Advice Needed: Getting Proper Eye Relief

[sont5413]

Hey Everybody,

I am struggling to get proper eye relief. I set my scope to highest power (14), get set behind the rifle in a prone position (where I shoot most often), and cannot get a clear sight picture behind the scope (without shadow). This makes me get, what I perceive to be, too far forward to get the proper eye relief. I have already moved the scope as far back as it can go.

I think my only option is too get a one-piece picatinny rail for my REM model 700 .30-06, in order to move the scope rings further back, and thus, the scope further back.

Any advice would be appreciated! Please see photos as additional data.

Thanks,

Willis

 

[Rob5589]

Well, if you need it further rearward, a rail and rings would certainly help. Not much you can do with your current set-up based on your pics. Although your front ring is right at the front end of the port. In order to get it further rear, the ring would be over the port.
How are you on stock length? Maybe a bit too long for you? Could you be seeing "tunneling" which happens in some scopes, especially at higher power. Have you tried it at say 10x?

 

[sont5413]

Well, if you need it further rearward, a rail and rings would certainly help. Not much you can do with your current set-up based on your pics. Although your front ring is right at the front end of the port. In order to get it further rear, the ring would be over the port.
How are you on stock length? Maybe a bit too long for you? Could you be seeing "tunneling" which happens in some scopes, especially at higher power. Have you tried it at say 10x?

Rob, thanks for commenting.

1) I think length of pull is OK, but I will re-check.

2) Yes, the view is tunneled at highest power, (14 on my leupold), which makes me have to compensate by getting further forward, thus compensating feeling solid behind the stock.

3) Yes, I have tried it at 10x and the view is good to go, however, I've read several folks setting the eye relief using the maximum power of the scope

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

With a variable power scope you are always going to have the sight picture change slightly as you increase and decrease the zoom range. This is especially noticeable on smaller main tubes as they let less light in to compensate for the “tunneling”.

If you feel like you can’t get the scope forward enough you need to check the length of pull on your stock and see if you can shorten it. There are other steps to take after that but that’s where I’d start.

 

[Rob5589]

Rob, thanks for commenting.

1) I think length of pull is OK, but I will re-check.

2) Yes, the view is tunneled at highest power, (14 on my leupold), which makes me have to compensate by getting further forward, thus compensating feeling solid behind the stock.

3) Yes, I have tried it at 10x and the view is good to go, however, I've read several folks setting the eye relief using the maximum power of the scope

I would say you are probably just going to have to deal with some tunneling at the top end. You don't want the scope so far back you are having to adjust your shouldering at various magnification levels.

 

[ODB]

Don’t forget exit pupil. At 14x the exit pupil is only 2.8mm. There is only .7” difference between eye relied at 4.5x and 14x. But the small exit pupil will magnify any misalignment of your eye/scope since it’s so small.

 

[sont5413]

Don’t forget exit pupil. At 14x the exit pupil is only 2.8mm. There is only .7” difference between eye relied at 4.5x and 14x. But the small exit pupil will magnify any misalignment of your eye/scope since it’s so small.

Thanks for commenting. I don't understand what you mean by don't forget about exit pupil. What can I do to mitigate what you are bringing up?

 

[sont5413]

Thanks for commenting. I don't understand what you mean by don't forget about exit pupil. What can I do to mitigate what you are bringing up?

Bear in mind that I am still a white belt in the art of the rifle. Been hunting/shooting for a while now, just haven't taken a deep dive into the technique and getting everything dialed until now.

 

[sont5413]

I would say you are probably just going to have to deal with some tunneling at the top end. You don't want the scope so far back you are having to adjust your shouldering at various magnification levels.

Is it an absolute rule that one must have clear vision through their scope without any shadows and tunneling. Is that correct sight alignment? I ask because I've hear a lot of folks talk about the importance of having a clear picture through the scope, without any shadows, every time you take a shot.

 

[ODB]

Thanks for commenting. I don't understand what you mean by don't forget about exit pupil. What can I do to mitigate what you are bringing up?

the best way to think about exit pupil is that is the actual diameter of the light that comes out of the scope tube toward your eye. to test this shine a flashlight through The objective lens and put A piece of paper behind the ocular. You’ll see the circle of light is NOT the same size as the ocular lens.

to calculate exit pupil, divide the objective lens diameter ( 40mm) by the scope‘s power. That (in mm) is the diameter of the light coming put of the eyepiece.

there is no way to mitigate the size of the exit pupil, its a function of the way the scope works. But... when you are at 14x you are making the column of light coming out of the scope much smaller than at low power. the smaller that column of light, the more perfectly aligned your eye needs to be with that solemn of light to see A full picture. Your pupil opens between 2-4mm in bright light. If your pupil is say 3mm and the exit pupil is 2.8mm unless youe pupil is perfectly aligned you’ll get the “tunnel” effect.

that’s a long winded way of saying that ina way the 14x scope is working against you at high power. It is simply less forgiving. And it’s also a reason why there are big objectives on some high power scopes. A 50mm objective bumps the exit pupil at 14x from 2.8mm to 3.5mm.

 

[sont5413]

Understood thank you. So one more question for you and others:

1) Should I use power 14, because it blows up the image of an animal to the highest degree, and accept the tunneling. Or is tunneling considered poor sight alignment in terms of rifle/scope marksmanship?

2) Should I throw a picatinny rail on there and move the rings back, so that I can move the scope back to get rid of the tunneling at 14 power?

I don't want to shave the stock, because I'm pretty sure my length of pull is good to go. (it's 13.5)

 

[muddydogs]

Looking at your set up if that was mine I would knock a little off the end of the stock so you can push the scope forward getting more room for the scope bell which in turn would make it possible to get sorter rings instead of them high ones with an added bonus of getting rid of the high cheek piece you have built up.

To set eye relief on my rifles I use the most likely power I will be using which in my case is the lowest scope power. Out to 200 or so yards I find that I usually don't adjust my scope power. Going with the lowest power for eye relief usually provides a good scope picture through most of the magnification and if I get some tunneling at the highest powders I just deal with it since at this point I have some time and a good solid rest to shoot from. Lets face it you may want to be a bad **s long range shooter but if your a true hunter out hunting trying to make things happen and not a set on a hill guy waiting for things to happen most of your shots on game will be under 200 yards and happen quick so the best sight picture at lowest scope power settings is were its at.

 

[ODB]

Understood thank you. So one more question for you and others:

1) Should I use power 14, because it blows up the image of an animal to the highest degree, and accept the tunneling. Or is tunneling considered poor sight alignment in terms of rifle/scope marksmanship?

2) Should I throw a picatinny rail on there and move the rings back, so that I can move the scope back to get rid of the tunneling at 14 power?

I don't want to shave the stock, because I'm pretty sure my length of pull is good to go. (it's 13.5)

Hate to say, but that’s an answer I can’t provide. I do echo that 14x is an awful lot of magnification and the perceived benefit of extra power is overplayed by the frustration of getting a clear sight picture.

I know of a girl who killed a dall ram with her 416 Rem at several hundred yards with a 2.5x scope. And also used that same rifle to kill a Cape buffalo at a lot closer than that.

 

[sont5413]

Well, if you need it further rearward, a rail and rings would certainly help. Not much you can do with your current set-up based on your pics. Although your front ring is right at the front end of the port. In order to get it further rear, the ring would be over the port.
How are you on stock length? Maybe a bit too long for you? Could you be seeing "tunneling" which happens in some scopes, especially at higher power. Have you tried it at say 10x?

Well, if you need it further rearward, a rail and rings would certainly help. Not much you can do with your current set-up based on your pics. Although your front ring is right at the front end of the port. In order to get it further rear, the ring would be over the port.
How are you on stock length? Maybe a bit too long for you? Could you be seeing "tunneling" which happens in some scopes, especially at higher power. Have you tried it at say 10x?

Is the only potential issue in having the ring over the port on a picatinny that it could just obstruct the load/ejection port? I will eye ball it to see to what degree it may or may not obstruct