Elk advice, 2 lost in a row where am i going wrong?

dg101

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I'm looking for advice to improve my ability to kill elk, I have just lost my second elk in a row over the last 2 seasons and the feeling is sickening. Any and all advice is welcome and I'll do my best to go over both shots for you all you analyze.

Elk 1 was a cow broadside at 200 yards. Shooting a 180gr TTSX out of my 300 win. Aimed for the crease halfway down and shot felt great I was steady on my bipod and confident I punched both lungs. She immediately turned around and ran into the bush, I heard her run in breaking branches then stop and cough blood. Wait about 30min and begun tracking. Blood trail was very strong spray on trees and plenty of blood on the ground there was so much blood I expected to find her any step. We even found where she had stopped coughed up a few piles of coagulated blood, after that the blood trail got smaller and smaller eventually down to drips every 50 feet and then nothing. Tracked for around 500 yards total and no elk, tried grid search after loosing blood and no elk. Tried looking the next day for birds or any sign and nothing

Now shot 2, bull elk quarting to at a very slight angle. About 80 yards. After my experience last year I turned away from the Barnes and was using standard federal blue box ammo, 180 gr again 300 win mag. I aimed just infront of the Shoulder facing me on the line of the tan and black hair aming to exit just behind the offside Shoulder. Bull went down hard almost as if spined, dropping in his tracks. I could see he was trying to stand but none of his legs would work and I was sure he was done. So much so I failed to chamber another round. Huge mistake. He managed to get himself turned broadside to me still unable to stand and I thought I had better give him another one, by the time I chambered around he was on his feet out of there. Waited about and hour and started trailing not tons of blood and no spray but enough drops to follow easily. Went about 400 yards and decided it was best to back off and come back in the am. Tracked the bull all the next day for about 2 miles, he traveled mostly downhill but jumped a 4 wire fence like nothing. Got on some very fresh still wet blood the next morning leading me to believe he made it through the night. Eventually lost blood but continued to follow what I think was his tracks for another mile and no elk. Returned a 3rd day and no signs of a dead elk.

I can't believe centerpunching him so close with a 300 win wouldn't be fatal. My guess is maybe I missed and had a heavy bone hit or the bullet exploded and didn't penatrate?

I also don't understand what happened with the cow, I used the exact same round and lung punched a bull the year before who didn't make it 100. What am I doing wrong here? What am I missing? I pride myself on ethical hunting and this last bull I shot is killing me. My decision to not make a follow up shot until it was too late haunts me and I want to do everything in my power to make sure it never happens again. I'm not proud to share these experiences but I'm hopeful I will learn from it and perhaps some of you all will too.
 
Props for confronting failure and trying to improve. You are not alone, I have lost animals as well and it makes me sick. I have no explanation for what happened in your scenarios, from your description that should be 2 dead elk. My only advice would be to work on your tracking skills and get the contact info for a guy with a tracking dog. Elk are wildly tough animals and they can tolerate and survive the unimaginable.
 
Second shot sounds like you may have hit high, shocked the spine temporarily. I've never seen recovery of an animal that went down and got up and ran away. If they do that it's not a good sign.

Edit: I used to poke fun at Newberg talking about shooting til they're down but after reading a lot of threads like this I can see why.
 
Shoot them until they’re dead, my bull last year got a 300wby to the shoulder with a partition and took two more to finally put him down for good.

I have a friend who shot a cow with a Barnes as well, from 80 yards, double lunged, and watched her for an hour after she bedded down, ended up having to sneak up on her and put another one in to finish the job, perfect shot the first time, so could just be the bullets fault on the cow.

Elk are a ridiculously tough animal.
 
I agree some pics of where you hit would be beneficial. Also I refuse to use monos. I've shot elk and deer with them but in my experience i was more internal damage/disruption from a bullet. Wasn't impressed by any of the would cavities and more tracking than normal. This was experience with 168 TTSX out of a 300 WSM for what its worth.
 
Second shot sounds like you may have hit high, shocked the spine temporarily. I've never seen recovery of an animal that went down and got up and ran away. If they do that it's not a good sign.

Edit: I used to poke fun at Newberg talking about shooting til they're down but after reading a lot of threads like this I can see why.
Last year I shot my bull broadside/quartering to - under 100yards and he went down right away but then he started to get up and I went to shoot him again but only got a click because I had short stroked and failed to chamber another round. He started leaving as I loaded another one and started to think I had really screwed thing up - but then he mercifully crashed for good.
 
What am I doing wrong here? What am I missing?
The vitals...

There's a common theme among lost animals threads in that shots "felt great" followed by a sensational story. Somewhere down the line it usually comes out that their certainty of shot placement was a subjective assumption, and objectively, they don't have a clue where the bullet hit, sometimes no idea where they aimed.
My guess is maybe I missed and had a heavy bone hit or the bullet exploded and didn't penatrate?

Any and all advice is welcome
Shoot a lighter recoiling cartridge so you have a better chance of putting the bullet where you intend.
 
I'm looking for advice to improve my ability to kill elk, I have just lost my second elk in a row over the last 2 seasons and the feeling is sickening. Any and all advice is welcome and I'll do my best to go over both shots for you all you analyze.

Elk 1 was a cow broadside at 200 yards. Shooting a 180gr TTSX out of my 300 win. Aimed for the crease halfway down and shot felt great I was steady on my bipod and confident I punched both lungs. She immediately turned around and ran into the bush, I heard her run in breaking branches then stop and cough blood. Wait about 30min and begun tracking. Blood trail was very strong spray on trees and plenty of blood on the ground there was so much blood I expected to find her any step. We even found where she had stopped coughed up a few piles of coagulated blood, after that the blood trail got smaller and smaller eventually down to drips every 50 feet and then nothing. Tracked for around 500 yards total and no elk, tried grid search after loosing blood and no elk. Tried looking the next day for birds or any sign and nothing

Now shot 2, bull elk quarting to at a very slight angle. About 80 yards. After my experience last year I turned away from the Barnes and was using standard federal blue box ammo, 180 gr again 300 win mag. I aimed just infront of the Shoulder facing me on the line of the tan and black hair aming to exit just behind the offside Shoulder. Bull went down hard almost as if spined, dropping in his tracks. I could see he was trying to stand but none of his legs would work and I was sure he was done. So much so I failed to chamber another round. Huge mistake. He managed to get himself turned broadside to me still unable to stand and I thought I had better give him another one, by the time I chambered around he was on his feet out of there. Waited about and hour and started trailing not tons of blood and no spray but enough drops to follow easily. Went about 400 yards and decided it was best to back off and come back in the am. Tracked the bull all the next day for about 2 miles, he traveled mostly downhill but jumped a 4 wire fence like nothing. Got on some very fresh still wet blood the next morning leading me to believe he made it through the night. Eventually lost blood but continued to follow what I think was his tracks for another mile and no elk. Returned a 3rd day and no signs of a dead elk.

I can't believe centerpunching him so close with a 300 win wouldn't be fatal. My guess is maybe I missed and had a heavy bone hit or the bullet exploded and didn't penatrate?

I also don't understand what happened with the cow, I used the exact same round and lung punched a bull the year before who didn't make it 100. What am I doing wrong here? What am I missing? I pride myself on ethical hunting and this last bull I shot is killing me. My decision to not make a follow up shot until it was too late haunts me and I want to do everything in my power to make sure it never happens again. I'm not proud to share these experiences but I'm hopeful I will learn from it and perhaps some of you all will too.
That’s rough. I can only imagine - but wanted to echo that it’s cool you are in here trying to figure out how to avoid it happening again.
 
Well you did drop one cleanly what 3 years ago? Just for the heck of it chrono one of the rounds when hunting slows down. Or maybe wendigo moved into your area and they're just throwing these elk over their shoulders and running away.
 
Hard to say without being there. Losing an animal is never fun.

I shot my bull last year at 420 with my 7 SAUM and a 145 gr LRX. First shot was broadside and went through lungs, all he did was turn a little (quartering to me) after the shot. I could tell he was dead on his feet, but I sent another through the point of the shoulder that anchored him for good.
 
I agree with everyone here, I definitely agree with shoot them till there down. The area I hunt is extremely heavy bush, the cow I had no opportunity and the bull was a total lapse of judgment. I have never seen a animal in 15 years of hunting get up after being folded like that and I was overconfident. I thought it was down. Tough lesson learned. When i seen him trying to stand and not able too i thought it was over. I am also skeptical of the monos, the bull I killed with the TTSX previously didn't go far but I was not at all impressed by the damage done to the lungs. This was also a double lung about 50 yards with 300 win. I think a move to bonded is the plan I'm gonna load some accubonds. Here are some photos of my point of aim on both. Also a photo of the exit on the bull I shot with Barnes as it can speak to my usual shot placement aswell. I practice regularly and I'm confident in my shooting. I think I'm also being realistic with my analysis of both situations with out any sensationalization. One thing we can all agree on is there is no harm in trying to learn and improve
 

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People tend to blame the bullet or the broadhead when an animal doesn’t die, which I think is a mistake. It’s VERY rarely the projectiles fault in my experience, assuming the projectile is not terribly undersized or underpowered. Bullets can do really unexpected things when they hit bone, like slide right up the scapula and come out near the spine for example- especially if you are shooting at steep angles.
 
Elk are a ridiculously tough animal.
Not really. I shot a bull with my 6.5CM this year using 124 Hammer Hunter. He tipped over within 70 yards. Last year, cow elk. Same bullet. Dead within 10 steps. Another cow. Same bullet. Dead without getting out of her bed.

I’ve killed a number with a .243 and an 85 TSX.

They aren’t made of Kevlar.
 
Honestly it sounds like you bumped the cow. Got the adrenaline flowing in her again and she clauted up.

Bull like others said shocked him but probably didn't kill him. Had same thing happen on a deer that I hit high when my muzzleloader had a hang fire.
 
Tough break. Barnes or small caliber Partitions just don’t take out enough lung tissue to put them down quick. Tracking without blood gets tough, but you were probably really close to recovering that cow. A 6mm partition out of my 243 double lunging a cow elk let her go almost 400 yards, luckily it was out in the sage. 9 times out of ten a double lung with a 300 mag mono bullet isn’t going even 200 yards. I doubt the bullet failed to open, Barnes at high velocity are reliable in that respect.

I think once you get a good diagram of an elk facing you, it might show you were favoring the off side a bit too much on this latest elk, leaving the near side lung intact. It’s a hard angle. I smoked a cow almost facing me with a 210 gr Partition and it came out her off hind quarter, and she turned into a rough tracking job with no blood. I had to put a square of toilet paper on each track I knew was hers and when tracks petered out I could look back at the trail of white squares and get roughly on track until a hoof print showed again.

Hitting a number of ribs on the off side can shock the spine, but you might have been higher and just grazed some bone closer to the spine. Again, you were probably really close to recovering him, having followed him so far.

Plenty of elk shot in similar situations nearly head on with lesser cartridges just aren’t talked about, like it never happened because they never slowed down, let alone fell down and got back up.
 
My first advice is I would not wait to track an elk after I shot them with a rifle. Completely different than shooting them with a bow. With a rifle they’re either dead or I want to get another bullet in them so I’m running after them to get another shot. Just my opinion others might disagree.

Second take this coming from a guy who shot an unbraked 300 wsm for years and developed a horrible flinch. My guess is you’re flinching and did not hit the elk where you aimed. I don’t believe a double lung shot on an elk with a Barnes the elk would live more than a minute.
 
Simply need more practice and understand shot placement at crunch time. Case in point, yesterday opening day of Idaho rifle. Bull screaming chasing second estrus cow. Finally got in close, heavy dark timber. He screams just out of sight 150. I see the chased cow go by at 110 yards, he screams, I see antlers. He stops broadside. Crosshairs on him, only midline up visible and my mind scans the scope profile. There is a lot of limbs and other timber debris between us. Mind says Nope not a good shot. No shot taken after a very long day to get there. Sometimes the best shot, is no shot. Hard quartering too shots seem like a slam dunk in close, but if you punch that shield of a shoulder bone and don’t hit vitals it often does not end well. YES, always load another round and be ready, don’t assume anything.

On the cow, the shot may have felt good, but the lungs were not hit. The mind often wants to think the shot is good, when it is not. Without the lungs the animal simply does not travel far, as it cannot breath.

Losing an animal is difficult. Simply practice more, study up on shot angles and learn from mistakes. Good luck on the next hunt🤙
 
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