Bull down 30 Nos 220 LRHT

[338maker]

@huntnful I am also going to try out the 225 edlm in my 22" 300 ultra mag ..
I have a couple customers that swear by them!

 

[huntnful]

@huntnful I am also going to try out the 225 edlm in my 22" 300 ultra mag ..
I have a couple customers that swear by them!

I wanted to used them last year, but they just didn't shoot well enough in my old barrel. Maybe they'll shoot small groups in this new barrel!

 

[CCooper]

Also on the bandwagon of leaving the Berger's (215's in my case) for the 225 ELDM in my 300 PRC this year. They are far less finicky in my barrel (1:9 Bart) to get to group small.

 

[huntnful]

Also on the bandwagon of leaving the Berger's (215's in my case) for the 225 ELDM in my 300 PRC this year. They are far less finicky in my barrel (1:9 Bart) to get to group small.

My new barrel is a 1-9 bartlein rem varmint also. Hopefully the ELDM's stack in there! I should find out in a week or so!

 

[Ucsdryder]

My new barrel is a 1-9 bartlein rem varmint also. Hopefully the ELDM's stack in there! I should find out in a week or so!

Let us know. The 147 and 180 have been stupid accurate for me.

 

[CCooper]

I have only messed with the 147 and 225 ELDM- neither seemed to be as fussy about seating as the Bergers I was using (215 & 156). Both barrels are Bartlein #13 Carbons, 1:7.5, and 1:9 respectively. Both shoot exceptional @ .025 off.

 

[762 ULTRAMAGA]

Funny I'm actually doing load development in my 300 NM ai with 225 eldms at the moment, shooting in the .3s with the first load I tried.
They're absolutely devastating on elk!
My wife completely stoned a cow with a 225 last season, it was a 200 yard double lung but she dropped so fast I thought it was a spinal hit

 

[huntnful]

Funny I'm actually doing load development in my 300 NM ai with 225 eldms at the moment, shooting in the .3s with the first load I tried.
They're absolutely devastating on elk!
My wife completely stoned a cow with a 225 last season, it was a 200 yard double lung but she dropped so fast I thought it was a spinal hit

Great to hear! Mind sharing your load data and velocities?!

 

[762 ULTRAMAGA]

Great to hear! Mind sharing your load data and velocities?!

I'm still fire forming, the load I tried with 225 eldms was the third firing on the cases I'm sending in to have my dies made.
I used 79 grains H1000 seated 3.56 oal, haven't chronoed yet but I'll do a little more development this weekend over the chrono.

 

[huntnful]

I'm still fire forming, the load I tried with 225 eldms was the third firing on the cases I'm sending in to have my dies made.
I used 79 grains H1000 seated 3.56 oal, haven't chronoed yet but I'll do a little more development this weekend over the chrono.

Oh okay perfect! Thanks for letting me know!

Yeah my last 300 NMI definitely wasn’t formed until after the second firing

 

[ElkPRC]

I’ve been essentially uniforming the meplat diameter rather than “opening” them up. Some of them it doesn’t remove any material some of them it will remove a tiny bit, the end result is all the holes are about the same diameter. Killed around 12 animals with them now including a cow elk with good performance.

Curious what your background/experience is with Berger expansion? Not questioning the validity, always interested to learn

I’d be willing to bet that if you are properly uniforming the holes you are likely reducing the BC but possibly making them more consistent. I liken this to trimming bullets and then pointing bullets that lead to a lesser but more consistent BC. Don’t see any issue in doing that as long as it’s consistent. I just would argue it is not doing anything at all to help with expansion.

As far as where I get my data from, it is honestly everywhere. Not trying to be insulting but all credible sources I have ever seen on the terminal ballistic characteristics of Berger bullets, or for that matter any BTHP projectile is the coming apart due to yaw.

Brian Litz the chief ballistician for Berger bullets I believe has addressed it at some point on his podcast the science of accuracy. The owner and founder of Gunwerks Aaron Davidson is probably the most knowledgable on the subject that I have found when it comes to the application in big game hunting. He has discussed the issue many times but I believe most recently he discussed it on the Backcountry Hunting podcast as well as on his own. Jaylon Quinlen(sorry is spelling isn’t right), has addressed the terminal characteristics of BTHP projectiles in general. So that is a source completely independent of Berger and being on of their competitors.

I would say go and watch high speed footage of a Berger bullet expanding in gel and look at the pieces that are left after. Not uncommon to find the full formed tip of the projectile still intact in the block. You will also see that Bergers go in a further than normal distance then a tipped bullet before expanding and then once expansion does occur there is typically a shift in direction of travel. This is where that yaw occurs.

Lastly, just think about it for a second. To me it truthfully doesn’t make sense for a BTHP projectile to mushroom open traditionally. Even more so when considering the newer pointed match bullets like the 220. One of the major advantages of a tipped bullet is the initiation of expansion, and even more so the consistency in expansion made by the softer tip collapsing and initiating the expansion. Ourside of that projectiles that do expand traditionally commonly have very large meplats that are open like the Hammer bullets or are filled exposed soft lead. Also think of the size of the opening or meplat if that tip was magically removed. That’s what is needed for traditional expansion to occur. So in that thought if the size of the meplat will not allow for a mushroom like expansion at the tip then think about the size of the cavity behind the meplat and how that is supported only by a thin copper jacket. To me it logically makes since that the point of failure, is at that point of weakness and the projectile will start to come apart. And that failure(which for hunting is what we want and a good thing) cannot be perfectly predicted on how it will fail every time with any form of consistency. It is likely that the failure will vary almost every shot due to whatever conditions it has faced and just the differences in that particular projectile construction. That’s why there has been lots of feedback recommending shots like a high shoulder hit to help induce that failure. Can’t predict exactly how it will happen every time but by going through a thick shoulder we can increase the odds of the failure happening which at the end of the day any failure in theory will cause fragmentation and expansion of energy giving us the result we want.

Sorry for long response. I’m not an expert by any means but I have done significant research on this and am extremely confident in my conclusion regarding the expansion characteristics of this style projectile.

I also want to clarify that I am in no way saying that this bullet shouldn’t be hunted with. I just built and finished load development on a 300 PRC shooting Berger 220’s that I will be taking to Colorado this fall. Should work great, I just think it’s important to know how the equipment you use works as infirmary decisions are always better.