Are we really hunting?

Find a mature animal and hunt it, tell me it's not hunting.



I don't use bait, don't use a crossbow, I do use cameras.

I don't much care where people want to draw the lines for themselves as far as what they want. It's dangerous when we start to argue among ourselves about it.

I guess I'm an asshole tho, I set the rules on my places, can't shoot any bucks. Shoot as many does as you want.
 
It’s not cool unless your map takes batteries, scope reticle takes batteries, ballistic solver takes batteries, and ranging binoculars take batteries. Video yourself with a phone that takes batteries, text your new girlfriend via satellite, and upload questions and photos about your hunt to this forum every night.

I didn’t even mention trail cams and drones.

It’s ridiculous.
 
I am to the point where I would be ok if they get rid of all that stuff and go back to open sites or 1x max scopes. Don’t allow any electronics, including video cameras. Bring back into relevance the flat shooting rounds. It would be an awesome twist to the craziness that is long range hunting and social media influencers. I would even be ok with straight wall cartridges only. Give me some motivation to dust off the 444 marlin i inherited.

This is coming from a guy who is all in on expensive guns and optics for long range hunting and practices out to 1250 regularly.
 
Find a mature animal and hunt it, tell me it's not hunting.



I don't use bait, don't use a crossbow, I do use cameras.

I don't much care where people want to draw the lines for themselves as far as what they want. It's dangerous when we start to argue among ourselves about it.

I guess I'm an asshole tho, I set the rules on my places, can't shoot any bucks. Shoot as many does as you want.

Italics mine.

I think the arguments are healthy, within reason. Somewhere between the spear-and-loincloth argument and the as-long-as-it's-legal cop-out is The Truth.
 
What are your thoughts. All is legal. Whitetail deer hunting, over bait with cell cameras and a crossbow. Personally I think this going to far and not hunting, harvesting. This is night and day from when I grew up bowhunting deer, no bait, no cameras. Killing a mature hunted whitetail was HARD and required a lot of work to do it consistently. Now you dump corn, set a camera, pattern a deer, check the camera before you walk into your stand so you do not spook deer, and then kill him. To easy?

No different than shooting a deer at 754 yds with a dope scope using a suppressed rifle and light caliber with a high fragmenting bullet...
 
I’m deaf. You could always try that - really good ear plugs or double up on hearing protection and go hunt. I been doing that for going on 50 years. Im very good out west cause it is a visual game - hearing deer in thick cover is not something i can do.


We live in 50 diff states and hunt diff animals in diff habitats and some folks want to dictate how and what folks are supposed to do. LoL!
 
Baiting is tough for mature whitetail. At least where I’m at unless you have lots of land and very little pressure. If I don’t put out bait on my 80 you can’t even remotely pattern the deer they are on the neighbors. When I sit on bait I have almost zero chance of shooting a good buck. I like hunting off the bait a ways. Would be different in a more ag area. But on public where I can get close to where they feed or bed I don’t bait. On any given day I hunt with a longbow,compound or crossbow unless rifle season.
 
Different situations can necessitate different methods. I hunt whitetails in MD and WV.
In MD, I’m in a group of 5 that have a 200 acre +/- farm leased. It’s about 65% fields 35% woods. The owner logged the woods 3 1/2 years ago. It’s very thick. We have to hunt from tree stands, as still hunting would just push deer onto the adjacent farms, which are all hunted. We 3 have feeders in various areas. Not to shoot off of them from the stands, but primarily to attempt to keep the deer on our property.
I have family in West Virginia and hunted there for 40 years. We hunt a mixture of National Forest, and private land (my cousins two farms). Our group “still hunts” as there is much more room to roam the ridges without the worry of pushing the deer to another lease. Typically there will be 4-6 of us in the woods, and if we spread out on a ridge or two, we get the deer up and moving.
 
Baiting deer is a big no no for me personally. I would never want to shoot a deer over bait.

Bears are another story.

I wouldn't say it's not hunting. Just not my cup of tea.

I know if I owned a good whitetail property the last thing I would want is someone messing up the natural patterns of the deer with a bait pile.

Sent from my SM-S931U using Tapatalk
Please explain the difference in deer and bear baiting?
 
My great grandfather grew up during the depression/dust bowl era. His mindset was “Use the thing that helps you kill the most game”
But he hunted for meat and had people to feed. Didn’t have the luxury of arguing on the internet. Different times I suppose
 
What are your thoughts. All is legal. Whitetail deer hunting, over bait with cell cameras and a crossbow. Personally I think this going to far and not hunting, harvesting. This is night and day from when I grew up bowhunting deer, no bait, no cameras. Killing a mature hunted whitetail was HARD and required a lot of work to do it consistently. Now you dump corn, set a camera, pattern a deer, check the camera before you walk into your stand so you do not spook deer, and then kill him. To easy?
I’m going to be confined to hunting with a crossbow at some point soon due to my wrist, pending fusion, arthritis, lack of mobility, pain, etc. I’ll be very happy to be in the woods still whenever I am forced to hang up my compound.

I strongly believe that our hunting and trapping rights will be eroded away to noting in the next 25-40 years because of the sportsmen and women’s community as a whole lacking the ability to unite and simply support one another and stop with all the infighting and finger pointing.

Every time I see a post like this on a forum, I know that the anti hunters rejoice and we isolate ourselves more and more and risk losing our rights to hunt and trap.

Hers my thoughts, stop worrying about everyone else and just go hunt within the legal scope of the regulations in your area.
 
I think we’re failing to see the effects it’s having on the trophy population. Anyone who’s hunted Illinois from the 90s til now has seen the effects. Sprinkle in EHD and the future of killing 180+ bucks is bleak. Yet deer numbers are at the same levels as they were in early 2000s. And here come thermal drones…
 
What are your thoughts. All is legal. Whitetail deer hunting, over bait with cell cameras and a crossbow. Personally I think this going to far and not hunting, harvesting. This is night and day from when I grew up bowhunting deer, no bait, no cameras. Killing a mature hunted whitetail was HARD and required a lot of work to do it consistently. Now you dump corn, set a camera, pattern a deer, check the camera before you walk into your stand so you do not spook deer, and then kill him. To easy?
Aldo Leopold (largely considered the father of the Wlidlife Biologist profession), who died in 1948, addressed this basic issue in his Essay entitled “Wildlife in America”. In that essay, Leopold spoke to the idea that the sporting goods industry and the “gadgeteers” developed and marketed products they claimed would make the outdoorsmen better hunters. He argued that the gadgets did just the opposite. Rather than developing their individual skill set to effectively hunt and kill game, hunters were relying more and more on their gadgets, thereby eroding their true wood craftsmanship. The gadgets allowed hunters to reach out and kill game in greater quantities and at longer distances with less stealth and knowledge of the hunted animal.

We are a long ways from Leopold’s world. Leopold was a man who crafted his own bows and arrows. He also carved his own decoys. At the time when he wrote that essay, he was complaining about aluminum boats with outboard motors replacing canoes, composite decoys replacing hand-carved decoys, and shotguns with poli-chokes.

For those who might be interested in reading this essay, it can be found in the publication “The Sand County Almanac and Conservation from Round River.” and can found online for about $10.00.

For my personal ethic, I approach it this way. If a person is a subsistence hunter (needs the meat to survive), by all means do what it takes to feed yourself and your family. I don’t fit that criteria. I like the meat. I appreciate the meat, but at the end of the day, my life is not diminished without it. If I am not a subsistence hunter, I must be getting some sort of primal need or recreational value out of the hunt. If I am going to kill something in that vein, I am going to enter their world and attempt to beat them on their terms. I will attempt to catch up with them by understanding how they move across the landscape (rather than artificially concentrating them at a feed site). I’ll use the natural vegetation and my own stealth skills to conceal my presence (no blind with a mister buddy heater and a lazy boy). I do my best to work with the wind (no scent blocking clothing). If I get busted, so be it. That’s part of the game. Getting cold and wet and covered with snow is also part of the game. If I can’t handle it, then I don’t deserve to be the winner. In other words, while I do allow myself a nice rifle with good optics, I’m not going to dishonor the prey by eliminating the animals’ opportunity to use their natural defense systems to survive.

For many of my friends, it is all about hanging large antlers on the wall. I won’t lie. I would also like to hang large antlers on the wall; if they are obtained through a process in which that animal had every opportunity to use it’s ears, eyes, and nose to avoid being killed. For me, it is about the hunting journey, not the destination (big antlers).

Happy hunting and Merry Christmas.
 
We just have to accept that our circumstances are all different. Same with our desired end result.

If all you are about is b&c trophies, i cant relate. The biggest deer i have a picture of in the past 2 years might be 110 inches. We dont get big ones around here.

If im not hunting public im hunting 10 acres of private.

Would be neat if folks wanted to do a “no batteries” kind of thing. That would definitely revert things to tougher and less certain.
 
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