Etiquette and common sense when asking about hunting areas/information on Rokslide.

[BeastOfTheTrees]

I believe this etiquette should be just a respect thing just show respect to everyone and respectful questions as well and you’ll get respect in return. Even back east nobody is guna give you a spot especially in national or state forest but respectful people that really seem die hard as well you can learn and share and prosper with.That being said I think sometimes on this site the western community can as well be a little angry with easterners just simply because easterners (which I am however I live in Colorado now) are perceived as lazy because of how most of us hunt back east even though it presents its own challenges. I also see why people out west aren’t too quick to help because simply they don’t want more people migrating west. Double edged sword. As an eastern guy it is a little desuading though to not even ask for help on the forums because of the backlash western dudes have, small percentage but it does happen.

 

[CrzyTrekker]

This is a real interesting issue. I don't ask people for actionable information. If I do have a conversation with a guy about his hunting area, I don't use the information personally.

I used to maintain a website, Crazytrekker.com, where I posted trip stories and pics from my outings in Colorado. Before I closed down the site I was getting about 1000 hits (different IP addresses) per month, traffic was growing quickly and I was receiving a lot of inquiries regarding hunting and fishing locations. I ultimately shut it down because I backpack upwards of 20 times per year, in remote off trail locations, and I was starting to meet people that learned about those locations FROM ME.

Some guys were really classy - just looking for basic information about an area. They'd make it real clear that they did not want me to disclose "secret spots" and I appreciated that. Many others, however, wanted the keys to the kingdom for free.

Here's my thinking: I've had very successful guys like Aron Snyder disclose exact hunting locations to me, and I have never followed up and gone to those areas. Never. I just have too much respect for guys that put in the hard work. If I have a honey hole (fly fishing or elk hunting) it generally means that I've made four or five trips into that area at a minimum in order to develop it. Why would I want to steal that kind of hard work from another guy? It's a lot more satisfying doing it yourself.

I think if you put yourself out there as an "authority" of any kind, you have to be something of a stoic, realizing that people will attempt to squeeze information from you. You either accept it without complaint because the endeavor as a whole makes you happy, or you shouldn't engage in the first place. In no way should ego become part of the equation. In my professional career I am an authority and people seek me out daily. I make money doing it and it provides a lot of personal satisfaction. On the other hand, I've simply decided to keep my secret spots . . . secret.

Whatever side of the fence you sit on, keep it honorable and give as much as you take.

 

[Glendon Mullins]

According to some, this guy [post #8] is gonna have LOTS of Karma -

http://www.rokslide.com/forums/elk/98432-co-unit-82-looking-info.html

WTF

If he had done that via PM or in person, sure....but ummm yeah putting out there like that....yeah he's probably got something coming..it's likely not karma, but it's coming lol

 

[johnhenry]

This is a real interesting issue. I don't ask people for actionable information. If I do have a conversation with a guy about his hunting area, I don't use the information personally.

I used to maintain a website, Crazytrekker.com, where I posted trip stories and pics from my outings in Colorado. Before I closed down the site I was getting about 1000 hits (different IP addresses) per month, traffic was growing quickly and I was receiving a lot of inquiries regarding hunting and fishing locations. I ultimately shut it down because I backpack upwards of 20 times per year, in remote off trail locations, and I was starting to meet people that learned about those locations FROM ME.

Some guys were really classy - just looking for basic information about an area. They'd make it real clear that they did not want me to disclose "secret spots" and I appreciated that. Many others, however, wanted the keys to the kingdom for free.

Here's my thinking: I've had very successful guys like Aron Snyder disclose exact hunting locations to me, and I have never followed up and gone to those areas. Never. I just have too much respect for guys that put in the hard work. If I have a honey hole (fly fishing or elk hunting) it generally means that I've made four or five trips into that area at a minimum in order to develop it. Why would I want to steal that kind of hard work from another guy? It's a lot more satisfying doing it yourself.

I think if you put yourself out there as an "authority" of any kind, you have to be something of a stoic, realizing that people will attempt to squeeze information from you. You either accept it without complaint because the endeavor as a whole makes you happy, or you shouldn't engage in the first place. In no way should ego become part of the equation. In my professional career I am an authority and people seek me out daily. I make money doing it and it provides a lot of personal satisfaction. On the other hand, I've simply decided to keep my secret spots . . . secret.

Whatever side of the fence you sit on, keep it honorable and give as much as you take.

I for one am very glad you shut down your website. I have been putting in hard miles on and off trail in mtns and deserts of Utah, Colorado, Wyoming for 4 decades and in the last 10 yeaers so many of my "honey holes" have been ruined by social media posts like you used to do. I don't even like guide books and will never buy them. so thank you for no longer doing that sort of thing.

 

[CrzyTrekker]

I for one am very glad you shut down your website. I have been putting in hard miles on and off trail in mtns and deserts of Utah, Colorado, Wyoming for 4 decades and in the last 10 yeaers so many of my "honey holes" have been ruined by social media posts like you used to do. I don't even like guide books and will never buy them. so thank you for no longer doing that sort of thing.

You didn't say whether you ever saw my website. Probably not. I don't do social media at all, and I never named actual locations.

I actually encouraged people to do their own homework and talked more about experiences and techniques. My website was more about mountain adventure in a general way. So I've never been accused of ruining honey holes. A few very intelligent guys were starting to use my photographs to try and pin down locations. Often they were wrong, but couple guys figured out a location or two. I'm not responsible for hordes of mongrels in the wilderness by any stretch of the imagination.

I am dead opposed to "guidebook" style websites. I quit my website because people were looking to me as a guru for information, multiple times every week, and it just gets old unless it's your job.

 

[Riles1050]

I think giving out general information is great for the future of hunting. I believe hunters finding success hooks them, and encourages them to take their kids and friends out. That being said, giving out exact trail heads or drainage's is probably not appropriate. But info like south part of the area, or such and such wilderness area, or around a particular city I am ok with. Even better if you give out that information in private form. I do not like the misleading and false information some guys give out. At the end of the day we are a small percentage of the population with the huge task of keeping public lands public, herds in healthy numbers, and the spirit and tradition of hunting alive. I believe the biggest risk to our community is ourselves dividing into sects and imploding.

 

[TheGDog]

Some perspective from an "adult onset hunter".

This task/quest is/seems crazy daunting at first for some of us who never ever had any exposure to this endeavor.

The world we live in now is centered around instant gratification and results. So it tends to infect/influence our thinking in all arenas to some degree.

And... when you've only got a certain amount of potential leftover money each month with which to possibly even make it happen... being as efficient as you can be in terms of not "wasting" a trip into an area... from the perspective of that new guy... feels critical.

BUT... this is because that n00b doesn't yet understand what he's in for. That this pursuit is more like a long-term chess game. That it will most likely NOT happen quickly. That it may take a few years to come to fruition, before you're successful.

Most of the vet guys, I feel, have been at it soo long, or they come from families where it's a tradition... that really it's almost impossible for them to conceive of just how needle-in-an-Earth-sized-Haystack and over-whelming it feels to the Solo FNG guy who just so happened to get a wild hair up his butt to decide that he wants to do this and make this happen.

They don't know all the things you know. They don't even know enough to even really know WHAT to ask. They don't even know enough to know that the act of asking will be met with so much tension and disdain.

So... they do what seems logical. They go to a forum, see all these guys who obviously have successes under their belt... so they ask them where to go. Sometimes they've browsed a bit on the forum and come across a similar sounding thread, where they read somebody explaining to another FNG that nobody is gonna tell you very much about where to go because THEY all had to work like hell to finally found those spots. So... they do what seems natural and logical... they ask with like "not asking for anyones honey holes, but..."

They don't know enough to even have that though of. "Oh I see... yeah that makes sense that these guys are gonna get snippy at some FNG coming in "expecting" to get a very direct type of answer. They have no frame of reference. It's not necessarily a case of "Pssh, they're just being Lazy!" Not at all. They are just over-whelmed.

I feel very grateful for gentleman the likes of @Bubblehide and @Where's Bruce? Whom first of all, took the time to open my eyes to the concept of just how much work folks put in, in terms of scouting in order to find these places to begin with. That was a major eye-opener for me. Cause how the Hell would I know it takes that damn much work, right?

Then... after each weekends outings... I'd formulate new specific questions I'd present them with. Specific so I'm not wasting their time. They in-turn, saw with my updates reports/questions that I really was putting in that boots-on-the-ground effort, so they indulged (endured?) my questions like the gentleman they are.

I want to also praise them because on other forums I'd also went to... as I started to gain experience and then witness folks addressing other FNG's... I noted some of the vets got their jollies of f**king with the FNG's and... I'm not gonna say out-right lying to them... but... they'd often make comments to them that were apparently an attempt by them to be funny?.... but... they gave no context clues in the post that they were joking and it wasn't always like the things they said when they were "pulling the leg" of the FNG were obvious at being in jest. And heaven help you if you butt-in and say to them "Hey, that's not cool dude. This guys not gonna know you're messin' with him." Otherwise they then wanna be very uncool with you from that moment forward.

So for me, that's why, to the best of my ability I try to take the time to answer FNG questions where I actually can offer up useful insights, since it's all still fresh in my mind for me, since I've only been at this now for 6 yrs. And I've found that a lot of times I can fill in the blanks that the vet guys might neglect to mention to the n00b because they forgotten about it in terms of WHY they now use the gear they use or WHY they elect to do things a particular way. You know, those kinda small little bits of information about your setup and plan of attack that you tweak by seeing what works well and what doesn't, learned from time in the field.

Also something to remember? FNG's don't realize just how much information some of the rest of us can gleen from looking at any kind of pics somebody else posts up. That's why nowadays if I take a pic of something in the field I try to angle the camera downward such that there aren't any distant and distinct recognizable landmarks visible within the photo to clue in savvy vets, or guys like me with a high level of visual memory recognition as to where the location was.

 

[Bubblehide]

Some perspective from an "adult onset hunter".

...

Also something to remember? FNG's don't realize just how much information some of the rest of us can gleen from looking at any kind of pics somebody else posts up. That's why nowadays if I take a pic of something in the field I try to angle the camera downward such that there aren't any distant and distinct recognizable landmarks visible within the photo to clue in savvy vets, or guys like me with a high level of visual memory recognition as to where the location was.

Great post Gary! I think you bring a very needed perspective to this conversation to balance it out. There are good points to be made from both sides here, but we do not need to ostracize newbies; as we as a group (hunters) are much better off helping them understand, and for those willing to put in the effort, eventually see the hard earned success.

As for the paragraph I left above, I recall you asking (on another forum) about my comment about another posters photo. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that my response to you (in that other forum) led you directly to your conclusion and actions regarding posting photographs. As for me, I am so glad you publicly stated it here. I mean, you know that I have taken a few people to my honey holes with the strict rule of not giving out the location or posting pictures (unless I approve the specific picture). I still recall a particular person posting a few pictures (uncropped) of the kill and location, along with a very descriptive description of the area; to say I was peeved is very much an understatement.

 

[bobr1]

Maybe I'm stating the obvious but regardless of how you take the picture if you dont have metadata turned off for the pictures you post people can get the exact gps coordinates to where the picture was taken.

 

[TheGDog]

Maybe I'm stating the obvious but regardless of how you take the picture if you dont have metadata turned off for the pictures you post people can get the exact gps coordinates to where the picture was taken.

True Dat. Some of us have been down with computers since even before the Commodore 64 though, so we hip to dat trip!

 

[TheGDog]

Great post Gary! I think you bring a very needed perspective to this conversation to balance it out. There are good points to be made from both sides here, but we do not need to ostracize newbies; as we as a group (hunters) are much better off helping them understand, and for those willing to put in the effort, eventually see the hard earned success.

As for the paragraph I left above, I recall you asking (on another forum) about my comment about another posters photo. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that my response to you (in that other forum) led you directly to your conclusion and actions regarding posting photographs. As for me, I am so glad you publicly stated it here. I mean, you know that I have taken a few people to my honey holes with the strict rule of not giving out the location or posting pictures (unless I approve the specific picture). I still recall a particular person posting a few pictures (uncropped) of the kill and location, along with a very descriptive description of the area; to say I was peeved is very much an understatement.

To me? This all kinda falls under the same category as ALWAYS being cognizant about being an ambassador for firearms. Same thing over there. We need as many people as we can get hooked-on and enjoying and loving their 2A rights...especially Women... so that we ALL don't have to fight soo damn hard to keep these rights around. We need numbers. Just like Hunting does.

 

[Where's Bruce?]

If I ever posted anything you found useful, it was probably something Bubblehide taught me.

 

[magtech]

Ahh the disease of competition. Where both sides of the coin suffer. One side wishes to compete to be like. The other suffers to compete to be better than.

How twisted have our souls become?

 

[tt_johnsclist]

It seems to me you should be addressing the people doing the telling, not the asking.

 

[NolanKM]

Thankful for this discussion as another guy getting into this later in life. Starting from ground zero, in person or on a forum it's challenging to even decide what questions to ask while hoping you're not breaching etiquette. I can rely on time afield for public land near me, and when I run into other hunters have a cordial and respectful conversation, hopefully presenting something resembling knowledge when in fact I'm learning entirely by trial and error. A few unsuccessful seasons of that and I at least know the land and animal patterns relatively well at this point.
I do try and share what I've learned, with gratitude for those who shared their knowledge with me.

But the prospect of traveling somewhere and diving into a hunt without scouting, when a lot of stars have to align to even attempt justifying a trip like that, is daunting. Appreciate the insights here in case I ever take that leap...