Anyone familiar with the Cimarron River in NM?

[thinhorn_AK]

Ever been to the upper San Juan? All stockers as far as rainbows and all barbless 2 hooks per line and catch and release.

Handful of browns but the amount of Rainbows in that quality water stretch is absurd!

It’s a fun place to fish when you avoid the crowds, but I prefer backcountry wild fish.


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I havnt been there in 20+ years. I went with my dad for his birthday one year, we caught some giant rainbows there. If I remember right you could keep 1 but if you did, you had to stop fishing for the day.

 

[sndmn11]

Nope. The planted rainbows I’m talking about that they are stocking now are sterile.

Which hatchery are the pulling from?

 

[displacedtexan]

There are millions of miles of self sustaining wild trout water that don’t need stocked trout to meet that objective.

Look, I’m not against stocked trout in certain places. I just don’t understand putting them in places to compete with wild trout and in stretches of water where they can’t even be kept. A lot of them die after being caught anyways, they can’t handle any stress. Put the planters in the lakes by the tourist areas and campgrounds and such. Leave the C&R water for wild trout to prosper.

The stretch you fished is a tourist place...

 

[SDHNTR]

The stretch you fished is a tourist place...

Read my last sentence.

 

[SDHNTR]

Which hatchery are the pulling from?

Red River. Noted specifically as triploid rainbow trout. Sterile fish.

 

[dieselchessy]

I dont think the term “wild” as its being used in this thread is accurate. Brown trout in the US aren’t wild, they are “feral”. They originate from domestic hatchery stock.

 

[displacedtexan]

Read my last sentence.

Read the sentence before it.

Tourists fish rivers too.

I fish that region, never that river. Way too many tourists. Even the red chili water.

 

[displacedtexan]

Your "wild trout" started off as stocked fish. The fish are stocked, they reproduce, eventually someone down the road calls them "wild". Step 1 now is the same as it was last year, last decade, and last century.

I love how people call brown trout and pheasants wild, but pigs and horses feral.

 

[sndmn11]

Red River. Noted specifically as triploid rainbow trout. Sterile fish.

...so that they don't contaminate native cutthroats and can displace the biomass of brown trout. All while giving folks something to catch.

Brown trout have a higher likelihood of overpopulation than other reproducing invasive trout, except brook. The frying pan river is a good example of this where habitat is deficient in comparison to habitat. Past conversations I have had with fisheries biologists in Colorado and Utah have given me the perception that stocking rainbows that can reproduce is gentler on the body of water. Stocking sterile specimens in majority brown trout water is a method to push the brown trout out in the long term and hope that native cutthroats fill that biomass gap.

 

[SDHNTR]

Stocking sterile specimens in majority brown trout water is a method to push the brown trout out in the long term and hope that native cutthroats fill that biomass gap.

Has that ever been successfully done? Seems like a stretch. A huge one.

 

[SDHNTR]

This doesn’t need to be so complex. It’s a simple matter. The first couple miles of this river are already C&R. Just dump the planters below that. Leave the first red chili section for the wild trout. They won’t swim upstream very far, they aren’t strong enough. That would do a better job of pleasing both sides.

 

[displacedtexan]

By both sides you mean you?

That's an INSANELY popular stretch of river... Most people seem happy with how it is.

 

[SDHNTR]

By both sides you mean you?

That's an INSANELY popular stretch of river... Most people seem happy with how it is.

How does both sides ever mean me alone? I talked to multiple guys who were fly fishing that stretch. Most of them were displeased. Only one other guy had caught even one wild fish.

I’m not the only guy who prefers to fly fish for wild trout. Don’t most fly fishermen? So wanting 2 miles managed for wild fish and another 6-8 miles for the powerbaiters isn’t fair? I don’t think I’m out of line here.

 

[displacedtexan]

How does both sides ever mean me alone? I talked to multiple guys who were fly fishing that stretch. Most of them were displeased. Only one other guy had caught even one wild fish.

I’m not the only guy who prefers to fly fish for wild trout. Don’t most fly fishermen? So wanting 2 miles managed for wild fish and another 6-8 miles for the powerbaiters isn’t fair? I don’t think I’m out of line here.

I'm a catch and release fly fisherman... I fish around there.

There's lots of water like you're wanting near the Cimmaron.

That river gets hammered, and is full of stockers. So I choose to fish waters with cutthroats and fewer people.

 

[sndmn11]

Has that ever been successfully done? Seems like a stretch. A huge one.

Ive caught two cutthroats on moving water, and neither should have been there. Any other cutthroats have been high mountain stillwater that is isolated. So, I cannot say from my own observations.

I'm aware that throwing rainbows in to supplant browns in some Colorado rivers has seen success.

In the conversations I referenced, I was talking to those people to illicit other information and wanted them to move on from their fisheries management stuff.

 

[SDHNTR]

I personally don’t discriminate one wild trout over another just because one is truly “native”. For the most part, that ship has sailed in North America. But I do prefer wild, naturally propagated fish and animals to pursue. I just don’t care much if they were introduced many generations ago. All that is to say that I probably wouldn’t support the idea of displacing wild browns in a popular river just to return the stream to its ancient fish origins. But I also damn sure don’t like to see tailless mutant stocked trout dumped into designated C&R water, on top of any other strain of wild trout.

 

[SDHNTR]

I'm a catch and release fly fisherman... I fish around there.

There's lots of water like you're wanting near the Cimmaron.

That river gets hammered, and is full of stockers. So I choose to fish waters with cutthroats and fewer people.

Yes, we just didn’t have enough time to access some of those other streams.

Show me an accessible stream anywhere in the West now that doesn’t get hammered! Yet plenty of them are sustainable wild trout fisheries that offer wonderful opportunity without stockers.

 

[Reburn]

This doesn’t need to be so complex. It’s a simple matter. The first couple miles of this river are already C&R. Just dump the planters below that. Leave the first red chili section for the wild trout. They won’t swim upstream very far, they aren’t strong enough. That would do a better job of pleasing both sides.

The people that mainly fish there are tourists and scouts and their families and it gets hammered. Kids dont care much about what they catch.

The locals fish elsewhere.

 

[displacedtexan]

Yes, we just didn’t have enough time to access some of those other streams.

Show me an accessible stream anywhere in the West now that doesn’t get hammered! Yet plenty of them are sustainable wild trout fisheries that offer wonderful opportunity without stockers.

I know more than a few...

But I'm not posting them.