California "premium" zones

[TrinityAlps]

Theres deer in x4. Just not as many on the west side where I was hunting apparently. Saw 3 dinks at dusk, one shooter which I got on the 6th morning, and one big bear. My buddy ate tag soup only because he didnt have 2 weeks to dedicate to the season. I was going to move to the east side of the unit day 7 for the 2nd half of the season but tagged out. The logging co land on the east side was closed that year but it didnt stop some people. Pretty sure some monsters are hiding in the foothill sage shrubs too. We were hunting adjacent to private water and alfalfa on public blm in 2018.

Do you know if Sierra Pacific closes those roads to vehicles? They look like good areas but they are littered with logging roads. My main goal is to get as far away from the road hunters as possible.

 

[Moserkr]

I live near SP logging lands and a lot of times the roads are open. Sometimes they are closed. IF its a bad fire season (pretty much every year the last 4 years), then the land will be closed to hunting completely. Either way, theres lot of land to hunt and most people we saw were road hunting. Theres not really any spots to pack in so the whole unit is fairly accessible. Only wildcard is fire closures, especially on logging land.

 

[TrinityAlps]

That's too bad about the lack of places to pack in. I'll keep my fingers crossed for no fire closures. Appreciate the info!

 

[Barse41]

I’ve always heard from folks who live in the mountains: The only time I don’t shoot deerts. Is during deer season

 

[chukwithak]

Habitat, drought, and predators. Go kill a bear and save a few fawns.

Anyone needs to know where a few are around Sierra at Tahoe, let me know. SOOOO many only game cameras.

 

[chukwithak]

3 points on one side was a failed practice in Ca years back. A whole lot of big forks were killed and abandoned.

There are some seriously nice big bucks that come from some of those low point X zones. You just need to know where to hunt.

Even though it was a failed practice, it needs to be reimplemented and help re-establish the herd along with more bear hunters and the legalization of Lion hunting. I didn't get into bear hunting until killing one with a tag when I stumbled upon one. Now as soon as deer season is over, it's bear season. YOu can make some good meats out of bear!

 

[Hunt_Jefferson]

Anyone needs to know where a few are around Sierra at Tahoe, let me know. SOOOO many only game cameras.

Given that I’m sitting in camp 2 miles south of S@T and haven’t seen jack besides some crusty trails and well-dried bear scat I could use a tip or three

 

[chukwithak]

Given that I’m sitting in camp 2 miles south of S@T and haven’t seen jack besides some crusty trails and well-dried bear scat I could use a tip or three

PM'd

 

[WeiserBucks]

Even though it was a failed practice, it needs to be reimplemented

This is the most California thing I've heard in a while.

It's failed in every state that has ever attempted it, and will continue to fail. Why do you want to continue implementing failed policies?

 

[Bubblehide]

Even though it was a failed practice, it needs to be reimplemented and help re-establish the herd along with more bear hunters and the legalization of Lion hunting. I didn't get into bear hunting until killing one with a tag when I stumbled upon one. Now as soon as deer season is over, it's bear season. YOu can make some good meats out of bear!

I agree with the latter 2. However, it was a failed practice because guys would shoot them thinking they were legal bucks, discover they were not legal bucks, leave them lay and continue hunting, possibly killing more buck that do not meet the 3 point or more limit. So the idea of bringing back such a failed practice just sounds insane to me, as I see it negatively impacting herd numbers, and not help re-establishing herds that are actually at traditional numbers.

But I get it, you want the herd numbers at the artificial highs of the 60's, 70's and 80's. Unfortunately, that is never likely to happen again as land practices are very very different now.

 

[Ducks&Bulls]

They just need to make it 1 tag for deer hunters and change the zones to single hunt zones, not D3-5 or C1-4 etc. And cut tags in high tag areas and in the premium zones. Why were there 800 x3b tags in the past? I'm all for quality of the hunt and this would help, especially with less pressure. Hunting with dogs is done and hunting lions/bobcats will never happen again. Be fortunate that we can still hunt bear. Look at Washington spring bear, they closed it for no reason based on studies.

 

[chukwithak]

This is the most California thing I've heard in a while.

It's failed in every state that has ever attempted it, and will continue to fail. Why do you want to continue implementing failed policies?

Other states don’t have a population issue ruined by poor management like California does. Not saying other states haven’t lowered numbers, but California is currently on an island of its own. In more ways than one.

By my understanding, the more available men there are to mate with available women, produces more offspring. Applying the same thought to any other animal seems like pretty logical knowledge. Maybe I’m wrong and you can educate me rather than criticize.

Now for the unethical hunter, that I can’t speak for. So where is my “Most California like” thinking wrong?

 

[chukwithak]

I agree with the latter 2. However, it was a failed practice because guys would shoot them thinking they were legal bucks, discover they were not legal bucks, leave them lay and continue hunting, possibly killing more buck that do not meet the 3 point or more limit. So the idea of bringing back such a failed practice just sounds insane to me, as I see it negatively impacting herd numbers, and not help re-establishing herds that are actually at traditional numbers.

But I get it, you want the herd numbers at the artificial highs of the 60's, 70's and 80's. Unfortunately, that is never likely to happen again as land practices are very very different now.

I don’t expect that. Growing up in the 80/90’s could count 60+ deer in a day in X1. This year and over the past 10, we’ve been lucky to see a couple in a week. I know blue tongue played a role, but the herd should have been able to grow back. That’s not happened.

 

[Bubblehide]

I don’t expect that. Growing up in the 80/90’s could count 60+ deer in a day in X1. This year and over the past 10, we’ve been lucky to see a couple in a week. I know blue tongue played a role, but the herd should have been able to grow back. That’s not happened.

In the 80's I could count over 100 deer in X1 within 3 miles and never getting out of the truck. X3B over 100 withing 1 mile, again never getting out of the truck.

Harvest as many bears as your can, and try to get everyone you know on board with that. I'd say the same for mountain lion, but the voters of Ca, simply vote with emotion.

 

[WeiserBucks]

Now for the unethical hunter, that I can’t speak for. So where is my “Most California like” thinking wrong?

In a nutshell, you can't do anything about unethical hunters, the landscape would be littered with 3 point carcasses rotting. Most 2 point deer aren't sexually mature and do an insignificant portion of the breeding. Waiting until they're a 3 point and potentially breeding age means nothing if you shoot them in Sept/Oct before they breed a single doe.

You guys have a predator issue along with a massively excessive amount of tags. No amount of antler point restrictions is going to correct that. It's been implemented all across the west at one point or another and it's failed every single time. History is valuable and should not be ignored.

 

[chukwithak]

In the 80's I could count over 100 deer in X1 within 3 miles and never getting out of the truck. X3B over 100 withing 1 mile, again never getting out of the truck.

Harvest as many bears as your can, and try to get everyone you know on board with that. I'd say the same for mountain lion, but the voters of Ca, simply vote with emotion.

I felt like it was a 100+ a day. I know we used to keep count. I was single digits old in the 80’s. Dad and Grandfather were raised in Mt Shasta and we hunted out of McCloud. Hard to remember if my memories were right but I knew it was high! I’ve actually learned to appreciate the bear meat. It’s amazing how much “bad” I have heard about the meat. Anyone kills a bear and doesn’t want to the meat, I will gladly take it.

 

[chukwithak]

In a nutshell, you can't do anything about unethical hunters, the landscape would be littered with 3 point carcasses rotting. Most 2 point deer aren't sexually mature and do an insignificant portion of the breeding. Waiting until they're a 3 point and potentially breeding age means nothing if you shoot them in Sept/Oct before they breed a single doe.

You guys have a predator issue along with a massively excessive amount of tags. No amount of antler point restrictions is going to correct that. It's been implemented all across the west at one point or another and it's failed every single time. History is valuable and should not be ignored.

Do you feel adjusting hunt seasons will help? Other than predators, how else can it be corrected.

I understand that young bucks won’t mate, but won’t it also provide more mature bucks available the following year? Also distract the predators from the older more mature bucks? I just can’t fathom that restricting hunters more won’t provide a better population. Maybe I’m ignorant. Also doing it for a couple years don’t king enough to see change.

 

[WeiserBucks]

It'll take drastically shortening your 2 month rifle season and massive reduction of tags and predators, all at once, for decades. Good luck.

 

[chukwithak]

It'll take drastically shortening your 2 month rifle season and massive reduction of tags and predators, all at once, for decades. Good luck.

Honestly if they had to shut it down for a decade so that our children and others could experience a good hunt life, I could deal with hunting other states until then. I’m already focusing out of state. What it is now, is not ok.

 

[Bubblehide]

Do you feel adjusting hunt seasons will help? Other than predators, how else can it be corrected.

I understand that young bucks won’t mate, but won’t it also provide more mature bucks available the following year? Also distract the predators from the older more mature bucks? I just can’t fathom that restricting hunters more won’t provide a better population. Maybe I’m ignorant. Also doing it for a couple years don’t king enough to see change.

Young bucks will mate, it's an innate drive. However, decades ago the was a study of white-tailed deer. In short what was found in the study was that when there was low buck to doe ration, there was also a lack of competition, and competitive behaviors, resulting in fewer does bread. In other words, competition fuels breeding.

Predators go after the weak and weary, bucks that have been actively breeding are both weak and weary. As such they are much more likely to be predated upon.

The old saying is that 10 percent of hunters kill 99 percent of the deer. My point here is that you can reduce the number of tags, but it is not likely to reduce the overall harvest. If we went to only 1 deer tag per hunter for the entire state, and significantly decreased tags in zones well below traditional herd numbers, you still are not likely to make much of a dent, as the predators would be the beneficiaries and their populations would grow.

The voters have effectively taken predator control away from our Department of Fish and Wildlife; i.e., mountain lion, no hounds, wolf protection ... the only predators we can still hunt is bear and coyotes.