Comparing two good loads - distance question.

WVELK

WKR
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I posted this on another forum that is geared more towards just shooting, but thought I would get your input as well. I have two very good loads worked up for the same rifle. Each with the same powder, but different bullets and seating depths. I want to do one last test to see which is the most accurate at distance. I will be going on a few hunts this fall, and would shoot out to 500 yards maybe even 600 having taken game at that range previusly.

My question: While trying to see which load is the most accurate would you test it at 500 or 600 (max range I will shoot), or at 200 or 300? And, why?
 
Ideally someone would shoot at the maximum range you’ll be hunting, but it is a huge time waster to check targets that far out. Also, beyond 200 yards groups start being more and more at the mercy of wind conditions rather than inherent accuracy. Shooting both loads round robin helps, but that also depends on the wind consistency to produce anything meaningful.

As a practical matter, it’s rare to have two bullets that shot so close that it would be hard to pick a winner at 100 to 200 yards. I test loads close enough to be able to see how groups are forming with a spotting scope so there’s no walking back and forth.
 
Ideally someone would shoot at the maximum range you’ll be hunting, but it is a huge time waster to check targets that far out. Also, beyond 200 yards groups start being more and more at the mercy of wind conditions rather than inherent accuracy. Shooting both loads round robin helps, but that also depends on the wind consistency to produce anything meaningful.

As a practical matter, it’s rare to have two bullets that shot so close that it would be hard to pick a winner at 100 to 200 yards. I test loads close enough to be able to see how groups are forming with a spotting scope so there’s no walking back and forth.
Thanks. Running the side by side out after 5 shots is not a real problem. I too thought of round robin shooting. I am shooting in a long valley, and the wind is almost never over 2-3 mph, if any wind, when I shoot. The gun is custom and shoots both loads at 1/2 MOA if the loose nut behind the trigger does not foul things up. So far at 300 yards those two loads are really really really close. Hard to say which is better, thus my reasoning for maybe going further out.
 
I have to do load development at 200 yards to distinguish between loads. I zero there anyway. I do it on days with little to no wind. Starting in june, we beg for wind.

It's not unusual for the ballistic calculator I use to be a few inches off on elevations past 400 yards so I use a little dope chart and stick it to my stock.

At 200 yd, I can't tell a difference between Sierra game Kings and Sierra match kings. At 500 and beyond, I can definitely tell a difference.

My brother and I shoot groups basically at all ranges we typically. The terrain and my equipment makes that pretty easy. A spotting scope would be handy
 
Thanks. Running the side by side out after 5 shots is not a real problem. I too thought of round robin shooting. I am shooting in a long valley, and the wind is almost never over 2-3 mph, if any wind, when I shoot. The gun is custom and shoots both loads at 1/2 MOA if the loose nut behind the trigger does not foul things up. So far at 300 yards those two loads are really really really close. Hard to say which is better, thus my reasoning for maybe going further out.
If both are accurate at 300, you're not going to find that one is suddenly inaccurate at 500 or 600. If you shoot a higher round count of each to give you a larger sample size, you might find one gives you a better shot dispersion, or you will find you have two great loads.
 
I would try to go to 700-800 yards. Use a big piece of steel with a water line. I want the bullet that holds the best vertical dispersion at distance.
 
Thanks. Running the side by side out after 5 shots is not a real problem. I too thought of round robin shooting. I am shooting in a long valley, and the wind is almost never over 2-3 mph, if any wind, when I shoot. The gun is custom and shoots both loads at 1/2 MOA if the loose nut behind the trigger does not foul things up. So far at 300 yards those two loads are really really really close. Hard to say which is better, thus my reasoning for maybe going further out.
1/2 MOA is a nice problem to have - I think it’s definitely worth the cost to have a hunting rifle you know shoots great. Where you’re shooting also sounds nice. 🙂
 
Shoot 15 or 20 of each and let us know how that half MOA goes.
Who shoots 15 to 20? I shot 10 of each tonight at 500. The ELD X load was 1/2 moa. The Berger 168s opened up and was right under 1 MOA. So I think it went well.
 
Who shoots 15 to 20? I shot 10 of each tonight at 500. The ELD X load was 1/2 moa. The Berger 168s opened up and was right under 1 MOA. So I think it went well.

Plenty of people. Check out the stats. Roughly 10% margin for error with 30 shots. If you're under 1 moa for a 30 shot group, or hell, even a 20 shot group at 100yds you have an absolute unit of a rifle.
 
After testing the loads at 100 and verifying the group is consistent . I’ll go to 200 and shoot a couple groups then go to 300 yards.Get an average group size from those couple groups and go from there. It’s always worked pretty well for me.
 
Plenty of people. Check out the stats. Roughly 10% margin for error with 30 shots. If you're under 1 moa for a 30 shot group, or hell, even a 20 shot group at 100yds you have an absolute unit of a rifle.
Well I agree, but in your original post it appeared as you were saying shoot a crap ton get the barrel hot then tell me what you got. And, I have not tried 30 with that rifle, but I feel pretty confident it will shoot 20 to 30 inside 1 MOA at 100. In fairness, it is a custom that shoots better than I. So were are not talking about a mass produced rifle. Although I do have one Sako Finlight in a 270 WSM that would probably do it too
 
One other way is if you clean your rifle between groups while loading shoot for a while without cleaning and see if one opens up or tightens up with a dirty barrel. If your not overly anal about scrubbing your barrel this may make the decision for you.
 
One other way is if you clean your rifle between groups while loading shoot for a while without cleaning and see if one opens up or tightens up with a dirty barrel. If your not overly anal about scrubbing your barrel this may make the decision for you.
Unrelated to what you’re asking but another way to pick between loads
 
Well I agree, but in your original post it appeared as you were saying shoot a crap ton get the barrel hot then tell me what you got. And, I have not tried 30 with that rifle, but I feel pretty confident it will shoot 20 to 30 inside 1 MOA at 100. In fairness, it is a custom that shoots better than I. So were are not talking about a mass produced rifle. Although I do have one Sako Finlight in a 270 WSM that would probably do it too

My point was simply on sample size to determine your cone, not about getting it hot. Hell, do 3 10 shot groups and let it cool between, let's see it. I have plenty of custom rifles too but im not going to make those claims!
 
In the end validation at different locations, varied elevation, at different distances proving your calculations and info input is correct. My system earns its place with me on game from validation. Confidence comes with experience. Practice much further than your personal set limits and also practice your intended max and In between…Like building a house check your boxes along the way and repeat. Good luck
 
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