California D3-5 Hunters... Smarter Not Harder!

[Muley Buck]

I like you have been hunting and backpacking the sierras for a long time. I’ve spent at least 7 days in D zone (most years a lot more than that) every year since 1994 and haven’t missed a year yet. I def agree with you that there is a lot in play in our neck of the sierras. What I’m telling you is that is has way more to do with vegetation and micro climates than it does hunting pressure.

What I can tell you from what I’ve seen, and maybe I’m just not the best hunter but it works for me year after year and that’s all that matters to me...

Love it! If ain't broke don't fix it!

The deer are there. They may not be there during the season, but they don’t just disappear and “abandon” areas like guys think just because a few of them may get shot at for a few weeks out of the year. Or Billy Jack with his bow goes stomping through beds thinking he knows what he’s doing.

I'll give you that, topography can and will play a big role in that though. In my experience (at those elevations and in that type of country) most of the time they head to secondary living areas when that happens. How close is that to the bucks original location?? Answer is, it depends, I've seen bucks leave their original living area and relocate only a few hundred yards away. Then other times I've found that bucks have relocated up to 2 miles away in a completely different drainage.

They flat out don’t just disappear never to return again like everyone says. “Ah hell that good area we used to hunt is just shot out”. I always ask those guys how many times have you been to that spot in April May and June? Or for that matter, seeing how long after the season they stick around on dry years where late November and December snow packs are low enough? The biggest and baddest deer I ever laid eyes on stepped out 30 yards away from me on a hiking trail in D5 right at 8,000 feet of elevation. This was the 2nd week of December in 2006. I wish I had a camera he was just a thing of beauty. I looked for him the next year starting in late April, saw lots of deer but never found “the one” as I fondly refer to him lol.

You're right, they don't just disappear. Although I have seen mountainsides that used to hold deer at one time that no longer do, due to legitimately being shot out. The deer simply cannot survive there because the hunting pressure was/is too great now. If I'm guessing correctly, (I think) I have a good idea about how and what you are doing. If that is the case, people saying “Ah hell that good area we used to hunt is just shot out” is just one of many excuses hunters use so they don't have to look at their own impatience and inadequacies. Those deer are indeed there. Ultimately I believe it is all situational and small things can have big impacts.

You’re right though there are a ton of arguments and strategies that work for guys that hunt this specific area. I was just offering a bit of advice for the guys who think they have to get out into the middle of nowhere when they simply don’t.

Sorry and I apologize if I came across combative, that was not my intent at all. Don't get me wrong, I think you have tapped into a style of hunting and a line of thinking that most hunters will never experience, and I champion that! I enjoy reading and thinking about your perspective as well as others here. Hey, maybe we can show each other a thing or two someday.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

@Muley Buck I didn’t take it as combative at all. Just two guys who get it done out there and trying to help others when we can!

Really appreciate your insight. I love learning from other hunters and I’m always adapting one season to the next. PM me if you ever want to chat or plan some scouting or whatever some time.

 

[Muley Buck]

@Muley Buck I didn’t take it as combative at all. Just two guys who get it done out there and trying to help others when we can!

Really appreciate your insight. I love learning from other hunters and I’m always adapting one season to the next. PM me if you ever want to chat or plan some scouting or whatever some time.

Right on bud!
BTW, I like your avatar. That's fun country right there.

 

[slvrslngr]

This is some great insight fellas, thanks for sharing. My brother is hunting those units this year so hope he’s following this thread.

 

[nubrun]

I'll be hunting D5 this year. My buddy snagged a nice buck about a mile off the road last year. Hopefully I'll have the same luck.

 

[fuelthehunt]

Glad I came across this thread. First year putting out cams and got two decent bucks on cam already. Curious now as how to hunt them during archery. Recently picked up a tree stand and thinking of hunting from it but have never done so before. Advice as to where to set up a treestand? Thanks!

 

[rolocasi]

Great thread guys! I am learning D3-D5; depending how duck season starts out I will be hunting the last week on October in D4 or 3; hard to adjust hunting in such dense environments; (I am used to Nevada/long glassing type of hunting); Determined to get my first Cali buck.

 

[Roadhntr69]

100%. Some nice bucks on there


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[Jfjfrye]

Thanks for all the great information fellas.... I’m new to d3-5 and and having trouble finding deer consistently. Feels like as soon as you think you found an area they like that you never see another deer. It’s a wonderful and tough nut to crack. I mainly hunt d4 but looking at the stats 3&5 have way better success. This may only be because of the size of each unit.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Some more food for thought for some of the newer hunters trying to tackle these zones.

Another strategy that works really well in D3-5 is “getting in bed” with the deer. Find a known travel path between feeding areas and watering areas where you see recent sign and tracks. These can be seen on “hips” between drainages and the thousands of alpine lakes and ponds in these zones. You’ll learn to recognize these deer travel highways which are the “path of least resistance” for the deer to move through.

I like to sneak in late at night to small clearings in the woods near known travel paths with fresh sign. Go to sleep at night and then wake up and hunt without moving, other than to get out of my bag and get the rifle ready. If nothing comes through I’ll still hunt along the deer trail slowly all day. Then set up in another clearing for the evening sit.

This is a super effective strategy, you just have to be prepared to be absolutely quiet for 3 or 4 days and “become” a part of the small area you are hunting. Takes a lot of discipline and patience and moving painfully slowly along active trails. I’ve had more success with this strategy in D3-5 than I have glassing up high and trying to stalk in on deer.

 

[Hackleback]

The stable, warm and very dry weather has made this a challenging year. Deer are still full nocturnal mode and the challenge is finding one during shooting hours. As for "still hunting", good luck. Its so dry that stepping on needle duff (no sticks or branches) provides a resounding CRUNCH. I've been mostly stand hunting, though this is good for at most an hour morning and evening, what to do with the rest of the day. Ive spent this time checking out new areas. We just need a bit of weather, but it isn't looking good for the rest of the season.
Lots of road hunters, I've seen very few on foot.
Its defiantly not a lack of deer, just need to cross paths.
Good luck to all.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

The stable, warm and very dry weather has made this a challenging year. Deer are still full nocturnal mode and the challenge is finding one during shooting hours. As for "still hunting", good luck. Its so dry that stepping on needle duff (no sticks or branches) provides a resounding CRUNCH. I've been mostly stand hunting, though this is good for at most an hour morning and evening, what to do with the rest of the day. Ive spent this time checking out new areas. We just need a bit of weather, but it isn't looking good for the rest of the season.
Lots of road hunters, I've seen very few on foot.
Its defiantly not a lack of deer, just need to cross paths.
Good luck to all.

I just saw 4 legal bucks and several sets of does and fawns still hunting D3 two weeks ago. You need to learn how to move quietly through the woods or stay out of them because all you’re going to do is bump deer well before being able to get sightings or shots off. There are ways to navigate the deer trails quietly even on dry years. Takes lots of practice, patience, and getting creative. One of my hunting buddies isn’t as light on his feet as I am and has a lot less practice in the woods stalking. He took some old sheep skin car seat covers and made boot bottom dampeners out of them haha. Whatever it takes. He filled his D3-5 tag using the strategy I posted above.

It’s always interesting when you try to help hunters and give them strategies to be successful with a proven method in the exact zone you are hunting; only to have guys say things like “that doesn’t work”. This only seems to be a thing online. If I offer guys advice in person they are super appreciative of the knowledge and insight. Maybe I should stick to just not trying to help people online?

 

[Hunt_Jefferson]

We spent 3 days in D5 last weekend, took a new hunter out which helped because he had a place we could stay near the spot we picked out to hunt instead of driving in every day. We found lots of heavy deer trails and buck droppings, but even more bear scat. Even found a bear latrine because it was 3'x4' of dried scat! Unfortunately it was all rock hard which to me meant we missed them by a week or so.

We sat on those trails for 3 hours first light and last light for two days and didn't see a thing. Only deer we saw were a handful of does at noon on the way back to the cabin for lunch.

 

[amassi]

I just saw 4 legal bucks and several sets of does and fawns still hunting D3 two weeks ago. You need to learn how to move quietly through the woods or stay out of them because all you’re going to do is bump deer well before being able to get sightings or shots off. There are ways to navigate the deer trails quietly even on dry years. Takes lots of practice, patience, and getting creative. One of my hunting buddies isn’t as light on his feet as I am and has a lot less practice in the woods stalking. He took some old sheep skin car seat covers and made boot bottom dampeners out of them haha. Whatever it takes. He filled his D3-5 tag using the strategy I posted above.

It’s always interesting when you try to help hunters and give them strategies to be successful with a proven method in the exact zone you are hunting; only to have guys say things like “that doesn’t work”. This only seems to be a thing online. If I offer guys advice in person they are super appreciative of the knowledge and insight. Maybe I should stick to just not trying to help people online?

I wouldn't take it personally
More people will read and learn and not comment than people who feel the need to refute everything they read that goes against their ideals.

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[Jfjfrye]

I just saw 4 legal bucks and several sets of does and fawns still hunting D3 two weeks ago. You need to learn how to move quietly through the woods or stay out of them because all you’re going to do is bump deer well before being able to get sightings or shots off. There are ways to navigate the deer trails quietly even on dry years. Takes lots of practice, patience, and getting creative. One of my hunting buddies isn’t as light on his feet as I am and has a lot less practice in the woods stalking. He took some old sheep skin car seat covers and made boot bottom dampeners out of them haha. Whatever it takes. He filled his D3-5 tag using the strategy I posted above.

It’s always interesting when you try to help hunters and give them strategies to be successful with a proven method in the exact zone you are hunting; only to have guys say things like “that doesn’t work”. This only seems to be a thing online. If I offer guys advice in person they are super appreciative of the knowledge and insight. Maybe I should stick to just not trying to help people online?

Thank for the words of wisdom. I’ve hunted a long time and I’m still such a novice when I’m out of my element. Acting like a sponge is all I can do when im not in the field hoping to learn a little more everyday.

 

[MeatBuck]

I keep seeing so many posts of “high country” “going in deep” “hunt super hard” etc. And I always see guys continuing to complain year after year that “deer numbers are awful in California” and “didn’t fill my tag this year again”. You need to hunt smarter not harder. Here is one of example of many...

Let me point you to a video of a trail camera set up on public land in D5 no more than 500 yards from the road.

Hope this helps some of you rethink your strategy for this season and encourages you all to do your homework and get those boots on the ground early!

The effects of not killing anything was just too much for these guys to handle. Now they want your money to help fix it.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Hahahaha. Typical new age California archery hunter. Scouting during the season and boot stomping where deer are and not seeing them.

 

[BoltActionBrotherhood]

I got my wife a d3-5 tags this year. So I am hoping to get her on a buck in the lower portions. She will have just had a baby so I know she would be wanting to hike to much, afraid her guts might fall out.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

I got my wife a d3-5 tags this year. So I am hoping to get her on a buck in the lower portions. She will have just had a baby so I know she would be wanting to hike to much, afraid her guts might fall out.

I know a spot with lots of deer activity in D5 where you drive most the way on a forest service road. Then you take a dedicated easy hiking trail only about a mile in and then cut off the trail for another half mile or so. Very healthy herd there just about every year depending on snow pack. This year was a low snow year so should be busy with deer again this season. PM me.

 

[Bubblehide]

The effects of not killing anything was just too much for these guys to handle. Now they want your money to help fix it.

I had to laugh at their video. First, they did about everything wrong. They starter with glassing a slope in which the deer would not be on for the time of year they were hunting (sure there is a very minor chance of seeing deer on it). They were sitting on a ridge/slope in which the deer were likely to be on... They did not appear to get there by first light (I recommend minimum 1/2 hour before). They then moved location, sounding like a couple small dozers plowing through the forest. They finally sat at a spring (much too close IMNSHO); but the spring would have been a much better place in the morning, instead of after the deer are bedded for the day.

There analysis is completely wrong and lack knowledge and historical information. I mean if we look at Ca deer herd numbers from a historical perspective, we see that our herd numbers are pretty much at historical levels pretty much everywhere in the state. The excessively high herd numbers of the 50's to 80's have been directly attributed to land management practices. What I mean here is that ranching and farming practices of clearing land increased exponentially resulting in environmental/ecosystem changes that significantly favored deer resulting in huge population increases equivalent with the subsequent related subsequent increase in carrying capacity. Unfortunately, with current restrictions, laws, gov oversight... we are not likely to see land management practices change to favor increased deer populations, with the exception to forest management being possible.

They then compare Nevada to California, looking at draw and success odds; a very very unfair and unrealistic comparison. What I mean is that we here in Ca have an exponential increase in demand for hunting opportunity than residents in Nevada, given herd population to resident hunter population. Ca DFW has surveyed deer hunters here and the results were/are that having the opportunity to hunt is much more important to hunters here, than waiting years for a tag. What these guys are proposing is a significant decrease in tags, so that the hunter success numbers increase.

The above proposal assumes a tremendous amount of false information. First, reducing tag numbers is not going to increase herd numbers (on a statistical scientific level). As such, this will not result in increased success rates, despite the decreased tag numbers. The old saying comes to mind, 10% of the hunters fill 90+% of the tags year after year. So if we reduce tag numbers, we all will be waiting years for a tag, any tag, rather than actually hunting our resident/home state. They fail to recognize that our herd numbers are for the most part static/stable with some slightly increasing. They fail to recognize that what they propose (based only on the video) will result in drastic drops in tag numbers across the state, meaning we would go from having the opportunity of 2 deer tags per year, to a only one deer tag, will all zones being draw zones; resulting in a significantly large number of applicants not even drawing a deer tag. In other words, it could result in only being able to draw a tag in Ca once every few years, for the crappy zones, as the best zones already take a decade or more to draw.

I could literally go on and on about what is wrong with their video and proposal, but I think the point is made. Clearly not everyone will be happy with any states draw system. But I for one have adapted, and the vast majority of years, I get to hunt one of the crappiest X zones (I like the zone, know the zone, and am exceptionally successful, all due to expended boot leather) and one over the counter zone that is local to me.