Backcountry school of hard knocks

[Chape1rm]

Always carry water filtration pills as a back up even if you prefer a Steripen, pump, or squeeze filter as your first choice.

Two springs ago, I left work on Friday around 2 and drove 3 hours to the mountains and national forest to do some solitary trout fishing in a wilderness area.

It was a BEAUTIFUL day. Mid April, trees were starting to bud. So, no humidity. The sun was hot and dry. It was a nice hot though. Sweat didn’t lay on you and the sun just soothed your bones. I was so excited.

I finally got to the gated road and loaded up my pack for the 4 Mile walk in. It was heavy. I brought the kitchen sink in amenities. Potatoes, eggs, precooked brats and breakfast sausage, cooking oil, seasoning, etc…. I brought real food for every meal. With the idea I’d eat a few trout with my pre cooked brats for both suppers.

I didn’t stop there though. I had two bottles of fuel for a single mantle lantern. Etc…. I mean I brought everything. I even brought a fold out chair. I was fixin’ on living it up. It never occurred to me that deciding to not pack the aqua tabs was going to come back and burn me because my Sawyer worked just fine the night I tested before leaving.

On the way in, I walked by two mountain creeks I drink out of a lot. But, I decided I’d wait until I got to camp before fooling with water. Even though I was already very thirsty. Here’s the irony in all this. Even though I brought a filter, I rarely had to ever use it while doing this trip.

It’s important to understand the destination stream always has beaver activity in the head waters. But, there had always been mountain tributaries in the past that I could get water from without worry of filtering. Rendering the filter a security measure more than a dependency. So, I never gave the negligence of getting water on the way in any thought at all.


It was a dry winter too. And a drier spring. So, after walking by the last tributary that was clean, I covered the next 3.5 miles, with a 75 pound pack, in haste to get camp setup, get water, etc… before dark.

When I reached the big stream I intended to fish, I was alarmed by the lack of flow. But, I headed on another 1.5 miles to my camping location. I setup camp and went to the river to filter a 6 liter bag of water and my nalgene full. Because the tributary I had planned to camp by was totally dry. So, still no worries as I still had water. I just had to filter it.

I was so happy to be there. I had supper and a few sips of the pint of Wild Turkey on my mind as I began to try and filter water. Well, you could imagine my irritation when I couldn’t get water to squeeze through the Sawyer. I couldn’t get the Sawyer to twist open either.

How did this happen? I had tried the filter the night before I left to ensure it was working Yet, no matter how hard I tried, I couldn’t water to squeeze through it and, I couldn’t get it twisted open.

So, here it is. I’m 4 miles in with 75 pounds of gear, 3.5 miles from the closest water I can drink unfiltered, and I hadn’t drank anything in about 6 hours, I was dehydrated badly, and out of options.

So I packed everything back up in my pack, and hiked out in the dark back to my truck. When I got within a 1/2 mike of the truck and the first safe water I could drink, I dumped my pack, and slammed a liter of cold spring mountain water like a hammer. Which turned my guts into a wrenching mess. I didn’t care. I filled my nalgene and slowly drank another liter this time.

I filled it the third time while contemplating if I was just going to go home or stay in the bed of my truck and day trip it the next day. Well, my irritation convinced me to just go home and regroup. So, that’s what I did. Got home around 1:30 AM.

A little content to the story too. I had spent all day putting shingles on before leaving at 2. I drove straight there, loaded up everything in my pack, and hiked 8 mikes with a 75-80 pound pack with an already dehydrated body. While not life threatening, I was exhausted. And, I still get po’ed EVERYTIME I see. Sawyer squeeze filter.

Seems like your trip to heaven went to hell in a hurry. Being thirsty sucks, when I read your story I felt your pain. Sounds like the kind of thirsty where your tongue sticks to the roof of your mouth and breathing feels like your sucking on sand paper.

I'm loving my stripen ultra but I do take a whirlpak liter bag and Katadyn MP1 tabs in a tin with some waterproof matches, tinder, space blanket and a button compass. I need some peace of mind because if it wasn't for hard luck I wouldn't have any.

 

[seww]

A couple of years ago, a friend and I went ptarmigan hunting in the mountains of Northern Sweden. This is by one of the country's largest lakes Tornetrask. Fairly far North as you can see


So it was late January or early February, we woke up in the cabin and it was a chilly -29F as we got on our snowmobiles. We had to drive a few miles to get to the mountain we wanted to hunt. As we took a chance and crossed a lake no one else had, we discovered about a foot of water under the snow.
Took us a good 2-3 hours to cross it, getting stuck now and then. I was wearing my leather ski boots and my friend had some rubber boots, he never got wet and I was soaking.

We pulled over at the end of the lake once we hit ground and had some hot drinks and I was wringing out my socks, all wool too. We contemplated going back to the cabin to get dry but I suggested we can try and hunt because as long as I keep moving, I won't be cold. And I was right! Got to hunt many hours before it started getting dark again, it gets dark around 2-3 pm up there at this time so days are short.

Driving home, the temperatures had dropped even further! That was the bad part, both of use got frostbitten on our noses, the tips were so white when we arrived at the cabin. Luckily the cabin was warm, and we had dry clothes inside. Then we turned on the sauna and snowbathed so a pretty good day. Now I know that I don't want a snowmobile with a small windshield!

 

[Mule3006Elk]

Love merino wool base.
Synthetic over the base.
I'm not a hype guy but it legit keeps the odor off your synthetics.

If I'm damp the base clothes come off and dry while glassing. If needed I would start a little fire to dry out. Same with socks and insoles! I spend more time now keeping stuff dry and I'm happier for it. Especially, the feet. I never get cold feet anymore. I used to wear the boots for days on end not realizing how much moisture was building up in the insoles and/or socks. Perfect midday activity to get everything dry.

 

[Bearsears]

Shnees beartooth 0g boots Duckworth medium weight wool socks and smartwool liners. First lite Merino zip off 3/4 long John's, SG dehaviland pant and usually wore Pnuma 3m rain pants for a windblocker. Peax Gaiters. Duckworth wool baselayer up top, kuiu strongfleece 260, SG dehaviland jacket. Black ovis wool gloves under kincko leather winter gloves and kuiu beanie. I kept Kifaru lost park puffy top and bottom in my pack along with the Pnuma rain jacket and used as needed.

Thought I was doing okay managing heat through side vents and shedding the SG jacket when I needed too. I definitely went balls out trying to cut off that herd obviously sweating in the process and then laying out on the peak in the wind was no bueno. If my layering was sub optimal I am all ears!

I was just curious on your setup. Honestly I agree with you. Its pretty dialed and you have some good gear. There isnt much you can do in those moments where you need to move NOW to get a chance at a shot and then lay in snow in the wind. Same thing happened to me this year at last light and I thought I was going to lose the tip of my middle finger.

That said Ill add my two cents on a few tweeks you could make or try:
1. Some of the guys already mentioned this. Switch to synthetic base layers for cold weather. I used to wear merino in the cold for a long time but I was always clammy and cold because it just doesnt get the moisture off of your skin fast enough in cold weather. I wear merino until mid late September (precisely because it holds moisture and keeps me cooler in hot temps) and then the synthetics come out. Merino is great just maybe not the best in these situations.
2. Get a really thin light weight dedicated wind layer and wear it correctly. It seems to me most guys overlook this layer and think rain gear will suffice but wearing a true windblocking layer close to the skin will keep you so much warmer. Sitka mountain jacket or Patagonia houdini are two great options. This layer should go on right after your base layer so that your body heat will push sweat through it the most efficiently. The farther this layer gets from your skin the more it acts like a trashbag holding moisture in. Ditch the SG Dehaviland jacket in these conditions for the thin wind layer. While I love these softshell layers, in my experience, in these conditions the added insulation inhibits moisture transfer through them and I sweat up too much.
3. I like your strong fleece next in layering. Maybe consider one of the newer active insulation mid layers in addition to the strong fleece for these temps. Then your Lost park puffy for static insulation.
4. I never do any late season stuff with out puffy glassing mittens. These are almost a mandatory safety item in my opinion. Also beanies with windstopper in them have been a game changer for me in cold windy hunts.
5. Insulated boots and a two socks system. Also a insulated boot with a full grain leather outer instead of nubuck. Full grain leather can be waxed. Wax waterproofing works better and last longer than the spray you apply to nubuck. I ran a pair of Zamberlan 1005 Hunter pros this year with their hydrobloc wax applied in multiple coats. With a minor reapplication of wax mid week, the outer leather on these stayed dry all week despite being in snow daily. Warmest my feet have ever been.
6. The last thing Id say is once you get that cold, your best option for warming up quickly and safely is to put all your layers on, eat something, and move. Either hike angry or do jumping jacks until you warm up and the blood starts flowing well to extremities again but dont start sweating. When you sit by a fire the blood isnt flowing like when you are active. Also sometimes you cant even start one if your fingers arent working well. Your body is a great furnace. trap your body heat and keep generating it.

Like the other guys saif a foam pad like the thermorest z pads are almost mandatory in these conditions. I never leave camp without one to sit on. Nice bull dude congratulations!

 

[woods89]

I was just curious on your setup. Honestly I agree with you. Its pretty dialed and you have some good gear. There isnt much you can do in those moments where you need to move NOW to get a chance at a shot and then lay in snow in the wind. Same thing happened to me this year at last light and I thought I was going to lose the tip of my middle finger.

That said Ill add my two cents on a few tweeks you could make or try:
1. Some of the guys already mentioned this. Switch to synthetic base layers for cold weather. I used to wear merino in the cold for a long time but I was always clammy and cold because it just doesnt get the moisture off of your skin fast enough in cold weather. I wear merino until mid late September (precisely because it holds moisture and keeps me cooler in hot temps) and then the synthetics come out. Merino is great just maybe not the best in these situations.
2. Get a really thin light weight dedicated wind layer and wear it correctly. It seems to me most guys overlook this layer and think rain gear will suffice but wearing a true windblocking layer close to the skin will keep you so much warmer. Sitka mountain jacket or Patagonia houdini are two great options. This layer should go on right after your base layer so that your body heat will push sweat through it the most efficiently. The farther this layer gets from your skin the more it acts like a trashbag holding moisture in. Ditch the SG Dehaviland jacket in these conditions for the thin wind layer. While I love these softshell layers, in my experience, in these conditions the added insulation inhibits moisture transfer through them and I sweat up too much.
3. I like your strong fleece next in layering. Maybe consider one of the newer active insulation mid layers in addition to the strong fleece for these temps. Then your Lost park puffy for static insulation.
4. I never do any late season stuff with out puffy glassing mittens. These are almost a mandatory safety item in my opinion. Also beanies with windstopper in them have been a game changer for me in cold windy hunts.
5. Insulated boots and a two socks system. Also a insulated boot with a full grain leather outer instead of nubuck. Full grain leather can be waxed. Wax waterproofing works better and last longer than the spray you apply to nubuck. I ran a pair of Zamberlan 1005 Hunter pros this year with their hydrobloc wax applied in multiple coats. With a minor reapplication of wax mid week, the outer leather on these stayed dry all week despite being in snow daily. Warmest my feet have ever been.
6. The last thing Id say is once you get that cold, your best option for warming up quickly and safely is to put all your layers on, eat something, and move. Either hike angry or do jumping jacks until you warm up and the blood starts flowing well to extremities again but dont start sweating. When you sit by a fire the blood isnt flowing like when you are active. Also sometimes you cant even start one if your fingers arent working well. Your body is a great furnace. trap your body heat and keep generating it.

Like the other guys saif a foam pad like the thermorest z pads are almost mandatory in these conditions. I never leave camp without one to sit on. Nice bull dude congratulations!

Great post. Only thing I would add is that at the temps the op is talking about, I think down is superior to synthetic.

 

[Brettkazz]

I learned the hard way how quickly dehydration will mess a guy up. I still haven't figured out the best way to stay hydrated while on the road to camp. There is a fine line between drinking enough water and stopping too much to pee. And then mix in the energy drinks. Lost a couple days of hunting to recover hydrate.

 

[Bearsears]

Great post. Only thing I would add is that at the temps the op is talking about, I think down is superior to synthetic.

100% agree. The Sitka Kelvin Down WS might be my favorite gear purchase of all time.

I learned the hard way how quickly dehydration will mess a guy up. I still haven't figured out the best way to stay hydrated while on the road to camp. There is a fine line between drinking enough water and stopping too much to pee. And then mix in the energy drinks. Lost a couple days of hunting to recover hydrate.

Great point

 

[Chape1rm]

I was just curious on your setup. Honestly I agree with you. Its pretty dialed and you have some good gear. There isnt much you can do in those moments where you need to move NOW to get a chance at a shot and then lay in snow in the wind. Same thing happened to me this year at last light and I thought I was going to lose the tip of my middle finger.

That said Ill add my two cents on a few tweeks you could make or try:
1. Some of the guys already mentioned this. Switch to synthetic base layers for cold weather. I used to wear merino in the cold for a long time but I was always clammy and cold because it just doesnt get the moisture off of your skin fast enough in cold weather. I wear merino until mid late September (precisely because it holds moisture and keeps me cooler in hot temps) and then the synthetics come out. Merino is great just maybe not the best in these situations.
2. Get a really thin light weight dedicated wind layer and wear it correctly. It seems to me most guys overlook this layer and think rain gear will suffice but wearing a true windblocking layer close to the skin will keep you so much warmer. Sitka mountain jacket or Patagonia houdini are two great options. This layer should go on right after your base layer so that your body heat will push sweat through it the most efficiently. The farther this layer gets from your skin the more it acts like a trashbag holding moisture in. Ditch the SG Dehaviland jacket in these conditions for the thin wind layer. While I love these softshell layers, in my experience, in these conditions the added insulation inhibits moisture transfer through them and I sweat up too much.
3. I like your strong fleece next in layering. Maybe consider one of the newer active insulation mid layers in addition to the strong fleece for these temps. Then your Lost park puffy for static insulation.
4. I never do any late season stuff with out puffy glassing mittens. These are almost a mandatory safety item in my opinion. Also beanies with windstopper in them have been a game changer for me in cold windy hunts.
5. Insulated boots and a two socks system. Also a insulated boot with a full grain leather outer instead of nubuck. Full grain leather can be waxed. Wax waterproofing works better and last longer than the spray you apply to nubuck. I ran a pair of Zamberlan 1005 Hunter pros this year with their hydrobloc wax applied in multiple coats. With a minor reapplication of wax mid week, the outer leather on these stayed dry all week despite being in snow daily. Warmest my feet have ever been.
6. The last thing Id say is once you get that cold, your best option for warming up quickly and safely is to put all your layers on, eat something, and move. Either hike angry or do jumping jacks until you warm up and the blood starts flowing well to extremities again but dont start sweating. When you sit by a fire the blood isnt flowing like when you are active. Also sometimes you cant even start one if your fingers arent working well. Your body is a great furnace. trap your body heat and keep generating it.

Like the other guys saif a foam pad like the thermorest z pads are almost mandatory in these conditions. I never leave camp without one to sit on. Nice bull dude congratulations!

I really appreciate your reply. This community is awesome because people like you take time to weigh in their experience. I'm definitely cutting a learning curve and I'm looking forward to experimenting with the advice given.

By active insulation layer are you referring to Kelvin aerolight and similar?

I've definitely been eying the kuiu down glommits to keep the digits warm.

To warm up safely by adding all layers and staying on the move. Curious if you would still recommend this if I was soaked thru multiple layers with sweat?

Thanks again

 

[seww]

The Norwegian adventurer Lars Monsen would always take off his wet clothes, especially shirts, then put on a dry shirt and jacket and then the cold/wet clothes on top of that.
You'll get the wet stuff off of you, and with time it does dry by the body heat.

 

[Bearsears]

I really appreciate your reply. This community is awesome because people like you take time to weigh in their experience. I'm definitely cutting a learning curve and I'm looking forward to experimenting with the advice given.

By active insulation layer are you referring to Kelvin aerolight and similar?

I've definitely been eying the kuiu down glommits to keep the digits warm.

To warm up safely by adding all layers and staying on the move. Curious if you would still recommend this if I was soaked thru multiple layers with sweat?

Thanks again

Thank you for the kind words. I like to help out where I think I can because I dont want guys to suffer for years like I did when I was poor and internet resources were minimal lol.

By active insulation I mean the newer highly breathable durable face layers. Sitka has probably led the way on these so far and the technology is pretty cool. I also know them the best because most of what I wear is Sitka now. Theyre newest Active insulation is the Ambient Jacket and hoody. I got the hoody for my bday from the wife and I wore it from archery through late season (although it was getting stretched to its cold limit my last few days.) The Ambient jacket is a little thicker insulation so it would be warmer. Their older pieces were the Kelvin active jacket and Kelvin active hoody. For late season cold I still love the Kelvin active jacket. It is super warm for being active while still moving moisture relatively well (the new ambient jacket is probably comprable in warmth but would breath better). Think of these layers as a more durable, more water resistant, highly breathable piece that replaces the fleece layer. Both the Kelvin active hoody and jacket are discontinued and you can find them for really cheap.

"To warm up safely by adding all layers and staying on the move. Curious if you would still recommend this if I was soaked thru multiple layers with sweat?" This is exactly what I am recommending. Watch this video Dynamic rewarming drill The guy with them is the main big game product designer for Sitka John Barklow. In my opinion he is THE authority on proper layering for mountain hunting. His experience in his own pursuits and developing layering systems for the Seals when he was in the navy vastly surpasses most designers knowledge. When I started doing things his way it made a huge difference. Needless to say Im a bit of a fanboy lol.

 

[woods89]

The Norwegian adventurer Lars Monsen would always take off his wet clothes, especially shirts, then put on a dry shirt and jacket and then the cold/wet clothes on top of that.
You'll get the wet stuff off of you, and with time it does dry by the body heat.

With merino I would definitely do this because of the dry times involved, however, with a fast drying synthetic I would not because you lose quite a bit of body heat in the process of changing. Not saying it's always the right way, just the way I do things.

@Chape1rm , as mentioned above, if you are going to do a lot of late season hunting a windshirt and an active insulation piece would be well worth getting. I use a BD Alpine Start for a windshirt and a OR Ascendant (discontinued, what on earth, OR?) for an active insulation piece. The Alpine Start is a little more durable and a few ounces heavier than the Houdini, etc.

 

[HighUintas]

Thank you for the kind words. I like to help out where I think I can because I dont want guys to suffer for years like I did when I was poor and internet resources were minimal lol.

By active insulation I mean the newer highly breathable durable face layers. Sitka has probably led the way on these so far and the technology is pretty cool. I also know them the best because most of what I wear is Sitka now. Theyre newest Active insulation is the Ambient Jacket and hoody. I got the hoody for my bday from the wife and I wore it from archery through late season (although it was getting stretched to its cold limit my last few days.) The Ambient jacket is a little thicker insulation so it would be warmer. Their older pieces were the Kelvin active jacket and Kelvin active hoody. For late season cold I still love the Kelvin active jacket. It is super warm for being active while still moving moisture relatively well (the new ambient jacket is probably comprable in warmth but would breath better). Think of these layers as a more durable, more water resistant, highly breathable piece that replaces the fleece layer. Both the Kelvin active hoody and jacket are discontinued and you can find them for really cheap.

"To warm up safely by adding all layers and staying on the move. Curious if you would still recommend this if I was soaked thru multiple layers with sweat?" This is exactly what I am recommending. Watch this video Dynamic rewarming drill The guy with them is the main big game product designer for Sitka John Barklow. In my opinion he is THE authority on proper layering for mountain hunting. His experience in his own pursuits and developing layering systems for the Seals when he was in the navy vastly surpasses most designers knowledge. When I started doing things his way it made a huge difference. Needless to say Im a bit of a fanboy lol.

Does John Barklow put his layering knowledge on the web somewhere? I'm interested in learning more. Thanks for the input on layering you gave a couple posts ago.

@Chape1rm , congrats on the bull and thanks for sharing your story. I have always made sure to keep myself plenty far from a fire when warming up, but burning myself warming up by a fire when the extremities are numb is something I've never thought about being a possibility. I'll be sure to be more cognizant of that in the future!

 

[woods89]

Does John Barklow put his layering knowledge on the web somewhere? I'm interested in learning more. Thanks for the input on layering you gave a couple posts ago.

@Chape1rm , congrats on the bull and thanks for sharing your story. I have always made sure to keep myself plenty far from a fire when warming up, but burning myself warming up by a fire when the extremities are numb is something I've never thought about being a possibility. I'll be sure to be more cognizant of that in the future!

Barklow has a monthly newsletter that's really good. Google Knowledge From Storms.

 

[Bearsears]

Does John Barklow put his layering knowledge on the web somewhere? I'm interested in learning more. Thanks for the input on layering you gave a couple posts ago.

@Chape1rm , congrats on the bull and thanks for sharing your story. I have always made sure to keep myself plenty far from a fire when warming up, but burning myself warming up by a fire when the extremities are numb is something I've never thought about being a possibility. I'll be sure to be more cognizant of that in the future!

Barklow has a monthly newsletter that's really good. Google Knowledge From Storms.

woods 89 nailed it. He also has even more videos on his instagram @ jbarklow. Also hes been on countless podcasts talking about this stuff

 

[Marble]

I learned the hard way how quickly dehydration will mess a guy up. I still haven't figured out the best way to stay hydrated while on the road to camp. There is a fine line between drinking enough water and stopping too much to pee. And then mix in the energy drinks. Lost a couple days of hunting to recover hydrate.

If you hydrate the days prior it seems for me to work a little better. As far as staying hydrated during the day and the hunt in general, I switched to bottles so I can monitor my I take closer. I find witha water bladder I would sip on it more often,but drink less overall. I pay a weight penalty for barring the bottles, but it's worth being hydrated.adding any of the electrolyte packets helps. I usually drink one before bed and one during the day.

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

 

[woods89]

If you hydrate the days prior it seems for me to work a little better. As far as staying hydrated during the day and the hunt in general, I switched to bottles so I can monitor my I take closer. I find witha water bladder I would sip on it more often,but drink less overall. I pay a weight penalty for barring the bottles, but it's worth being hydrated.adding any of the electrolyte packets helps. I usually drink one before bed and one during the day.

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

That's an interesting take. I've always thought I drink more with a hose, but what you say makes sense. When I pull a bottle out I usually take a pretty big drink.

I like everything about Nalgenes except that it seems less convenient to not have a hose. Maybe I need to rethink.

 

[Brettkazz]

If you hydrate the days prior it seems for me to work a little better. As far as staying hydrated during the day and the hunt in general, I switched to bottles so I can monitor my I take closer. I find witha water bladder I would sip on it more often,but drink less overall. I pay a weight penalty for barring the bottles, but it's worth being hydrated.adding any of the electrolyte packets helps. I usually drink one before bed and one during the day.

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

I don’t normally have an issue once I’m in the field. Although I do notice it’s much harder in the later seasons to drink enough water when it’s cold


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[seww]

With merino I would definitely do this because of the dry times involved, however, with a fast drying synthetic I would not because you lose quite a bit of body heat in the process of changing. Not saying it's always the right way, just the way I do things.

@Chape1rm , as mentioned above, if you are going to do a lot of late season hunting a windshirt and an active insulation piece would be well worth getting. I use a BD Alpine Start for a windshirt and a OR Ascendant (discontinued, what on earth, OR?) for an active insulation piece. The Alpine Start is a little more durable and a few ounces heavier than the Houdini, etc.

It also depends on how cold it is outside when you get to changing. And how fast one is to get undressed and dressed again.