Barnes 225 TSX and Varget in 358 Win

[TauPhi111]

Does anyone load this combo? If so, what's your max load? I am currently trying to develop a load with this combo using the Hodgdon data for the 225 Sierra soft point from the Hodgdon website. The TSX is quite a bit longer so I'm wondering if the max load they give should be reduced much. The max load is 49 grains for the Sierra.

 

[marshland_max]

Hello

Does anyone load this combo? If so, what's your max load? I am currently trying to develop a load with this combo using the Hodgdon data for the 225 Sierra soft point from the Hodgdon website. The TSX is quite a bit longer so I'm wondering if the max load they give should be reduced much. The max load is 49 grains for the Sierra.

Hello, I'm a long time 358 shooter myself. I have played with that combo and quite honestly it's to long bullet.

You would be better served with the 200 tsx and Tac. The other powders of choice are H4895, IMR 3031.

Now I will tell you out of my rifle I can get a 200 TSX and 52 GR of TAC nocking on 2700 fps. Also one of my pet loads and also Western elk load is the Sierra 225 Gameking over 46.5 GR IMR 3031 for 2475 fps. I also use that exact same load with the Nosler 225 and the Speer 220. Also of those are sub moa out of my rifle.

Personally think the Barnes 225 is way to long and takes up way to much case capacity to make it very usable. The trick with the 358 for me was using a bullet that allowed me to fill the case with an appropriate powder.

Ramshot Tac and IMR 3031 are by far my preferred choices.

I would recommend that you try the 200 GR TSX with Ramshot TAC it's an unbelievable combo that's good to 300 - 400 yards.

Also Barnes bullets and cup and core bullets are certainly not interchangeable. But you would need to reduce the load.

Here ya go, be safe ..............

Cartridge : .358 Win.
Bullet : .358, 225, Barnes 'TSX' 30457
Useable Case Capaci: 43.199 grain H2O = 2.805 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.780 inch = 70.61 mm
Barrel Length : 20.0 inch = 508.0 mm
Powder : Hodgdon VARGET *T



-20.0 102 39.20 2047 2094 38515 5521 86.5 1.258
-18.0 104 40.18 2099 2202 41332 5697 87.7 1.220
-16.0 107 41.16 2152 2313 44391 5869 88.9 1.182
-14.0 109 42.14 2204 2428 47715 6036 90.1 1.146
-12.0 112 43.12 2258 2546 51334 6197 91.2 1.110 ! Near Maximum !
-10.0 114 44.10 2311 2669 55284 6352 92.3 1.075 ! Near Maximum !
-08.0 117 45.08 2365 2795 59606 6499 93.3 1.041 DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-06.0 120 46.06 2420 2925 64346 6637 94.2 1.008 DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-04.0 122 47.04 2474 3059 69559 6767 95.1 0.976 DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-02.0 125 48.02 2530 3197 75315 6887 95.9 0.946 DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!






Cheers


Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

 

[robtattoo]

TAC is definitely the way forward, I think.
I tried Varget under Speer 220s & the results were disappointing. I had to get up to 50.5 gn before I hit 2400fps. Because of the shank length of the Barnes, I doubt you'd even squeeze that much in the case.
Switched out to TAC & with the same 220, I'm getting 2560fps at 49gn with absolutely zero pressure signs.

I've got some test loads to take to the range tomorrow, from 49-52gn under a 200gn Hornady. I'm really hoping for 2700+

Talk to Luke Moffatt about this. He was my sounding board for load development. I think that if you really want or have to shoot monos, the 180gn TXS I'd really around the sweet spot. Heavier bullets, you're kinda limited to traditional lead core. Not that that's a bad thing! A 200gn bullet around 2700 puts it above .30-06, in a short action!

 

[TauPhi111]

HelloHello, I'm a long time 358 shooter myself. I have played with that combo and quite honestly it's to long bullet.

You would be better served with the 200 tsx and Tac. The other powders of choice are H4895, IMR 3031.

Now I will tell you out of my rifle I can get a 200 TSX and 52 GR of TAC nocking on 2700 fps. Also one of my pet loads and also Western elk load is the Sierra 225 Gameking over 46.5 GR IMR 3031 for 2475 fps. I also use that exact same load with the Nosler 225 and the Speer 220. Also of those are sub moa out of my rifle.

Personally think the Barnes 225 is way to long and takes up way to much case capacity to make it very usable. The trick with the 358 for me was using a bullet that allowed me to fill the case with an appropriate powder.

Ramshot Tac and IMR 3031 are by far my preferred choices.

I would recommend that you try the 200 GR TSX with Ramshot TAC it's an unbelievable combo that's good to 300 - 400 yards.

Also Barnes bullets and cup and core bullets are certainly not interchangeable. But you would need to reduce the load.

Here ya go, be safe ..............

Cartridge : .358 Win.
Bullet : .358, 225, Barnes 'TSX' 30457
Useable Case Capaci: 43.199 grain H2O = 2.805 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.780 inch = 70.61 mm
Barrel Length : 20.0 inch = 508.0 mm
Powder : Hodgdon VARGET *T



-20.0 102 39.20 2047 2094 38515 5521 86.5 1.258
-18.0 104 40.18 2099 2202 41332 5697 87.7 1.220
-16.0 107 41.16 2152 2313 44391 5869 88.9 1.182
-14.0 109 42.14 2204 2428 47715 6036 90.1 1.146
-12.0 112 43.12 2258 2546 51334 6197 91.2 1.110 ! Near Maximum !
-10.0 114 44.10 2311 2669 55284 6352 92.3 1.075 ! Near Maximum !
-08.0 117 45.08 2365 2795 59606 6499 93.3 1.041 DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-06.0 120 46.06 2420 2925 64346 6637 94.2 1.008 DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-04.0 122 47.04 2474 3059 69559 6767 95.1 0.976 DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-02.0 125 48.02 2530 3197 75315 6887 95.9 0.946 DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!






Cheers


Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

Thanks for the info. Is this Quickload data? If so, what are the columns?

 

[TauPhi111]

Thanks to the both of you for your suggestions. I'll have to look at some TAC in the future.

I've actually shot the 225 grain bullet in my 358 for some time now. I used to shoot the Buffalo Bore 225 grain TSX load, and then I started handloading it. My 358 is my primary PA bear drive gun, where shots are rarely more than 50 yards, so I've never been too worried about high velocity. I developed a load with a bunch of pulldown 7.62x54R powder I had based on a ton of reading I had done. It was pretty close to IMR 4895 and got me about 2350 which i was happy with. But now I'm out of that powder and I'm looking for a load with one of the powders I usually buy. The 225 TSX has been so accurate in my gun I am hesitant to try others, especially when 500+ lb bears are possible. If I was deer hunting or elk hunting I'd likely step down to the 200 or 180 TTSX, but for now I'd like to stay with the 225. Thanks again for your input from the both of you.

 

[marshland_max]

Thanks to the both of you for your suggestions. I'll have to look at some TAC in the future.

I've actually shot the 225 grain bullet in my 358 for some time now. I used to shoot the Buffalo Bore 225 grain TSX load,

No prob! Yes, that's off my quick loads program.

As follows, % of desired load -/+, case fill %/density, charge, fps, energy, pressure.

Also not that the 225 tsx doesn't work, it's just no ideal for the 358 case.

These days I really like the 200 GR bullets at/near or at 2700 fps and 220/225 std bullets at/near 2500 fps. Both easily achieved.

Cheer's

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

 

[TauPhi111]

No prob! Yes, that's off my quick loads program.

As follows, % of desired load -/+, case fill %/density, charge, fps, energy, pressure.

Also not that the 225 tsx doesn't work, it's just no ideal for the 358 case.

These days I really like the 200 GR bullets at/near or at 2700 fps and 220/225 std bullets at/near 2500 fps. Both easily achieved.

Cheer's

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

Well, Varget is definitely not the powder to use in my rifle for this bullet. Your quickload data was pretty close. I started at 45 grains per the Hodgdon data, and that started out at 1958 FPS with no pressure signs. But by 46.5 grains I was getting completely flattened primers and only 2160 FPS. Granted, this is an 18 inch barrel, but still not good. Barnes lists a load for this bullet with Benchmark, so I went and bought some just to play it safe. I'm going to keep loading the 225 around 2300-2400 FPS for bear, I'd like to experiment with the 200 grain TTSX and TAC though, as you suggested. You said you use 52 grains of that over the 200 TSX, but would you mind sharing your starting charge you used to develop that? With the MV you say you get from that, I think that would make an awesome elk load for the timber, but where you also might get a longer shot.

 

[robtattoo]

I couldn't say how max worked up to 52gn, but I always start at the max load for the next bullet weight up, and work up from there. In my case, found down in weight from 220 to 200, I started at 49 & worked up to 52. Unfortunately for me conditions were waaaay less than ideal at the range today & I couldn't get a reliable chrono reading. My groups suggested that 51.5 was the best load for my gun, but I couldn't even guess at the velocity. I had zero pressure signs right up to 52.
I'd actually like to try several further loads until I see pressure signs. I'm shooting a 20" barrel, so my velocity is probably a little under published data.
I really would like to see the magic 2800, but that's probably a pipe dream!

 

[marshland_max]

Well, Varget is definitely not the powder to use in my rifle for this bullet. Your quickload data was pretty close. I started at 45 grains per the Hodgdon data, and that started out at 1958 FPS with no pressure signs. But by 46.5 grains I was getting completely flattened primers and only 2160 FPS. Granted, this is an 18 inch barrel, but still not good. Barnes lists a load for this bullet with Benchmark, so I went and bought some just to play it safe. I'm going to keep loading the 225 around 2300-2400 FPS for bear, I'd like to experiment with the 200 grain TTSX and TAC though, as you suggested. You said you use 52 grains of that over the 200 TSX, but would you mind sharing your starting charge you used to develop that? With the MV you say you get from that, I think that would make an awesome elk load for the timber, but where you also might get a longer shot.

Start at 49 GR and work up with your rifle. Use the TSX not the TTSX you will have bullet seating issues with the tipped version in 358. I tried and tried to get that TTSX to work out but the the 180 TTSX at an 1" in length or so fits much better

Tac is awesome in the 358, no compressed loads and no pressure problems from my experience.

Also sounds like you bear hunt like do. Check out the Speer 250 hot core! 48 GR of TAC and I'm getting 2425 fps out my rife. It's got a great BC for a 35 cal and it's soft enough to expand without coming apart. I use that load alot.

Also, Hornady list both TAC and Exterminator in there book loadings for the 358. Might one to pick a copy of their book up. It's a good source.

Also back several years John Barness did an article about the 338 and 358 using TAC.

Cheers

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