope mounting video, and the latest thread about scope bases and action screw coming loose, I took some pics of what I do with a rifle when I get it and...

rokslide.com

 

[HandgunHTR]

Are you adjusting for parallax?

 

[LastShot90]

Yes adjusted for parallax anytime my yardage changed

 

[LastShot90]

I don’t think scope mounting is the problem. Not saying there’s no way I made any mistakes because that’s definitely possible but I’m a little ocd when it comes to having things as near perfect as you can get it and I actually used a lot of the steps in the thread posted above but simple things are substituted because I found it online a long time ago not on the forum. I cleaned all hardware, screws etc with degreaser, then alcohol, loctite on the base screws and ring’s 1/2” mounting bolts, torqued each part to the manufacturer specs, used and awl to scratch tattle-tail marks on each screw/bolt, and then filled my ring’s screws with a dab of low temp hot glue because I don’t loctite the ring screws themselves just torque them( keeps dirt and grime out plus pops right off the screw head if you need to remove them) I popped the glue out of each screw in the rings and all of my witness marks are still coaligned like the others. My front ring is halfway between the turrets and objective bell and the back ring isn’t exactly halfway between the turret and eye piece it’s about the first third of that section of the tube. placed where they are the rings sit exactly centered overtop of the rail’s mounting screws. Maybe I shouldn’t have worried about the rings being overtop of the rail screws and just center both rings in their section of tube?

 

[Macintosh]

Link to thread 'Most efficient process to diagnose and fix problems with loss of zero or change in precision?'
https://rokslide.com/forums/threads...ro-or-change-in-precision.360495/post-3665240

Did you zero off a 3 or 5 round group?

 

[Shortschaf]

1. Your rifle probably doesn't shoot as good as you think it does. "Sub MOA all the time if I do my part" factory rifles are extremely uncommon.
2. Rifle may not put together right. Read through the best practices
3. Chronograph your ammo. 200 yards isn't far, but you shouldn't have to guess what the dope is

Every new shooter chasing accuracy is hasty to say they "pulled" shots to cause the "fliers"
You need in-person guidance to verify you're not actually pulling shots, but with a .223 with a front and rear rest, it's not as likely that you are.

 

[ElPollo]

 

[Fever Buck]

Are you loading into the gun differently? Not sure if you may be having stock and barrel contact issues.

 

[LastShot90]

The link above was a pretty good read and has given me a few things to try. I will get someone else to shoot it and see what happens. All shots were taken using a lead sled with no weights. I don’t want to dump money into the ranch since this isn’t what I intend to use it for. I really just wanted to play with the scope and get to know it until I get done with my build. The reason I feel like it’s me when I get a flier is I notice the reticle shift left as the shot breaks. I have a tendency to torque some part of my hand or finger when I squeezing the shot quickly without concentrating. Four shots in a row all touching and on the fifth I get nervous for whatever reason. Whether it’s 10 shots in a group,5, or 3 it’s always the last shot in a strong group. It’s the same way when I shoot my bow Just don’t like to loose the momentum. like I said I’m going to have my cousin shoot it this weekend and see what happens but I don’t think it’s the gun. If it was I wouldn’t be able to achieve accuracy and precision group after group and loose it the moment I mess with the turret. After thinking about it this afternoon I had been playing with the turret last week between shooting sessions and then today it had to be bumped two clicks above my zero. Then I spun 8 clicks at 200 and it was 3 inches or so low so I kept bumping it up then went back to 100 yards and had to set the turret to 4 clicks above my zero start getting accurate and repeatable groups. When I originally zeroed the gun I didn’t have a torque wrench with me to torque the zero stop turret to 4 inch pounds. I followed the manufacturers directions of using the short end of the Allen wrench and tightening until I just start to see the slightest bit of white in my finger tips but maybe I went too tight so I’m wondering if I damaged something inside?
Maybe the groups aren’t sub moa. Like I said I’m just now learning dialing and converting inches/yards to moa so maybe I’m way off I’m not sure. I simply shoot 5 shots at a time at 100 yards then measure the outside edges of two holes thatre furthest apart and subtract .224. I take whatever number that is to roughly be the moa of the gun. If the problem still persists with another shooter I’ll probably try to get some new rings so I can try one of my other scopes that I know are fine. All of my other rifles have tradition dovetail mounts so I’ll have to get a set of rings for a pictanny rail. if the problem still doesn’t show up I’ll put the second scope in the night force rings. That will have eliminated everything else and will show it’s either the rings or the scope. Unless the problem is still absent and at that point I’ll just forget all about it because the ranch is going to be a normal rifle with a good solid cheap scope that goes bang on any predators that I need it to

 

[Short Track]

I heard in a seminar by a qualified smith. 3 shot groups at the max. Otherwise, the barrel is too hot for accurate results.

 

[JBradley500]

I heard in a seminar by a qualified smith. 3 shot groups at the max. Otherwise, the barrel is too hot for accurate results.

That sounds like something a poor gunsmith would say to cover his own shoddy work and make groups look better.