Did Something Stupid and Dangerous On My Bench Today

[Unckebob]

Glad you caught that. You’re paying attention!!!

OP's process is good because he has multiple, good inspection points.

Everybody makes a mistake sooner or later.

 

[Rich M]

OP's process is good because he has multiple, good inspection points.

Everybody makes a mistake sooner or later.

Agreed.

 

[wind gypsy]

Had an friend of a friend had his gun blow up, using reloads from a guy that used to offer reloads in the local classifieds. They asked me to check out some of the reloads to see what was wrong. Gun was a factory Win M70 chambered in 270 Weatherby. When I pulled the bullets and measured them they were .284", also barnes. Gun was totally destroyed, shooter suffered facial cuts an eye/ear damage. So in that case a larger bullet did chamber.

geesh, scary!

That's one benefit of a guy learning the ins and outs of ammo via reloading. Gotta think that a reloader is more likely to stop, wonder wtf, and diagnose/troubleshoot something if they get some resistance closing a bolt than someone who has never bothered to learn how ammo and chambers work.

 

[Axlrod]

geesh, scary!

That's one benefit of a guy learning the ins and outs of ammo via reloading. Gotta think that a reloader is more likely to stop, wonder wtf, and diagnose/troubleshoot something if they get some resistance closing a bolt than someone who has never bothered to learn how ammo and chambers work.

For sure. This guy was doing custom loading for profit out of his house. I believe his homeowners insurance ended up covering medical bills, pain & suffering etc. After lawyers were involved.

 

[TaperPin]

Okay, before you start with the hate let me say that I know I screwed up. I have reloaded for 14 years and spent many hours reading and watching videos made by expert reloaders. I reload for 222, 22-250, 243, 257 Roy, 260 Rem, 270, 308, and 300 Win Mag. I do not consider myself to be an expert, but I would have NEVER thought I could do something so stupid. I try to be as careful as I can on my bench. I only allow 1 powder at a time to be on my bench. Only one box of bullets at a time. Only one kind of brass. Only set of dies at a time.

Today I was seating some 100g Barnes TTSX for my 257 Weatherby. I finished charging the cases with powder and weighed every single load. I then put my seating die in my Redding press and backed off the seating stem a full turn just to make sure that I dont seat them too deeply. I put a case in the shell holder and inserted a bullet and then slowly started raising the ram. I felt contact sooner than I was expecting and the resistance was greater than expected so I backed off and lowered the ram. The bullet was seated too deep and the case neck had a scuff mark on it. I back off the seating stem way back and tried another and the same result. There was also a ring on the bullet. See photo of scuffed case neck and bullet below:
View attachment 608271

I sat there confused for twenty minutes looking at my seating die and making sure that it was set up correctly. I was dumbfounded. It had worked perfect just last week.

THEN I FOUND MY FATAL MISTAKE: I looked at the label on the box of bullets and instead of saying Barnes 100g TTSX .257 it said Barnes 100g TTSX .264. I had grabbed the WRONG caliber of bullets and seated two of the 100g .264 bullets in my .257 brass!!!!! To answer your question: NO. I had not had any alcohol.

I had the boxes beside each other on the shelf and just grabbed the wrong one. See photo below:
View attachment 608273

I pulled the bullets and they look fine. Just a ring around the ogive. I will not use them for hunting or load development, but I will probably use them to run through the chrono to get FPS.

I took the brass and ran them through the FL sizing die with no expander ball to shrink the neck back down, and then expanded the neck to .254 with an expander mandrel. The brass looks fine (other than the scuff mark). Can I still use them or should I toss them??? I realize it is only two pieces of brass but this Norma brass is EXPENSIVE these days. Can I keep the brass or toss them?

Thanks for posting this - it’s something that wasn’t on my radar, but now it will change how I reload - and I’m a triple check kind of guy, but I honestly hadn’t thought that an oversize bullet would seat without crumpling the neck.

I’ve been mentally tossing this around in the background, letting it marinade, since you originally posted it - my initial reaction was the bullet will never make it into the freebore and the neck wouldn’t go, but now I’m not so sure.

Assuming brass in the neck snaps back .001” or so from the chamber neck, many rifles produce fired brass that is like a hotdog going down a hallway if you dropped a bullet in the neck, and the actual chamber is .001” larger than that. I’m convinced that at least a few factory rifles I’ve had over the years would chamber a neck .007” oversized. One rifle in particular always produced high pressures with factory loads or handloads - I assumed a tight chamber, but it was loose as a goose. I’m convinced the bore was tight and produced excessive pressures on the test fire so they used a maximum dimension reamer to open up the chamber a bit and reduce pressures and avoid replacing the barrel. The neck on fired cases was huge with that rifle. Later I found out that production reamers are often built on the large side of saami specs so they can be resharpened multiple times until they get below saami minimum size, so chamber size is somewhat the luck of the draw.

Everyone is on the accuracy bandwagon, and many of us are sizing necks down less than in the past, so there’s less resistance for bullet seating, but it also means there’s less resistance for a bullet to be pushed back into the case if it was too large to go into the freebore.

I have a 270 and it‘s only .007” from a 7 mag. With a number of young family members becoming more interested in reloading, I may actually keep the 7 mag bullets locked up, just in case one of the kids or adults happens to be looking at bullets like we all do and after comparing 270 and 7mm bullets accidentally puts them back in the wrong box. A 140 gr .277” bullet looks and feels very much like a 140 gr .284”. At the very least it will be good to check if a 7 mm bullet in a 270 case will chamber in my rifle.

It’s a great example of why we double and triple check things in order to catch problems before it gets in the gun.

 

[TaperPin]

I just checked a vintage Rem 700 270 and the chamber neck will just barely accept a .313” gauge pin, so with normal neck brass thickness there would be a way to chamber a 270 case with .284” bullet, so that’s not great. Saami specs say max chamber is .3108” at shoulder -0”/+.002” (essentially .313”) and .3088” at end of case neck -0”/+.002 (Essentially .311”). If I could go back 63 years I’d ask for a barrel that’s within Saami specs, but it’s close enough.

I’d check all the barrels in the house just out of curiosity, except it dawned on me that putting a hardened steel gauge pin with sharp edges into the neck isn’t doing it any favors. Lol

 

[SDHNTR]

Glad you caught that. While certainly not as dangerous, I pulled a doofus move, going too fast, and not reading carefully enough while cleaning my rifle the other day. Grabbed a .284 jag and forced it through my.264 bore. Coincidentally, I had also opened a brand new bag of patches and thought I just got a batch of really tight ones. It took several run-throughs before I figured out what I had done. Harmless, but it taught me a good lesson about paying absolutely close attention when dealing with anything involving the firearm.

 

[S.Clancy]

Had an friend of a friend had his gun blow up, using reloads from a guy that used to offer reloads in the local classifieds. They asked me to check out some of the reloads to see what was wrong. Gun was a factory Win M70 chambered in 270 Weatherby. When I pulled the bullets and measured them they were .284", also barnes. Gun was totally destroyed, shooter suffered facial cuts an eye/ear damage. So in that case a larger bullet did chamber.

I did the same the exact same thing, except it was a 270 Win instead of 270 Weatherby. Bolt closed fine, shot the round, hard kick and the chrono registered almost 3500 fps. I noticed some gas ejection at the shot, went to open the bolt and that sucker was STUCK. Bashed open with a 2x4, went back and pulled all the bullets of the ladder and measured. Inspected the rifle myself then took it in. Everything checked out. Still shoot that gun today.

I was reloading with my buddy that shoots 7mm, both .270 and 7mm were Hammer Hunters. We both learned a valuable lesson that day and are pretty thankful we were at the lowest end of the ladder for testing. Considering we are both engineers we felt like total dipshits making that mistake.

 

[TaperPin]

I did the same the exact same thing, except it was a 270 Win instead of 270 Weatherby. Bolt closed fine, shot the round, hard kick and the chrono registered almost 3500 fps. I noticed some gas ejection at the shot, went to open the bolt and that sucker was STUCK. Bashed open with a 2x4, went back and pulled all the bullets of the ladder and measured. Inspected the rifle myself then took it in. Everything checked out. Still shoot that gun today.

I was reloading with my buddy that shoots 7mm, both .270 and 7mm were Hammer Hunters. We both learned a valuable lesson that day and are pretty thankful we were at the lowest end of the ladder for testing. Considering we are both engineers we felt like total dipshits making that mistake.

Don’t feel bad - everyone I grew up with has a 270 and 7mm and this topic has never come up - literally it was thought to be outside the realm of possibility.

That’s great that the rifle wasn’t even damaged.

 

[S.Clancy]

Don’t feel bad - everyone I grew up with has a 270 and 7mm and this topic has never come up - literally it was thought to be outside the realm of possibility.

That’s great that the rifle wasn’t even damaged.

I think we got really lucky with a couple factors. First, those Hammers are low bearing surface, so less pressure. Second, we measured a bunch of bullets after and a lot were .282 or .283. A thousandth or 2 matters in my instance.

I found the primer about a month later. It had blown out of the case and rattled down around the bolt slide. I was out shooting at the range prepping for season and my bolt stuck. I took the bolt out and turned the gun over and the primer fell out. Pretty deep firing pin indentation....

 

[mod7rem]

Okay, before you start with the hate let me say that I know I screwed up. I have reloaded for 14 years and spent many hours reading and watching videos made by expert reloaders. I reload for 222, 22-250, 243, 257 Roy, 260 Rem, 270, 308, and 300 Win Mag. I do not consider myself to be an expert, but I would have NEVER thought I could do something so stupid. I try to be as careful as I can on my bench. I only allow 1 powder at a time to be on my bench. Only one box of bullets at a time. Only one kind of brass. Only set of dies at a time.

Today I was seating some 100g Barnes TTSX for my 257 Weatherby. I finished charging the cases with powder and weighed every single load. I then put my seating die in my Redding press and backed off the seating stem a full turn just to make sure that I dont seat them too deeply. I put a case in the shell holder and inserted a bullet and then slowly started raising the ram. I felt contact sooner than I was expecting and the resistance was greater than expected so I backed off and lowered the ram. The bullet was seated too deep and the case neck had a scuff mark on it. I back off the seating stem way back and tried another and the same result. There was also a ring on the bullet. See photo of scuffed case neck and bullet below:
View attachment 608271

I sat there confused for twenty minutes looking at my seating die and making sure that it was set up correctly. I was dumbfounded. It had worked perfect just last week.

THEN I FOUND MY FATAL MISTAKE: I looked at the label on the box of bullets and instead of saying Barnes 100g TTSX .257 it said Barnes 100g TTSX .264. I had grabbed the WRONG caliber of bullets and seated two of the 100g .264 bullets in my .257 brass!!!!! To answer your question: NO. I had not had any alcohol.

I had the boxes beside each other on the shelf and just grabbed the wrong one. See photo below:
View attachment 608273

I pulled the bullets and they look fine. Just a ring around the ogive. I will not use them for hunting or load development, but I will probably use them to run through the chrono to get FPS.

I took the brass and ran them through the FL sizing die with no expander ball to shrink the neck back down, and then expanded the neck to .254 with an expander mandrel. The brass looks fine (other than the scuff mark). Can I still use them or should I toss them??? I realize it is only two pieces of brass but this Norma brass is EXPENSIVE these days. Can I keep the brass or toss them?

Unfortunately I can top that.
When I first started handloading about 25 yrs ago, I bought a partial box of 30 cal 180 gr RN bullets from a local gunsmith. I bought a used 30:06 at the time so that this same gunsmith could rebarrel it to a 35 Gibbs for me. But I was anxious to try it out the rifle as is first. I picked a modest load out of a manual and loaded up maybe a dozen and went to the range. Those rounds kicked really hard and shot like crap. My dad had a 338WM at the time and it felt comparable to me. I never used the bullets again and went ahead with the barrel swap and an aftermarket stock.
I always assumed the felt recoil from the handloads that day was because of the original stocks design. It had a lot of drop and a raised cheek comb.
Years later I dug out those same 30 cal 180 gr RN bullets and for some reason measured the diameter with a mic. They were .311 bullets. Not 30 cal. Ever since then, I regularly double check bullet diameters and weights.

 

[MallardSX2]

I keep everything for every caliber in its own tote. 1 tote on the table at a time.

My rule.

 

[marksman1941]

Okay, before you start with the hate let me say that I know I screwed up. I have reloaded for 14 years and spent many hours reading and watching videos made by expert reloaders. I reload for 222, 22-250, 243, 257 Roy, 260 Rem, 270, 308, and 300 Win Mag. I do not consider myself to be an expert, but I would have NEVER thought I could do something so stupid. I try to be as careful as I can on my bench. I only allow 1 powder at a time to be on my bench. Only one box of bullets at a time. Only one kind of brass. Only set of dies at a time.

Today I was seating some 100g Barnes TTSX for my 257 Weatherby. I finished charging the cases with powder and weighed every single load. I then put my seating die in my Redding press and backed off the seating stem a full turn just to make sure that I dont seat them too deeply. I put a case in the shell holder and inserted a bullet and then slowly started raising the ram. I felt contact sooner than I was expecting and the resistance was greater than expected so I backed off and lowered the ram. The bullet was seated too deep and the case neck had a scuff mark on it. I back off the seating stem way back and tried another and the same result. There was also a ring on the bullet. See photo of scuffed case neck and bullet below:
View attachment 608271

I sat there confused for twenty minutes looking at my seating die and making sure that it was set up correctly. I was dumbfounded. It had worked perfect just last week.

THEN I FOUND MY FATAL MISTAKE: I looked at the label on the box of bullets and instead of saying Barnes 100g TTSX .257 it said Barnes 100g TTSX .264. I had grabbed the WRONG caliber of bullets and seated two of the 100g .264 bullets in my .257 brass!!!!! To answer your question: NO. I had not had any alcohol.

I had the boxes beside each other on the shelf and just grabbed the wrong one. See photo below:
View attachment 608273

I pulled the bullets and they look fine. Just a ring around the ogive. I will not use them for hunting or load development, but I will probably use them to run through the chrono to get FPS.

I took the brass and ran them through the FL sizing die with no expander ball to shrink the neck back down, and then expanded the neck to .254 with an expander mandrel. The brass looks fine (other than the scuff mark). Can I still use them or should I toss them??? I realize it is only two pieces of brass but this Norma brass is EXPENSIVE these days. Can I keep the brass or toss them?

I know this thread is a bit old, but maybe I can make the OP feel better (instances like this can stick with a guy).

I’ve loaded for 12ish years, mostly pistol but a large amount of rifle. Never had an issue aside from the typical learning curve of reloading.

In November, I was loading some reduced recoil loads for my wife to shoot in a .243. I had 30 trailboss loads which worked just fine (as trailboss always does). Then I went a step up, and using a book recipe from my Speer #7 manual, I made 10 loads with Accurate 5744. That powder is advertised as perfect for reduced loads in a variety of cartridges.

However.

The book load charge was 20.0gr of 5744. A .243 case can hold up to 42gr of 5744. My typical loading method is to prep all cases, then weigh each charge, charge the case, visually verify powder depth, and seat the bullet. I missed the visual verification and accidentally double charged a case. My guess is that I charged a case, set it down and went to the bathroom, came back and charged the same case again. Then I clearly missed my visual check system, and just seated the bullet. I was loading tired, and that was a very poor judgement call.

Long and short, shot #6 from those 10 shells was a grenade. My wife was shooting, and she took some minor but terrifying shrapnel to the hands and cheek. The rifle stock broke in a few places, but the action (thank god it was a ruger m77) stayed together and vented properly.

I’m very glad you caught your issue before it became a big issue. I think there’s some complacency that can come from loading for years, and a minor slip up can be have some disastrous consequences in this realm.

 

[jfk69]

I know this thread is a bit old, but maybe I can make the OP feel better (instances like this can stick with a guy).

I’ve loaded for 12ish years, mostly pistol but a large amount of rifle. Never had an issue aside from the typical learning curve of reloading.

In November, I was loading some reduced recoil loads for my wife to shoot in a .243. I had 30 trailboss loads which worked just fine (as trailboss always does). Then I went a step up, and using a book recipe from my Speer #7 manual, I made 10 loads with Accurate 5744. That powder is advertised as perfect for reduced loads in a variety of cartridges.

However.

The book load charge was 20.0gr of 5744. A .243 case can hold up to 42gr of 5744. My typical loading method is to prep all cases, then weigh each charge, charge the case, visually verify powder depth, and seat the bullet. I missed the visual verification and accidentally double charged a case. My guess is that I charged a case, set it down and went to the bathroom, came back and charged the same case again. Then I clearly missed my visual check system, and just seated the bullet. I was loading tired, and that was a very poor judgement call.

Long and short, shot #6 from those 10 shells was a grenade. My wife was shooting, and she took some minor but terrifying shrapnel to the hands and cheek. The rifle stock broke in a few places, but the action (thank god it was a ruger m77) stayed together and vented properly.

I’m very glad you caught your issue before it became a big issue. I think there’s some complacency that can come from loading for years, and a minor slip up can be have some disastrous consequences in this realm.

That’s some scary stuff right there. I’m glad your wife was spared any devastating injuries. Thank you to the Mauser brothers and Bill Ruger. How long did you have to sleep on the couch?

 

[marksman1941]

That’s some scary stuff right there. I’m glad your wife was spared any devastating injuries. Thank you to the Mauser brothers and Bill Ruger. How long did you have to sleep on the couch?

My wife is pretty incredible, so no couch for me. However it did set back our conversations about “guns are quite safe if you obey the 4 rules of gun handling”. But, she’s a trooper and is determined to shoot a deer with the rifle that blew up. We’re getting it magnafluxed right now to see if the action is still safe to use. So we’ve been working with a suppressed .22 to get her back comfy behind a rifle again.

 

[TaperPin]

I know this thread is a bit old, but maybe I can make the OP feel better (instances like this can stick with a guy).

I’ve loaded for 12ish years, mostly pistol but a large amount of rifle. Never had an issue aside from the typical learning curve of reloading.

In November, I was loading some reduced recoil loads for my wife to shoot in a .243. I had 30 trailboss loads which worked just fine (as trailboss always does). Then I went a step up, and using a book recipe from my Speer #7 manual, I made 10 loads with Accurate 5744. That powder is advertised as perfect for reduced loads in a variety of cartridges.

However.

The book load charge was 20.0gr of 5744. A .243 case can hold up to 42gr of 5744. My typical loading method is to prep all cases, then weigh each charge, charge the case, visually verify powder depth, and seat the bullet. I missed the visual verification and accidentally double charged a case. My guess is that I charged a case, set it down and went to the bathroom, came back and charged the same case again. Then I clearly missed my visual check system, and just seated the bullet. I was loading tired, and that was a very poor judgement call.

Long and short, shot #6 from those 10 shells was a grenade. My wife was shooting, and she took some minor but terrifying shrapnel to the hands and cheek. The rifle stock broke in a few places, but the action (thank god it was a ruger m77) stayed together and vented properly.

I’m very glad you caught your issue before it became a big issue. I think there’s some complacency that can come from loading for years, and a minor slip up can be have some disastrous consequences in this realm.

Glad everyone is ok - I can easily imagine what you described. In the past I loaded reduced 243 and 7 mag loads and it always gave me the creeps there was so much left over space in the cases.

 

[Dschwan]

Today I loaded up 200 rounds of 10mm. As I was putting everything away I noticed the that I grabbed a sleeve of LR Mag. primers instead of LP primers. Looks like I will be disposing of these rounds since there isn't any space to grab with a bullet puller. Very disappointed in myself to say the least.

 

[marksman1941]

Today I loaded up 200 rounds of 10mm. As I was putting everything away I noticed the that I grabbed a sleeve of LR Mag. primers instead of LP primers. Looks like I will be disposing of these rounds since there isn't any space to grab with a bullet puller. Very disappointed in myself to say the least.

You might use a kinetic hammer puller for those so that you can salvage the materials. It’s annoying, but might be worthwhile

 

[EdP]

Use the brass. Maybe anneal the lot after the next firing so they all have the same neck tension.

 

[Fireflyfishing]

Good share, good catch, way to be humble.

I mostly shoot .30 cal. Everything else is way different In dia. I stack everything by cal though and they are clearly separated.

I also do a rundown on all component prior to charging. I started doing this when I started charging and didn’t prime before charging. Duh….