Age class vs tag availability, what does it take now?

[Undrgrndprdcts]

I guess the easiest way to ask this is explain a situation. While looking at reports for units that can be drawn with 1 point, the info provided for the area often says most bucks taken are 2-4 years old. It seems like around 4.5 is where mule deer really start looking like mule deer, and maybe what some people consider the first year of maturity. So if you are looking for that decent 4x4, are these types of units likely going to be a bust? I'm concerned about the alternative which is point creep in better units. Is it still possible to shoot nice bucks with low points (potentially), or if you aren't invested in a tons of points you are screwed? Like what does it take in the current landscape to not shoot a forky?

 

[ianpadron]

Unit has far less to do with it than your hunting ability and patience to wait out a mature deer.

Sure, if you're looking for a 180+ your odds are better in high point units, but respectable deer can be killed regularly in every unit in the country that has mule deer.

 

[RockAndSage]

A lot of those statistics you're seeing depend on the priorities of the state wildlife management agencies - some states manage more for hunter opportunity, others more for quality of hunt.

Opportunity generally means more hunters or less restrictions on what they can shoot, quality means more/better bucks. If it's opportunity that's being prioritized, you'll tend to see more hunters in a given zone, which also tends to mean more hunters prioritizing meat or just being less focused on a trophy hunt, who will shoot smaller bucks. Statistics from those zones will be different from ones managed for big, mature animals.

All that said, I'm a firm believer that there is a big buck or two in every zone - but how hard they are to find depends on geography, hunter pressure, and genetics. You're more likely to find a bigger buck in a great Colorado zone with tons of other hunters, than you are in a place with few hunters but with spindly genetics.

My advice: do not play the point game. Jump in, get time making a good mule deer hunt out of any zone you can, and just make the best out of every tag. You will learn an immense amount with every hunt if you choose to - but you learn virtually nothing gathering points.

 

[Undrgrndprdcts]

A lot of those statistics you're seeing depend on the priorities of the state wildlife management agencies - some states manage more for hunter opportunity, others more for quality of hunt.

Opportunity generally means more hunters or less restrictions on what they can shoot, quality means more/better bucks. If it's opportunity that's being prioritized, you'll tend to see more hunters in a given zone, which also tends to mean more hunters prioritizing meat or just being less focused on a trophy hunt, who will shoot smaller bucks. Statistics from those zones will be different from ones managed for big, mature animals.

All that said, I'm a firm believer that there is a big buck or two in every zone - but how hard they are to find depends on geography, hunter pressure, and genetics. You're more likely to find a bigger buck in a great Colorado zone with tons of other hunters, than you are in a place with few hunters but with spindly genetics.

My advice: do not play the point game. Jump in, get time making a good mule deer hunt out of any zone you can, and just make the best out of every tag. You will learn an immense amount with every hunt if you choose to - but you learn virtually nothing gathering points.

Yea I don't necessarily want to just gather a bunch of points. I was more curious if there was a minimum at this point to get into anything decent, or if 1-2 point units can still produce animals worth shooting. Basically is it worth it to apply and end up going to those lower point units, or not even waste the time and resources.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

Yea I don't necessarily want to just gather a bunch of points. I was more curious if there was a minimum at this point to get into anything decent, or if 1-2 point units can still produce animals worth shooting. Basically is it worth it to apply and end up going to those lower point units, or not even waste the time and resources.

It’s called “hunting”, right? So go hunting. If you don’t find an animal “worth shooting” you still went hunting. If “hunting” is a waste of time and resources, stop hunting.

If I cared about killing big deer, I’d be maximizing my opportunities to hunt big deer in as many areas and for as much time as possible.

 

[Undrgrndprdcts]

It’s called “hunting”, right? So go hunting. If you don’t find an animal “worth shooting” you still went hunting. If “hunting” is a waste of time and resources, stop hunting.

If I cared about killing big deer, I’d be maximizing my opportunities to hunt big deer in as many areas and for as much time as possible.

Some people hunt mature animals. Rest assured, the hunting will continue. Some people have a finite amount of time to do so. Maximizing use of resources is a thing.

 

[5MilesBack]

Like what does it take in the current landscape to not shoot a forky?

I'd turn that around and ask "what would it take TO shoot a forky"? Unless you just really like eating mule deer, I can't think of many reasons.

 

[LongWayAround]

Some people hunt mature animals. Rest assured, the hunting will continue. Some people have a finite amount of time to do so. Maximizing use of resources is a thing.

I think the thing you're missing is why a given hunt has a certain demand.

You could have the same unit and archery is a 1-2pt tag. Late rifle might be a 10-12pt tag.

 

[Undrgrndprdcts]

I think the thing you're missing is why a given hunt has a certain demand.

You could have the same unit and archery is a 1-2pt tag. Late rifle might be a 10-12pt tag.

Can you explain? I'm looking at units that only have one rifle season and can be had with 1 point. Supposedly lots of public with good access, 40+% success rate. Only thing I'm seeing is low age class.

 

[realunlucky]

I'm curious how they are collecting that data on age class

Sent from my SM-S926U using Tapatalk

 

[LongWayAround]

Can you explain? I'm looking at units that only have one rifle season and can be had with 1 point. Supposedly lots of public with good access, 40+% success rate. Only thing I'm seeing is low age class.

I'm not sure what state you're looking at but...

The unit that I consider to be my home unit is 1-2 points for an archery tag and maybe 3ish for muzz. The average guy hunting those seasons isn't going to kill a big buck. The terrain is not very favorable to glassing or archery in general.

By the time the later rifle seasons arrive and the bucks move into the more visible areas, the points required to draw is more like 10+. I have seen great bucks alive and dead in there.

The deer are there the entire time, but they are largely inaccessible most of the season. On one hand that allows some of them to get big. On the other, most of the deer getting killed are not big.

Look for Robbie's podcast on here about his most recent big buck. A low point unit resulted in a giant buck for a guy who knew how to look for it.

 

[huntnful]

What are you considering a decent 4x4?

Depending on your standards, pretty much any unit can produce a mature 4x4 with enough knowledge, scouting and leg work.

That’s why a lot of big deer come from low point units that dedicated hunters learn to hunt over multiple years, Figuring out where the deer can get older and not slaughtered year after year.

 

[Undrgrndprdcts]

What are you considering a decent 4x4?

Depending on your standards, pretty much any unit can produce a mature 4x4 with enough knowledge, scouting and leg work.

That’s why a lot of big deer come from low point units that dedicated hunters learn to hunt over multiple years, Figuring out where the deer can get older and not slaughtered year after year.

I mean that is my standard is basically the average "mature 4x4". It doesn't actually have to be a 4x4, I just am not shooting deer that are too young.

 

[huntnful]

I mean that is my standard is basically the average "mature 4x4". It doesn't actually have to be a 4x4, I just am not shooting deer that are too young.

Yeah you can find one about anywhere. But not necessarily just on a whim by throwing a dart at a map. It takes time and scouting and days in the field.

 

[RockAndSage]

I mean that is my standard is basically the average "mature 4x4". It doesn't actually have to be a 4x4, I just am not shooting deer that are too young.

To add a little perspective...this is a saying I came across here awhile back that's a pretty good rule of thumb, especially for someone who isn't able to hunt mule deer every year: "Never pass up a buck on the first day, that you wouldn't pass up on your last day."

Scouting is a big part of what determines that threshold in each unit.

 

[Undrgrndprdcts]

Yeah you can find one about anywhere. But not necessarily just on a whim by throwing a dart at a map. It takes time and scouting and days in the field.

Yes I definitely get that, I hunt mature whitetails. Different species obviously but same level of difficulty to find good animals. I was just unsure of quite how important unit was in general.

 

[Rich M]

I've been on 3 western hunts - 2 antelope and 1 mule deer. Saw good muley bucks on each hunt - they are there.

We were in CO and a guy was doing his thing and we'd collide every day or so and compare notes. He found one on a piece of property that had a bit of traffic. I never could find it but found my own later.

If you are looking for a 140-150-160 inch buck, I'd say you have a good chance in about any unit. Cover ground and let your binoculars do their job.

 

[Undrgrndprdcts]

I've been on 3 western hunts - 2 antelope and 1 mule deer. Saw good muley bucks on each hunt - they are there.

We were in CO and a guy was doing his thing and we'd collide every day or so and compare notes. He found one on a piece of property that had a bit of traffic. I never could find it but found my own later.

If you are looking for a 140-150-160 inch buck, I'd say you have a good chance in about any unit. Cover ground and let your binoculars do their job.

I mean I would definitely shoot a 160 based on what I've seen. My last trip to Colorado (for elk) yielded zero mule deer sightings.