6.5s for Elk

GKPrice said:
Bell killed elephants by knee capping them then finishing with a brain shot - I don't think it's a fair comparison
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Yeah, Bell's exploits were the result of good marksmanship and an expert knowledge of elephant anatomy. Bell also habitually shot from rock throwing distances. He also didn't prefer the 6.5 because the bullets would bend and he never shot expanding bullets at anything- everything he fired was FMJ military rounds.

The comparison of elk hunting with a 6.5 at 450 yards to Bell's elephants just doesn't hold up.
 
It does hold, they are dead...which is the point. Funny, I don't hear bow guys talk about drt. I'm no bow guy, but I'm fairly certain they aren't drt. So , why is an issue with guns? Again, bullet selection, shot placement and personal limitations all come into play. Just like I don't get the new long range fad. Why is it a bow hunter can kill at 50 yards or so, but folks feel a need to shoot 1k? A rifle is a tool, that simple. If it does what you want use it....you can only make something so dead.
 
hodgeman said:
Yeah, Bell's exploits were the result of good marksmanship and an expert knowledge of elephant anatomy. Bell also habitually shot from rock throwing distances. He also didn't prefer the 6.5 because the bullets would bend and he never shot expanding bullets at anything- everything he fired was FMJ military rounds.

The comparison of elk hunting with a 6.5 at 450 yards to Bell's elephants just doesn't hold up.
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Agreed to a point.

Bullet construction has come a long way in 100 years though...

My guess is that a 6.5 today is exponentially more deadly than one of it's predecessors.

Still can't think of a single bull elk that's walking away from a run-in with a well placed 140 grain berger leaving the muzzle North of 3000 fps, even at 450 yds.

High SD plus lots of speed = lots of dead critters.

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Not to beat a dead horse, however.....lol.
A elephant skull at 40 yards with a 6.5 or 7 is no small feat. That is alot of bone! So why wouldn't it stop a soft target at a farther range with proper placement?
 
I've killed 2 elk with a 6.5x47 Lapua and 3 elk with a 6.5-300wm. The 6.5-300wm was shooting 140 Amax's at 3230fps and the 6.5x47 Lapua was with 140 Bergers at 2750fps. The 6.5-300wm with 140 Amax's definitely does a better job. I shot 3 elk this year out of my 300wsm using 215 Berger's and wasn't overly impressed with their performance on game compared to Amax's. I'll be shooting ELD-M's this year.
 
I really feel that bullet construction and shot placement are the two biggest factors when using a smaller rifle on elk, I have watched my buddy's kid drop a cow elk on 3 different hunts using my 25-06 with 115gr TSX ( good shot placement). Is it the best choice for an all around elk rifle, definitely not. But in the hands of a good shooter, you get good results. If you are only going to own one rifle a 6.5 can do it all.........but what's the fun in only having one.
 
As you all most likely know, the caliber and bullet debate has been beaten to a pulp and it most likely will always be.
I've shot elk with a shitload of calibers and bullets and they are all dead and in the freezer. I use a 140 Berger in the 6.5's and have not had an elk or deer travel more than 10 yards and most take a dirt nap where they stood. Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement and shot placement. Lots of good bullets in the 6.5 arena and if any one of them find their way into the vitals.........get out the pack frame.

Randy
 
mtnwrunner said:
As you all most likely know, the caliber and bullet debate has been beaten to a pulp and it most likely will always be.
I've shot elk with a shitload of calibers and bullets and they are all dead and in the freezer. I use a 140 Berger in the 6.5's and have not had an elk or deer travel more than 10 yards and most take a dirt nap where they stood. Shot placement, shot placement, shot placement and shot placement. Lots of good bullets in the 6.5 arena and if any one of them find their way into the vitals.........get out the pack frame.

Randy
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When you are ready to part ways with some of those leftys Randy, you know who to contact first right?

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mtnwrunner said:
I use a 140 Berger in the 6.5's and have not had an elk or deer travel more than 10 yards and most take a dirt nap where they stood.
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There's no doubt that frangibles kill really well as long as they make it into the vitals. But my first and only kill with a Berger was out of my 7 mag in December on a small spike WT buck. It was an either sex tag and I actually thought it was a doe from 375 in low light. However, the hit was broadside, mid way up, and about 2" behind the front leg. No exit, and the deer went about 50 yards. I'm pretty confident that I would have gotten the same or similar performance out of a bullet that stays intact and passes through......as that's all I've ever used in the past.
 
5MilesBack said:
There's no doubt that frangibles kill really well as long as they make it into the vitals. But my first and only kill with a Berger was out of my 7 mag in December on a small spike WT buck. It was an either sex tag and I actually thought it was a doe from 375 in low light. However, the hit was broadside, mid way up, and about 2" behind the front leg. No exit, and the deer went about 50 yards. I'm pretty confident that I would have gotten the same or similar performance out of a bullet that stays intact and passes through......as that's all I've ever used in the past.
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Sounds like it worked perfect. Meat in the freezer.
I shoot a lot of animals and have never had a Berger failure. For me, they are accurate, deadly and they work. IMO I would even suggest them in lesser calibers due to the internal damage they do. Oh yeah...........there is that shot placement thing;)

Randy
 
I've taken a lot of my game with a 264 win mag. The rifle was a 300 win mag. I shot everything (rocks, dirt clods, crows, coyotes, game, etc) with that rifle for several years and developed a terrible flinch doing it. I ended up re-barreling it to 264 win mag and have loved it ever since. I used the Nosler 140gr Accubond loaded to 3000fps for years with great results. I switched in 2012 to the 140gr Berger VLD as I increased my comfortable range and found a slower but very consistent load at 2914fps and have taken several animals with it. None have gone far after a hit with the Berger but few have exited. The bullets perform very differently but do the job.

I've never shot an elk with the 264 win mag but have with a 270 win and a 150gr Partition and later a 140gr Accubond. I would not be afraid to elk hunt with the 6.5mm 140 Accubond for sure. That said I currently use a bigger rifle.

My 264 weighs 10.5lbs with scope, ammo, sling, ready to hunt. I use it for antelope, whitetail, and all deer in flatter country. My other main rifle is a 7.25lb ready to hunt 300 win mag. I got one built with a better stock and muzzle brake that doesn't beat me. I will use it on mountain muleys, elk, and a moose hunt I have lined up for next year. I shoot 180gr Accubonds from it at 2956fps. Places where tough shot angles and bigger, heavier bones may be encountered I trust the Accubond more from my years of using them. Places where wind drift and long range consistency are more important than horsepower I like the 264 with the Berger.
 
mcseal2 said:
I've taken a lot of my game with a 264 win mag. The rifle was a 300 win mag. I shot everything (rocks, dirt clods, crows, coyotes, game, etc) with that rifle for several years and developed a terrible flinch doing it. I ended up re-barreling it to 264 win mag and have loved it ever since. I used the Nosler 140gr Accubond loaded to 3000fps for years with great results. I switched in 2012 to the 140gr Berger VLD as I increased my comfortable range and found a slower but very consistent load at 2914fps and have taken several animals with it. None have gone far after a hit with the Berger but few have exited. The bullets perform very differently but do the job.

I've never shot an elk with the 264 win mag but have with a 270 win and a 150gr Partition and later a 140gr Accubond. I would not be afraid to elk hunt with the 6.5mm 140 Accubond for sure. That said I currently use a bigger rifle.

My 264 weighs 10.5lbs with scope, ammo, sling, ready to hunt. I use it for antelope, whitetail, and all deer in flatter country. My other main rifle is a 7.25lb ready to hunt 300 win mag. I got one built with a better stock and muzzle brake that doesn't beat me. I will use it on mountain muleys, elk, and a moose hunt I have lined up for next year. I shoot 180gr Accubonds from it at 2956fps. Places where tough shot angles and bigger, heavier bones may be encountered I trust the Accubond more from my years of using them. Places where wind drift and long range consistency are more important than horsepower I like the 264 with the Berger.
Click to expand...

you added common sense considerations which can change the context of the discussion quite a lot - I, for one, do appreciate that fact
 
mtnwrunner said:
Sounds like it worked perfect. Meat in the freezer.
I shoot a lot of animals and have never had a Berger failure. For me, they are accurate, deadly and they work. IMO I would even suggest them in lesser calibers due to the internal damage they do. Oh yeah...........there is that shot placement thing;)

Randy
Click to expand...

not to belabor the point, and I too sometimes use Bergers, doesn't the term "failure" pretty much detail what a Berger bullet does on impact ? It IS crucial that the explained "2-3" inches of penetration but with a frangilble bullet how can that be expected or calculated from 450 + yards ?
 
Thanks, I like to try to keep others from making my mistakes and share my experiences as I learn from the experiences of others here.

It got me thinking, I see people discuss bullets quite a bit and was asked about my thoughts on the Accubond or Berger a while back on another forum. I'll start a new thread under firearms to not hi-jack this one and copy my reply there for anyone interested.
 
mcseal2 said:
Thanks, I like to try to keep others from making my mistakes and share my experiences as I learn from the experiences of others here.

It got me thinking, I see people discuss bullets quite a bit and was asked about my thoughts on the Accubond or Berger a while back on another forum. I'll start a new thread under firearms to not hi-jack this one and copy my reply there for anyone interested.
Click to expand...

Cool ... Thank you !
 
Back in 1968 when I was a sophomore in high school I bought a Remington 660 in 6.5 Remington magnum. Paid $148 for the rifle and $50 for the weaver K4 scope. My dad was a dealer and part time gunsmith, full time aerospace machinist. He shot a custom 3006 that he built from an 03A3 military rifle. After he saw how accurate mine shot and how well it killed deer he sold his 06 and bought an identical Remington 660. He passed away a few years ago and I have both of those 6.5's in my safe. I did kill a bull elk with mine in 1978. A long cross canyon shot, the first round hit right below the bedded bull. He stood up and I held just over his back for the second shot, with the 120 grain Sierra, running at 3000 fps out of the 20 " barrel, hitting right behind his shoulder. He did a front flip and was DRT. I've always been impressed with the shock and damage the 6.5 does on big game animals.

Sent from the Arizona desert
 
I've shot a bunch of animals in the passed with all sorts of 30 cal bullets 150-180 but the 120-140 grain bullets from my 6.5 saum are downright impressive when it comes to killing power. I used the 120 ttsx as a close range load on a 225 yard shot on my first bull elk this year and was not let down


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