Are we really hunting?

[Macintosh]

Hence, why fish and game reviews and adjusts seasons, and bag limits, and tags allocated.

But asking for them to differentiate archery vs crossbow is taboo?

This is sort of what I was getting at. Seasons and bag limits and tag allocations are reviewed to make sure any changes actually accomplished their design as far as population objective and hunter satisfaction. Its an iterative process that continually adjusts itself, and for the most part it isnt subject to the difficulties and timelines of legislation. There are clearly issues, but overall its working very well.
My question is, what would be the PURPOSE of differentiating between a vertical bow and a crossbow? Imo that purpose is already built-in, in the form of the seasons, bag limits and method of take regulations and reviews. What exactly would it accomplish for you if crossbow hunting was differentiated?

Re: why even differentiate at all—because it results in more opportunity, and in many cases one season doesnt kill enough deer. So in addition to the guy that only wants to hunt with a bow, they also want the new hunter and the rifle hunter out as well.

 

[peterk123]

Hence, why fish and game reviews and adjusts seasons, and bag limits, and tags allocated.

But asking for them to differentiate archery vs crossbow is taboo?

That is a whole other rabbit hole. Its just an issue for bowhunters because more hunters in the woods...... maybe. It would be interesting to see that stats if there are that many more hunters now during bow because of xbow. And if harvest numbers are up. I think in many states it still requires an exemption as well.

I have a friend that is in his late 70s that had to switch to Xbow in massachusetts. He is not harvesting more deer as a result. Does the same as he had for the past 20 years.

This subject has been beaten to death. As been said a million times, compound bows should also be not allowed then, right?

If anything, it can be argued crossbows are more humane because the injury risk is reduced, theoretically.

I'm curious, what is your issue with a crossbow, the way you hold it (vs. a regular bow) or the speed it shoots? If speed is the issue do you also feel certain rifle calibers should not be allowed?

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you, just trying to understand the logic. 90% of the time, if we are being honest, it's because as bowhunters we are all butt hurt that there are more hunters during "our" season. And yes, I'm guilty of thinking that way as well.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

If it's only all about harvest objectives why even divide the season?

Sent from my SM-S926U using Tapatalk

Because the shorter ranged weapons are the only ones allowed when the leaves are on the trees.

 

[bnewt3]

I dont have a ton of experience, only started deer hunting 10ish years ago and have harvested 4. But none of it has been "easy", over bait or not. Last year I had as close to easy as it gets and not over bait. I was in the stand for 20 minutes, buck came chasing after a doe 9 minutes after shooting light and he stood 15 yards away. I had to switch the rifle to shoot wrong-handed and he saw me and just looked at me the whole time like "hey bud, shes mine and ill fight you for her".......BUT someone set me up in that stand, and gave me some intel. So work was done, just not by me.

Here in NC, we get 2 buck tags and 4 doe tags every year. We NEED to be harvesting deer. So bait is legal. And I like having meat in the freezer.

I also understand people that dont like bait/food plots.

 

[Burnsie]

My problem with the "If it's legal - have at it" mentality is that something that was once considered sacrilege is all of sudden just fine.
When/where I grew up hunting, baiting was not allowed, it was looked on as one of the sleaziest most unethical things you could do. If a game warden caught someone baiting they had the book thrown at them as if they were a child molester. Then with the swipe of the pen the state all of a sudden decided it was just fine - go for it. It didn't take too many years until they decided all the baiting was a major contributor to the CWD problem - then it suddenly became an existential threat to the world again.
I guess it's hard for me to just flip the switch and start embracing something that was once considered unethical and justify it with "well - as long as it's legal"
Having said that - I don't worry about how others hunt legally.

 

[brandon.andersen]

Why, do we as hunters, eat our own? We are so adept to give away any rights we have, because we don't utilize them.

 

[Amos Keeto]

What is the big deal with a "cross bow"?

If you can't accept a modern crossbow, then put your multi-pulley, break over compound aside with your recurve and only use self made longbows!

Now, back to the OP!
I'm 75 years old. I've hung on to frost, ice covered tree limbs. Sat shivering in a rain.
Fought briars while still hunting.
I don't care about a "trail cam"! I want to be surprised by what comes in!
I use corn feeders, enclosed blinds and scoped rifles.

Another poster is correct.
If it's YOUR property, YOU get to set the "fair chase" rules.
BUT....... be fair and unbiased! If "baiting" and "method of take" are acceptable by state regulations, why change the rules just because YOU don't like those rules?

 

[mad_angler]

I personally hate corn bait piles. I've shot plenty of deer with them in the past.
If i was king, it would be illegal everywhere. Hunting over bait is still hunting, but just barely... And feeding corn year round is not healthy for deer.

But, I am not king... so folks can do whatever is legal. I get to choose for me and I choose no bait piles.

Everyone has to draw their own line: rifle/crossbow/compound/longbow, heated blind/blind/ladder stand/stump, etc...

That's the beauty. We all get to pick our own line...

 

[Rich M]

Why, do we as hunters, eat our own? We are so adept to give away any rights we have, because we don't utilize them.

Folks were taught it was wrong. We hang on to the stuff we are taught as kids. Then if someone doesn't agree, "they should be hung out to dry".

That's the beauty. We all get to pick our own line...

The ugly part is when someone tries to tell you where your line should be.

 

[bnewt3]

My problem with the "If it's legal - have at it" mentality is that something that was once considered sacrilege is all of sudden just fine.
When/where I grew up hunting, baiting was not allowed, it was looked on as one of the sleaziest most unethical things you could do. If a game warden caught someone baiting they had the book thrown at them as if they were a child molester. Then with the swipe of the pen the state all of a sudden decided it was just fine - go for it. It didn't take too many years until they decided all the baiting was a major contributor to the CWD problem - then it suddenly became an existential threat to the world again.
I guess it's hard for me to just flip the switch and start embracing something that was once considered unethical and justify it with "well - as long as it's legal"
Having said that - I don't worry about how others hunt legally.

I think it all comes down to how many deer NEED to be harvested.

Thats the balance F&G has to try to accomplish. Here in NC, we get 2 buck tags and 4 doe tags because ALOT of deer need to be harvested. As suitable hunting habitat(different from living habitat) disappears, one method to ensure enough harvest is to do things that draw deer into the suitable hunting habitat, like baiting and food plots. Also it should be noted that in NC, i would imagine other states as well, baiting is only legal on private land.

Ill agree that hunting over bait doesnt feel great. But I also recognize that we have to do our part to manage deer populations. Many of us dont have the ability to sit in the woods more than a few days out of the season.

 

[Macintosh]

My problem with the "If it's legal - have at it" mentality is that something that was once considered sacrilege is all of sudden just fine.
When/where I grew up hunting, baiting was not allowed, it was looked on as one of the sleaziest most unethical things you could do. If a game warden caught someone baiting they had the book thrown at them as if they were a child molester. Then with the swipe of the pen the state all of a sudden decided it was just fine - go for it. It didn't take too many years until they decided all the baiting was a major contributor to the CWD problem - then it suddenly became an existential threat to the world again.
I guess it's hard for me to just flip the switch and start embracing something that was once considered unethical and justify it with "well - as long as it's legal"
Having said that - I don't worry about how others hunt legally.

I think this is understandable and gets at what I believe is the root of the issue. Its totally understandable to me for anyone to have a hard time changing their attitude about something that was considered a big deal in the past—even if in that time the wildlife population, the habitat, and many of the issues affecting both have changed significantly. But a different situation with different factors in play and new information, may very well call for different solutions. We dont really have a choice except to adjust to the changing reality around us.

 

[rodney482]

What's the issue with youth seasons?

Pussification of our youth... Why does anyone need a special season? We didnt have that EASY crap as kids.

 

[rodney482]

It makes kids soft and not appreciate tags. More or less grown men are jealous they dont get that tag.

Had the first part right... soft

 

[Str8shooter]

Anyone think this forum is being taken over by eastern and midwest focused topics? Whitetails over bait? Crossbows? This is a western hunting forum, dont these subjects belong somewhere like midwestcornhunter.com or whitetailbaiter.net?

 

[bnewt3]

Anyone think this forum is being taken over by eastern and midwest focused topics? Whitetails over bait? Crossbows? This is a western hunting forum, dont these subjects belong somewhere like midwestcornhunter.com or whitetailbaiter.net?

Where does it say this is a western hunting forum? I know thats the way it feels, but is that actually spelled out somewhere?

 

[CRJR45]

Anyone think this forum is being taken over by eastern and midwest focused topics? Whitetails over bait? Crossbows? This is a western hunting forum, dont these subjects belong somewhere like midwestcornhunter.com or whitetailbaiter.net?

And yet another divisive hunter ? Whitetails are beneath you ? Crossbow hunters are bush league compared to the great white hunter that is you ?

We have met the enemy and it is us , or some shit like that ......

 

[Macintosh]

Anyone think this forum is being taken over by eastern and midwest focused topics? Whitetails over bait? Crossbows? This is a western hunting forum, dont these subjects belong somewhere like midwestcornhunter.com or whitetailbaiter.net?

Depends on what you count as eastern. But crossbows, cell cams, etc are nation wide, and the principles behind the issue is most definitely nationwide.

 

[KurtR]

Had the first part right... soft

No the grown men being jealous is more of it. It’s wasn’t that way growing when I was a kid is always the argument.

 

[rodney482]

No the grown men being jealous is more of it. It’s wasn’t that way growing when I was a kid is always the argument.

yeah when you butt up against property owned by the Amish and all 12 of their kids are out there with rifles in September killing off all the bucks ... has nothing to do w jealous its complete BS...

 

[207North]

yeah when you butt up against property owned by the Amish and all 12 of their kids are out there with rifles in September killing off all the bucks ... has nothing to do w jealous its complete BS...

Now we are equating legal things I don’t like with Poaching. Ok.