Bag and pad systems

[Thomas26280]

I’m new here so if this has been answered I could not find it and please pardon my ignorance. I’m planning my first hunt out west for 2021, I dwell in West Virginia so this pack hunting stuff is new to me. I’m trying to go on a late season rifle hunt and have been looking at pads and bags for a while and I can’t make heads or tails of it. The pad I’ve been looking at is the xtherm which has big R value but if I go that route should I get a 20 degree bag or maybe a lesser R value pad and a warmer bag? I will again apologize if this has been covered and thanks in advance.

 

[mlob1one]

All depends on what state and elevation. I'd say highest R value and a 15-20° bag. Being too warm is easy to fix, being too cold sleeping is awful.

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[HighCountryHill33]

I agree with mlob1one. Remember that most bags won't actually warm you, they only insulate whatever is inside the bag (like a cooler). If there's cold stuff in the bag, it keeps it cold, if there's warm stuff in the bag it keeps it warm. Go with a high R-value pad and a good 20 degree bag. I run an ultralight stove on the late season stuff and will still put some nalgene bottles filled with hot water in my bag about 20 minutes before i climb in and alot of times will do some push ups or jumping jacks to get my core temp up before i climb in for the night.

 

[Wacko]

I agree with the above.

When you say late season, I think middle to late November, that means COLD generally. It's always possible to have "bluebird" weather at that time too, here in Colorado anyway. I will suggest you "over rate" your system. High R value pad, and I'd say a 0* bag. It depends on the state you are planning on and actual time of the hunt. It's far easier to compensate for being "too warm", than it is to get "warmer".

If you do the 20* bag, I would make sure your clothing system can be used with the bag as a "system supplement". It will extend your temp rating and conditions. Using clothing does have some downsides too so be aware of that. IE: more moisture to "cook" out of your clothes when you get out of the bag etc.

Enjoy the hunt!!

 

[Thomas26280]

Yes late season being mid late November in Idaho, I have already purchased a tipi tent with stove jack and will be getting the stove soon. Do you guys have any bags you are particularly fond of as I’m hunting for a good one now.

 

[Indian Summer]

As you learn about hunting remember one philosophy: Hope for the best and plan for the worst.

A 20 degree bag won’t keep you warm if it’s 20 degrees. Most people will agree with that. If you get warm unzip your bag. If you’re still warm hang a leg out. If you’re cold you’re cold!

I never heard of that pad. If you’re interested in the highest R value out there check out an eXped Downmat. I love mine. Super warm and I could sleep on rocks. My bag is a minus 30. Good to zero which is common in late season.

 

[Rich M]

I ended up getting a -20 Browning mummy bag and a 0 Coleman square bag for our trip last year - night temps were from 20 to - whatever (heater did not warm tent on coldest nights but would if it was say 0 or above). Neither I nor my aged father had any issues with the bags - dad used the 0 degree square one and was fine.

Your wood stove should be warmer than my buddy heater on 20# propane can in an 8x12 wall tent.

 

[Thomas26280]

Thanks for the replies, I should have specified that weight is a factor being I may be traveling miles each day.

 

[sneaky]

As you learn about hunting remember one philosophy: Hope for the best and plan for the worst.

A 20 degree bag won’t keep you warm if it’s 20 degrees. Most people will agree with that. If you get warm unzip your bag. If you’re still warm hang a leg out. If you’re cold you’re cold!

I never heard of that pad. If you’re interested in the highest R value out there check out an eXped Downmat. I love mine. Super warm and I could sleep on rocks. My bag is a minus 30. Good to zero which is common in late season.

You've never heard of a Thermarest NeoAir Xtherm? Really? That's surprising. It's a 6.9R value at about 21oz for a large pad, and more comfortable than sleeping on those Exped pool float baffles. Noisier than the Exped, but as warm or warmer. I've had my fair share of bad luck with Exped baffles, and prefer the baffle design of the thermarest pads personally.

To the OP. Mid to late November you need a 0 degree bag and an Xtherm pad or equivalent R value. If you do a warmer bag and think you can skimp on the pad you're gonna be in for a miserable trip.

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[sneaky]

Also, don't think that a stove in your shelter will let you get away with a lighter sleeping bag, unless you plan on being a slave to feeding the stove every hour all night. I made that mistake a couple years ago in Montana when I left my 0 degree WM bag at home and only had my 20deg quilt. Lesson learned. That stove is for drying gear and a morale boost when you get to camp, and to warm up in the morning. Buy a bag for the temps you will be encountering. Western Mountaineering, Feathered Friends, Stone Glacier, Montbell, Nemo, all make good bags. The Montbell bags are actually on sale right now, there's a link in the Gear Deals section of the classifieds.

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[AirborneEScouter]

Zero degree bag for cold, Big Agnes has some really lightweight bags - I have their system bag that requires an inflatable air pad but intend to buy one of their other non-system bags this year. NeoAir XLite at 15oz is what I use but I also bring a closed cell foam pad, never have issues with cold in the single digits and up.

 

[Thomas26280]

Also, don't think that a stove in your shelter will let you get away with a lighter sleeping bag, unless you plan on being a slave to feeding the stove every hour all night. I made that mistake a couple years ago in Montana when I left my 0 degree WM bag at home and only had my 20deg quilt. Lesson learned. That stove is for drying gear and a morale boost when you get to camp, and to warm up in the morning. Buy a bag for the temps you will be encountering. Western Mountaineering, Feathered Friends, Stone Glacier, Montbell, Nemo, all make good bags. The Montbell bags are actually on sale right now, there's a link in the Gear Deals section of the classifieds.

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Thanks for the info and I def don’t want to cheap out or skimp on anything. Sounds like the xtherm and a zero degree bag it is. Thanks a lot everyone for the help.

 

[Indian Summer]

You've never heard of a Thermarest NeoAir Xtherm? Really? That's surprising. It's a 6.9R value at about 21oz for a large pad, and more comfortable than sleeping on those Exped pool float baffles. Noisier than the Exped, but as warm or warmer. I've had my fair share of bad luck with Exped baffles, and prefer the baffle design of the thermarest pads personally.

To the OP. Mid to late November you need a 0 degree bag and an Xtherm pad or equivalent R value. If you do a warmer bag and think you can skimp on the pad you're gonna be in for a miserable trip.

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Nope. I’ve had the eXped for about 10 years. I have had zero problems. So I’ve never researched any other pads. I’m a side sleeper so a good thick inflatable pad is the only one I can use. If mine ever bit the dust on me I’d buy the exact same one.

 

[Marble]

I'll echo what few others have said. Zero degree, maybe a 10 with a liner, good pad and then have a routine for it. Meaning know how warm it is, how to keep warm etc. Kifaru cast had a great brief podcast on sleeping systems. It helps explain a lot of stuff.

Cheap stuff costs too much. Buy good stuff and then actually use it before the trip. Dont show up to the trailhead and take it out of the wrapper and stuff it in your backpack.

 

[BluMtn]

You might want to look at something like this. I have the lighter one that I put in my bag.

Reactor Fleece Sleeping Bag Liner (Adds 32°F) | Sea to Summit

FREE SHIPPING & LIFETIME GUARANTEE. Our warmest Thermolite sleeping bag liner, the Reactor Fleece, adds 32°F to your sleeping bag. Offers a 1/4th length zipper for ease of entry and exit. The fleece fabric is similar to a thin fleece mid-layer material but made with hollow fiber threads that...

seatosummitusa.com

 

[mlob1one]

Last year I switched from ExPed to Big Agnes. I was using their UL synmat, but had three fail (baffle seams pop) just outside of their 2 year warranty period. As much as I liked ExPed, I really like the BA pad and their warranty is superior.

Additionally, I use and love the Montbell bags. For weight, go with the downhugger 800. You can get them starting at -20°. Super lightweight and comfortable. Their seams are stitched to stretch so have tons of room while you sleep. They're on closeout right now for end of year... I have couple but the 15° in a long weighs 38.8 oz. in the 800.

Sleeping Bags (Closeout) | Montbell America

www.montbell.us

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[kabarNC]

I run an XTherm and an Enlightened Equipment 10 degree quilt and have been comfortable in 15 degrees at 8400ft.

 

[Zeus401]

I have the Thermarest neoair xtherm with a Outdoor vitals -15 degree sleeping bag. Me and a buddy went out the other night and slept in my SO 4 person tipi with stove. At 2am stove was out and it was 15 degrees inside the tipi. So everything everyone else is saying is true. Don’t go cheap on your sleep system!

 

[fatlander]

It’s a lot easier to open a zipper and throw your leg out of zero degree bag than freeze your ass off in a 20 or 30 degree bag. I have a sea to summit comfort plus insulated pad that’s a little on the heavy side, but it’s like sleeping on air mattress. I’ll pack a little more weight to sleep comfortably vs freezing and tossing all night long.


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[renagde]

Thanks for the info and I def don’t want to cheap out or skimp on anything. Sounds like the xtherm and a zero degree bag it is. Thanks a lot everyone for the help.

That’s a good setup. I have a xtherm that I use with a zpac classic 5 degree bag. Slept toasty in it down to 15 with only merino base layers. Remember, whatever system you go in, get it soon and test it out this winter when you get weather down in the teens to see if you stay comfortable.