Delayed altitude sickness?

[AKDoc]

Lots of helpful sharing from others, but IMHO you're on the right track planning to discuss your recent experience and pros/cons of options for next fall with your primary care provider...make an informed decision.

I will share that my wife and I did take altitude medication prophylactically when we flew from sea level to Cusco, Peru (+11,000ft elevation), where we stayed for several days as part of our trip to Machu Picchu. We live at sea level and there was no time to do the slow adaptive elevation gain option. We were very glad that we took the medication preventatively...no AMS symptoms whatsoever. The only effect we noticed was a slight appetite decrease, but that may vary across people. Best of luck to you for a symptom-free hunt next fall!

 

[Animalmutha]

Hydrate like crazy. Eat full meals and snack often throughout the day. Best cure for AMS is to descend until symptoms get better. DRUGS: diamox works but has side effects. Viagra works believe it or not. As well as nicotine. When I worked at elevation we used cigs aka “mountain heaters” while at elevation as non smokers. Worked great. I get AMS symptoms at 11k but fight through with Tylenol and friends observation.

Great practice for anything in the mountains is “work high, sleep low”. Translate for hunting is make camp below your symptom elevation. That way you get some quality recovery.

Most common physique that gets AMS are very muscular folks. Takes more energy and calories to perform.

Spent many years in SOF mountaineering and instructed at the SOCOM mountain school in Colorado. Lots of time at 14k. Always slept around 10-11k. Could pick out AMS problematic SF guys before we stepped off.

Sorry for the rant. Stay healthy and hydrated. Wouldn’t recommend solo trips at elevation. Shit could go sideways real quick.

 

[North of 60]

The only other suggestion i have is (if there is time) for lowlanders to spend some time at lower elevations before going up high.

When we thru-hiked the Colorado Trail in 2017 my son's buddy got a moderate case two or 3 days in on the way to Breckenridge after leaving Waterton Canyon. He almost quit the trail and didn't after drinking lots of water and going a bit lower for a while.

If we would have stayed another day or two in Denver to acclimate more before heading out, it may have been easier on him with more acclimation.

 

[RockAndSage]

Hydrate like crazy. Eat full meals and snack often throughout the day. Best cure for AMS is to descend until symptoms get better. DRUGS: diamox works but has side effects. Viagra works believe it or not. As well as nicotine. When I worked at elevation we used cigs aka “mountain heaters” while at elevation as non smokers. Worked great. I get AMS symptoms at 11k but fight through with Tylenol and friends observation.

Great practice for anything in the mountains is “work high, sleep low”. Translate for hunting is make camp below your symptom elevation. That way you get some quality recovery.

Most common physique that gets AMS are very muscular folks. Takes more energy and calories to perform.

Spent many years in SOF mountaineering and instructed at the SOCOM mountain school in Colorado. Lots of time at 14k. Always slept around 10-11k. Could pick out AMS problematic SF guys before we stepped off.

Sorry for the rant. Stay healthy and hydrated. Wouldn’t recommend solo trips at elevation. Shit could go sideways real quick.

That was anything but a rant. Great stuff man, thanks for sharing.

 

[def90]

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[Floated_down]

Do you use any sleep tracking devices? Often your first few nights at altitude you get shit sleep as your body tries to adjust to lower 0² levels. You might think you're sleeping through the night but your heartrate may be elevated all night and you're not truly getting restful sleep. obviously that can grind you down after 3 energy intensive days without proper recovery

 

[ColeyG]

Feeling like crap on day 3 after a significant elevation change isn’t delayed altitude illness, it is AMS right on schedule.

Full blown AMS below 8k is rare, but not unheard of. Much more common above 10K.

As other have said, if you can take a metered approach to the elevation that you are sleeping at, that is best. Hunting high and sleeping low for the first few nights will likely make a big difference. When you are working at higher elevations, you may be short of breath, but generally your body is maintaining appropriate spo2 while you are active.

When you are sleeping, your autonomic systems take over and they are programmed to make your breathe based on whatever your baseline/normal sleeping elevation/pressure environment is.

It takes a few days at a new elevation for your body to build up more red bloods cells (increased carrying capacity for oxygen) and reprogram respiratory rates at rest.

Diamox is a wonder drug and for those known to get AMS regularly zt given elevations, a prophylactic approach will likely make a big difference. Taking half or a quarter of the standard dose (250mg) all but erases the minor side effects and has roughly the same benefit re: acclimatization.

Hydration does play a part, much more so than nutrition or fitness. If you are pissing clear, you are doing fine with liquid intake.

Altitude Illness, Awareness, Prevention, and Treatment, By Coley Gentzel - Journal of Mountain Hunting

With Adam and the JOMH team fresh off a trip to the high alpine in Tajikistan, we thought now would be a great time to explore some considerations for traveling ...

journalofmountainhunting.com

Once AMS, or goodness forbid one of the edemas set in, the best, often only treatment/fix is to descend. 2k at a minimum, 3k or more is better.

 

[schur7559]

Thank you all for the feedback, lot of great info here. I’ll definitely discuss it with my dr and try to get a diamox prescription, but the side effects are a little concerning. Aside from drinking more water, it sounds like laying low for a day might be my best course of action.

 

[conhawa]

The only side effects I had with Diamox were decreased taste and tingling on the tongue when I drank carbonated drinks.

 

[EdP]

The physical changes that constitute acclimation to altitude don't trigger at altitudes below 7000 ft. Spending time at 6000 did you no good at all. When I travel west to hunt at elevation I try to make overnight stops at locations above 7000 ft and have an extra day before the hunt starts at or near hunt altitude. A few years ago when going out to Wy for a hunt in the Shirley's I spent two nights in Laramie at 7300 instead of an hour away in Cheyenne at 6086.

If you research altitude sickness you will find that the medical community has yet to crack the code. It can strike the same person one time and not another, and seems to be independent of physical conditioning. The body's strategy is to increase the concentration of red blood cells. Over time it does that by producing more of them. In the short term it does it by just concentrating the blood by removing water to thicken it. Drinking more water and taking aspirin to thin the blood counters that effect but will have you peeing a lot.

 

[willfrye027]

Thank you all for the feedback, lot of great info here. I’ll definitely discuss it with my dr and try to get a diamox prescription, but the side effects are a little concerning. Aside from drinking more water, it sounds like laying low for a day might be my best course of action.

What elevation are you sleeping at each day?

Diamoxx is the easy button. If not wanting to do that, slowly acclimating and staying hydrated will help but sometimes you are still muscling through mild symptoms for a few days.

Altitude sickness has nothing to do with being in shape. It is a metabolic process, essentially your kidneys adjusting the pH in your blood to counter the effects of needing to breathe more “air” to get enough oxygen at higher altitude.

Your body/kidneys make these adjustments primarily while you sleep. The more dramatic of an elevation change you make each day (IE hiking from 8000ft trailhead to sleeping at 10500 that night), the harder is it to adjust and the more symptoms you are likely to have. Dehydration also compounds things and has some symptom overlap.

There’s some great information out there, and there’s quite a few wives tales also..the rokcast episode I tried to keep it simple and “up to date” with currently accepted medical practice.

But your options are basically slowly acclimate, or take diamoxx

 

[North of 60]

Great info here, Thx guys.

 

[schur7559]

What elevation are you sleeping at each day?

Diamoxx is the easy button. If not wanting to do that, slowly acclimating and staying hydrated will help but sometimes you are still muscling through mild symptoms for a few days.

Altitude sickness has nothing to do with being in shape. It is a metabolic process, essentially your kidneys adjusting the pH in your blood to counter the effects of needing to breathe more “air” to get enough oxygen at higher altitude.

Your body/kidneys make these adjustments primarily while you sleep. The more dramatic of an elevation change you make each day (IE hiking from 8000ft trailhead to sleeping at 10500 that night), the harder is it to adjust and the more symptoms you are likely to have. Dehydration also compounds things and has some symptom overlap.

There’s some great information out there, and there’s quite a few wives tales also..the rokcast episode I tried to keep it simple and “up to date” with currently accepted medical practice.

But your options are basically slowly acclimate, or take diamoxx

Good info there, thanks. I typically camp between 9-10k feet. I have about a 16 hour drive so the routine is normally to drive about 13 hours and stay overnight in a hotel at about 6k feet then wake up the next morning and drive into the mountains. Then I’ll hike a few miles in to my spot. Not sure if driving the whole 16 hours and camping at a trailhead at 8,500-9k feet would make any difference? Might make it worse just driving straight to high elevation.

 

[Animalmutha]

The only side effects I had with Diamox were decreased taste and tingling on the tongue when I drank carbonated drinks.

The first time I took diamox I cracked a bud light at 11k. Took one drink and spit it out. Tasted like nothing but carbonation lol. My co workers (not on diamox) thought I was crazy. I thought the beer was bad. It messed with carbonated drink taste for a couple days.

 

[willfrye027]

Good info there, thanks. I typically camp between 9-10k feet. I have about a 16 hour drive so the routine is normally to drive about 13 hours and stay overnight in a hotel at about 6k feet then wake up the next morning and drive into the mountains. Then I’ll hike a few miles in to my spot. Not sure if driving the whole 16 hours and camping at a trailhead at 8,500-9k feet would make any difference? Might make it worse just driving straight to high elevation.

One night at 9k would help. The hotel at 6k is not high enough to help. Your body will not feel the effects until 8000ish feet, so staying at 6k will not do much.

 

[schur7559]

One night at 9k would help. The hotel at 6k is not high enough to help. Your body will not feel the effects until 8000ish feet, so staying at 6k will not do much.

Ok yeah that was kind of what I was wondering was if 6k was really high enough to do anything.

 

[Marble]

Thanks for all of the feedback. Maybe it is a hydration issue. The first couple of years it was hot and I felt like I was slugging water constantly and didn’t have any issues. The last couple years it’s been much cooler so I’ve been drinking maybe 2-3 liters a day because I didn’t feel like I “needed” it. I’ll definitely keep that in mind.

What's interesting about hydration at altitude, it isn't an apples to apples comparison from your home altitude to where you are. Because of pressure differences, at night, you will expell around 2 liters of fluid through respiration. And then, during the day another 2-3 through respiration. And this doesn't include sweat and urination.

I do I keep a mental note of when I pee. I'm hoping for every other hour. It should more clear than yellow. Nearly at the rate of being annoying...

I carry a minimum of 4 liters in my packs. Lately it's been 5. And my goal is to consume all but 1 liter, just for some reserve in case I'm out longer than anticipated.

I also use a Nalgene and a bladder. I've found it's hard to track water consumption if I only use a bladder, but with a bottle, it helps me watch my intake.

If I cross a good water source, I'll make sure to pause (usually) drink my nalgene bottle and refill it.

25 years of 9-12,000 of high country hunting. Not one person has gotten it. Several have gotten headaches that were cured with about an hour of rest and fluid.

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