Breaking the Echo Chamber: Combating Misinformation and Toxic Behaviors in the Hunting and Shooting Community

[atmat]

This is too good not to share. I saw this on LRH forum posted by @Petey308


Breaking the Echo Chamber: Combating Misinformation and Toxic Behaviors in the Hunting and Shooting Community

In the world of hunting and shooting, online forums, Facebook groups, and platforms like YouTube have become hubs for sharing knowledge, debating methods, and learning from others. While these spaces offer invaluable opportunities for growth, they also have their pitfalls. Chief among these are rampant misinformation, toxic behaviors, and psychological barriers like confirmation bias, cognitive dissonance, and the Dunning-Kruger effect.

Even more concerning is the rise of deceitful tactics, fabricated stories, and cult-like dynamics that can undermine the integrity of discussions and further divide the community. My goal here is to shed light on these issues, explore their impact, and offer actionable solutions to address them. Obviously I'm not a site owner, admin, moderator, or similar, but I am a concerned fellow hunter that only wants to see the community thrive.

The Psychological Barriers to Truth and Learning

Several common human tendencies contribute to the spread of misinformation and resistance to accurate information. Recognizing these tendencies is the first step toward overcoming them:

1. Echo Chambers and Social Bubbles

People often surround themselves with like-minded individuals or consume content that aligns with their beliefs. A great example would be platforms like YouTube's recommendation algorithm and how it amplifies this effect, continually feeding users videos that confirm their biases rather than challenge them.

2. Confirmation Bias

Confirmation bias is the tendency to seek out, interpret, and remember information that supports existing beliefs while ignoring or dismissing contradictory evidence. For example, someone might trust a YouTube video praising a specific cartridge/caliber or bullet but ignore data showing its limitations.

3. Cognitive Dissonance

When presented with information that conflicts with their worldview, people often experience mental discomfort (cognitive dissonance). Instead of reevaluating their stance, they may reject the new information to avoid this discomfort.

4. The Dunning-Kruger Effect

This cognitive bias leads individuals with limited knowledge or skill to overestimate their expertise. For example, on platforms like YouTube, this often manifests as creators presenting themselves as authorities despite lacking the necessary experience or knowledge, misleading viewers who don't know better.

5. Groupthink and Comment Cascades

In online communities, particularly forums, Facebook groups, and YouTube comment sections, groupthink and comment cascades can create a powerful snowball effect. A few individuals with strong opinions may dominate the discussion, and others quickly align with their stance—whether or not it's accurate.

This behavior is magnified when users from one platform are directed to another (e.g., a YouTube video linked in a forum), resulting in a flood of comments that reinforce the same viewpoint. This dynamic makes it difficult for other readers or viewers to discern what's true and discourages meaningful dialogue.

The Rise of Deceitful Tactics and Cult-Like Dynamics

Beyond the psychological barriers, another troubling trend in these spaces is the deliberate use of lies, deceit, and manipulation. These behaviors take various forms, including:

1. Fabricated Credentials and Stories

Some individuals fabricate their credentials, experience, or stories to appear more knowledgeable or credible. These lies often aim to discredit others or strengthen their position in debates.

2. Manipulative Debating Tactics

In heated discussions, certain users may deliberately twist others' words, create false narratives, or use "gotcha" tactics to make their opponents look incompetent or uninformed. This behavior often stems from a desire to "win" the argument at any cost.

3. Information Theft and Parroting

A particularly insidious behavior involves stealing information from more knowledgeable individuals during debates. These users will argue aggressively, extract detailed explanations, and then later present those same arguments as their own in different threads or discussions (repeating it like a parrot). Over time, they position themselves as "experts" to their group, gaining more influence and credibility.

4. Cult-Like Dynamics

Some groups or cliques in these communities function like cults. They rally around a few perceived or designated experts or leaders, echoing their views without question. These leaders often thrive on the loyalty of their followers, who defend them fiercely and dismiss opposing perspectives as heretical or uninformed.

The Consequences of These Behaviors

The effects of these toxic dynamics are far-reaching:

• Erosion of Trust: Lies and deceit undermine the credibility of entire communities.

• Misinformation Spread: Fabricated stories and parroted arguments amplify falsehoods.

• Stifled Growth: Honest, knowledgeable contributors may withdraw from discussions, leaving the community poorer for their absence.

• Divisiveness: Cult-like groups foster an "us vs. them" mentality, alienating outsiders and discouraging healthy debate.


A Path Forward: Addressing Misinformation and Toxic Behaviors

To build a stronger, more truthful hunting and shooting community, we must actively combat these issues. Here's how:

1. Spotting the Red Flags

• Fabricated Credentials: Look for inconsistencies in someone's claims about their experience or expertise.

• Manipulative Tactics: Be wary of users who twist words, use strawman arguments, or rely on insults rather than evidence.

• Parroting: Notice if someone's knowledge seems too rehearsed or if they consistently regurgitate information without demonstrating real understanding.

• Cult-Like Behavior: Watch for groups that blindly rally around a leader or dismiss all opposing views without consideration.


2. Dealing with Toxic Behaviors

• Stay Calm and Collected: Don't let manipulative tactics provoke an emotional response. Focus on presenting facts.

• Call Out Inconsistencies: Politely but firmly ask for clarification when someone's claims don't add up. For example: "That's an interesting point. Could you provide more details about your experience in this area?"

• Avoid Feeding the Trolls: Some individuals thrive on creating chaos. If a discussion becomes unproductive, disengage.


3. Combating Groupthink and Comment Cascades

• Encourage Independent Thinking: Remind others to evaluate claims based on evidence, not popularity.

• Diversify Input: Seek out multiple sources of information to counter the echo chamber effect.

• Model Critical Thinking: Ask probing questions that encourage others to think critically, e.g., "What data supports this claim?"


4. Addressing Information Theft

• Document Your Contributions: If you're sharing detailed information or arguments, consider backing them up with reputable sources and citing them in your posts.

• Challenge Misrepresentation: If someone reuses your ideas without credit, politely call attention to it.


Strengthening Our Community Through Truth

The hunting and shooting community is at its best when it values truth, respect, and collaboration. By identifying and addressing toxic behaviors, we can foster a more inclusive and productive environment. Whether you're engaging in forums, Facebook groups, or YouTube comment sections, remember: every interaction is an opportunity to elevate the conversation and contribute to a stronger, more informed community.

Let's break the echo chambers, reject misinformation, and create a space where truth and expertise can thrive.

Credit to…
Aaron Peterson

I can’t tell if this is real or satire.

 

[NDGuy]

Wow. It’s like watching the KGB defector video from decades ago.

No this time it's totally different with our political climate /s

 

[AleksanderSuave]

Breaking the Echo Chamber: Combating Misinformation and Toxic Behaviors in the Hunting and Shooting Community

A lot of this feels generational.

Hope every year it "ages out" but it seems to be a cycle...ignorance particularly.

A deer camp I was part of last year was mostly black guys. We hunted in a more rural area of michigan. Stopped at about the only open bar for a beer and warm dinner one of the nights. Didnt take long for the racist side of things to come out from the locals. Mind you this area is primarily hunting as its only draw during the time, like a lot of cities in non-metro areas of michigan.

Doesn't surprise me that the crowd that cant get past racism or bigotry, similarly cant have logical or factual discussions about any hunting related topics.

Same guys usually who think 6.5 creedmoor isnt "enough gun" for white tails.

Race aside, we've got people still blaming the "out of control wolf population" for deer harvest being down in this state...yet our numbers on deer show population higher than its ever been..

Nothing will stop some and their desire to shoot some wolves here though. Coyotes must get boring.

Hunting groups in my area (or state) seem to be very vocal about the wrong things..

We're not going to ever have logical conversations about the minutia of calibers or other complex items, when we cant get past the core basics and facts.

 

[CorbLand]

We are caught in interesting times. Many of us were taught to listen to the things our parents and grandparents said/taught because they have wisdom due to age, while simultaneously, we have a thing in our pocket that connects us to more information and knowledge than one can actually consume in a lifetime. Often, they are contradicting. We are caught in a balancing act of what information source to believe, and listen to.

 

[NDGuy]

We are caught in a balancing act of what information source to believe, and listen to.

Which is getting out of hand with rampant news vomit, straight bullshit circulating on social media, and tweets tanking/mooning stocks.

This is all part of the plan of our adversaries. Confuse, manipulate, divide.

 

[DangerRanger]

I have to care about all that fancy bs at work I come here to throw scopes at coolers and pretend we shoot elk with 223s

 

[CorbLand]

Which is getting out of hand with rampant news vomit, straight bullshit circulating on social media, and tweets tanking/mooning stocks.

This is all part of the plan of our adversaries. Confuse, manipulate, divide.

Or its just a symptom of our brains and society not being able to handle such a rapid change. I am 33 and I remember a time before the internet was available to the masses, then when it was only available in schools and libraries, to where we are now. You are talking this rise has taken place in less than 20 years. It is not the first time society has faced times like this. Similar things happened when the printing press allowed for information to be spread to the masses.

 

[Mr. October]

That write-up pretty much describes our entire society in general.

Certainly any social media platform or forum.

 

[Marbles]

That write-up pretty much describes our entire society in general.

Agree.

Exactly, but everyone thinks it's the "other" guys who do the things described in OP.

Much of the value of being aware of things like this is not to look for them in others, but rather to look for them in our own actions. Some things (confirmation bias, Dunning-Kruger effect to list two) are pretty universal to the point one could say they are hard wired in the brain. They surve a purpose, but we must learn to spot them in our own behavior and work with it.

I say work with it because eliminating it is a fools errand and believing we have done so and are logical creatures requires us to forgo self analysis. But, we can acknowledge them, and make a point of stepping back and analyzing our own behavior in situations, as well as build in safe mechanisms into our behavior.

When people start dogmatically applying parts of this to others in a blanket sort of way (which has already been demonstrated in this thread), it becames one more weapon of coercion against an idea, and a bullwark to protect us from actually engaging when faced with cognitive dissonance.

 

[Mr. October]

A lot of this feels generational.

Hope every year it "ages out" but it seems to be a cycle...ignorance particularly.

A deer camp I was part of last year was mostly black guys. We hunted in a more rural area of michigan. Stopped at about the only open bar for a beer and warm dinner one of the nights. Didnt take long for the racist side of things to come out from the locals. Mind you this area is primarily hunting as its only draw during the time, like a lot of cities in non-metro areas of michigan.

Doesn't surprise me that the crowd that cant get past racism or bigotry, similarly cant have logical or factual discussions about any hunting related topics.

Same guys usually who think 6.5 creedmoor isnt "enough gun" for white tails.

Race aside, we've got people still blaming the "out of control wolf population" for deer harvest being down in this state...yet our numbers on deer show population higher than its ever been..

Nothing will stop some and their desire to shoot some wolves here though. Coyotes must get boring.

Hunting groups in my area (or state) seem to be very vocal about the wrong things..

We're not going to ever have logical conversations about the minutia of calibers or other complex items, when we cant get past the core basics and facts.

We have a LOT of hunters here in PA totally convinced there are free ranging, breeding mountain lions in PA. Same crew argues that the Game Commission introduced coyotes. It' crazy. But the best thing to do is just smile and walk away.

 

[Hnthrdr]

It's diminishing returns in action. Few guys can shoot nasty bucking rifles well. So their accuracy tends to suck compared to a soft rifle.

Bullet performance is predictable a similarly expanding .224 and .375 at similar impact velocity will have similar results but different magnitude.

If we as riflemen would shoot those 8lb unbraked 300rum rifles well and often, we'd shoot all rifles well....but the trend is to take all field fundamentals out and make every shot a bench shot with gadgets and such.

I know I know. I’m just asking stupid circular questions on the internet… seems like both sides could be a “cult” I am putting together a 6cm tikka right now so I’m a cult man myself

 

[Mr. October]

Agree.


Much of the value of being aware of things like this is not to look for them in others, but rather to look for them in our own actions. Some things (confirmation bias, Dunning-Kruger effect to list two) are pretty universal to the point one could say they are hard wired in the brain. They surve a purpose, but we must learn to spot them in our own behavior and work with it.

I say work with it because eliminating it is a fools errand and believing we have done so and are logical creatures requires us to forgo self analysis. But, we can acknowledge them, and make a point of stepping back and analyzing our own behavior in situations, as well as build in safe mechanisms into our behavior.

When people start dogmatically applying parts of this to others in a blanket sort of way (which has already been demonstrated in this thread), it becames one more weapon of coercion against an idea, and a bullwark to protect us from actually engaging when faced with cognitive dissonance.

Agreed. More than once I have caught myself parroting some idea that has been implanted in my brain through the repetition of others. Perhaps some instances slipped through the cracks but I try to be good about critically thinking on my own and stopping myself from such responses.

 

[NDGuy]

Or its just a symptom of our brains and society not being able to handle such a rapid change. I am 33 and I remember a time before the internet was available to the masses, then when it was only available in schools and libraries, to where we are now. You are talking this rise has taken place in less than 20 years. It is not the first time society has faced times like this. Similar things happened when the printing press allowed for information to be spread to the masses.

IMO Pandora's box is opened, no more putting it back. We all are being undermined by foreign influence.

 

[svivian]

We live in a world now where everyone is so worried about

1. what people think of them/what they are doing
2. what they think of other people/what they are doing/what they are using
3. always being right
4. changing someones mind/opinion

I think social media has really exacerbated these things.

 

[FuddRucker]

Much of the value of being aware of things like this is not to look for them in others, but rather to look for them in our own actions. Some things (confirmation bias, Dunning-Kruger effect to list two) are pretty universal to the point one could say they are hard wired in the brain. They surve a purpose, but we must learn to spot them in our own behavior and work with it.

I say work with it because eliminating it is a fools errand and believing we have done so and are logical creatures requires us to forgo self analysis. But, we can acknowledge them, and make a point of stepping back and analyzing our own behavior in situations, as well as build in safe mechanisms into our behavior.

When people start dogmatically applying parts of this to others in a blanket sort of way (which has already been demonstrated in this thread), it becames one more weapon of coercion against an idea, and a bullwark to protect us from actually engaging when faced with cognitive dissonance.

Yes, this was the point of my comment. Dismissing these things as behaviors of the "other" and not something we all are susceptible to is part of the problem.

 

[FuddRucker]

IMO Pandora's box is opened, no more putting it back. We all are being undermined by foreign influence.

They figured out propaganda in the early 1900s, it didn't take long for it to become a weapon of war. Now the delivery systems are much more sophisticated with cell phones and social media

 

[IdahoBeav]

All those techniques work - just look at all the people lined up to give the ultra wealthy tax breaks, while listening to oligarchs spew non stop half truths and outright lies. Politicians at all levels have been elected based on it. Non elected oligarchs like Elon are changing votes in congress based on people following his misinformation, and his outright threats to financially support their rivals.

This is prime thread derailment bait.

 

[TaperPin]

This is prime thread derailment bait.

I simply agree 100% that all those manipulation techniques work well - the evidence is all around us. You don’t have to look at our government or even this century if that’s too painful - look at Europe after WW1 - it’s well documented that kids grew up being lied to, who grew into entire armies willing to ANYTHING asked of them.

 

[CorbLand]

IMO Pandora's box is opened, no more putting it back. We all are being undermined by foreign influence.

Definitely true. There is no going back. Which is why as a society we are going to have to learn to adapt to the changes. The hard thing is how rapidly things are changing and it will only become harder. If you think the things that are available today make it hard, wait until AI becomes widely used. Adaptation is harder with rapid change.

The truth will never be known but the same can be said for times before we had the internet and all it brought.

 

[CorbLand]

They figured out propaganda in the early 1900s, it didn't take long for it to become a weapon of war. Now the delivery systems are much more sophisticated with cell phones and social media

Propaganda was figured out well before the early 1900s.

Go back to pre printing press days. Only the rich and connected had access to books and literacy. It was used to manipulate and control people. One of the most notable instances was with the Bible. Once it was translated, distributed and more and more people became literate, many churches/governments fell from power because people were able to determine what it really said versus what they were told it said.

What is happening today is not new. What is new is the speed at which it is happening and the reach it has. There are pros and cons to it though.


All I am saying is that the world has seen big changes before and we adapted and lived through them. With those changes came good and bad. There are points on both sides to whether the positives out weigh the negatives and the other way around. Access and the ability for anyone to provide information allows for a lot of bullshit to be spewed. Little to no access and ability for anyone to provide information allows for a lot of bullshit to be spewed. Catch 22.