6.5 CM vs 6.5 PRC build options

[slowelk]

I guess you haven’t shot a lot of elk? I can assure you they will not be equal in hunting bigger animals.

How? Shooting the same 6.5mm round, if expansion is achieved and shot placement is the same why would the results be any different? Answer: they wouldn't.

This comment is as about as helpful as your first manbun comment.

 

[Formidilosus]

I guess you haven’t shot a lot of elk? I can assure you they will not be equal in hunting bigger animals.

How many elk have you shot with 6.5mm’s, what projectiles, what impact velocities, and what were the differences noted?

I haven’t shot “a lot” of elk. “A lot” to me means high three digit, low four digit numbers. I have shot a lot of 150-300lb mammals. I’ve shot a few elk. Some have been killed with 6.5’s at significantly more range than anything mentioned.

Yeah this is what I’ve read/learned... I’m trying to figure out, the PRC still goes in a short action, correct? But I’ve seen certain things say something about not fitting/cycling easily with a short action and mag only holding 3 rounds instead of 5 or something like that?

The PRC is not a good fit in most short actions, yes you can make it work but it really needs a medium length. It would be the choice of actions regardless, but the Tikka T3 makes the PRC easy.

As long as you keep impact speeds above what is required for good bullet upset, you can not tell the difference in any real terms between the CM and PRC.

Lots of practice and deer is an easy choice for the CM. One would have to question someone suggesting the PRC when “ton of rounds” is one of the main criteria.

 

[wildwilderness]

Wow, CM fans sure are touchy about The needmor or creedless

 

[JakeSCH]

As long as you keep impact speeds above what is required for good bullet upset, you can not tell the difference in any real terms between the CM and PRC.

Lots of practice and deer is an easy choice for the CM. One would have to question someone suggesting the PRC when “ton of rounds” is one of the main criteria.

The benefits of the PRC over the CM is the ability to extend the effective range of a bullet in addition to reducing drop / wind drift. With the 500 yard limit in mind I agree that in most circumstances the the difference in velocity won't have a significant impact on an elk assuming the shooters ability to hit the same spot with both.

I would also note, that the price difference between the CM and PRC is not much if you are reloading. Extra 10 grs of powder and slightly more expensive brass. An added benefit for me reloading the PRC is that I can use the same powder as my 300 WM.

 

[Wildwillalaska]

Jake really touches upon the biggie for me, and that wind drift. With quality range finders and optics having reticles/ turrets allowing exact compensation for bullet drop, the extra speed of magnums just isn’t as important as it once was. But when you start -laying a long ranges, for fun or competition, you learn real quick the factor thats hardest to precisely sort out is wind. Especially when you get into mountains and you have winds blowing different speeds, even directions, at different portions of a bullets intended path. And further out, where speed and energy starts to diminish, the wind imparts more. For me, the extra velocity/energy is worth it here. And I don’t care about marginal increase in rough cost if I am going to try and push that projectile through a live animal at any distance.

I am a big 6.5 fan, have several creedmoors (3 in 22” and 24” fieldcraft alone plus few customs) and 6.5 SAUMs. GAP is rebarreling a prior build to 6.5PRC right now, which will be my first. It’s once that took me a while to warm up since its not as fast as the SAUM, but I can get factory ammo if ever short on time for loading. Always make time, but there are days where it’s nice to just grab a box of prerolled and head to the range.

End of the day, either one will likely serve you well. Not to sound critical, but if round cost is a barrier or significant factor in your decision, maybe look at a quality factory rifle and spend the extra money on more ammo. This is why I still love the good old 308. And why when I shot F-class I did limited class. The 308 is just cool as if you shoot a barrel out, well, you have bragging rights, quality lapis brass lasts almost as long as the barrels. Just a cheap round that is wildly accurate when built right, can shoot some real heavy rounds (my competition rounds were relatively hot 185gr Berger’s), and while you can shoot heavies hot to try and gain some edge on the wind, the round is not as efficient in the wind at 6.5 and 7mm projectiles. So it forces you to learn wind, which isn’t a bad thing.

Good luck, have fun.

 

[AverageGrunt]

Creedmostest is the best go with that

 

[PRC_GUY]

So I originally was going to go with a different caliber but I’ve settled on these two. The largest game I’d ever be taking with it is elk, and that would be at most one trip every other year, and I would have other options in the future for caliber. I’d be doing a lot of target and some back country hunts for elk and muleys.

With that being said is it smart to go with the PRC for extra energy when elk hunting or will the CM get it done?

What receiver do you all recommend going with as an overall good value but not sacrificing quality/accuracy?

I will go with the PRC

 

[TradLife406]

Look at the Sherman wildcats.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

 

[gearguywb]

The difference in ammo cost should not be a factor. Lets face it, on a hunting rifle, that gets carried a lot and shot little, the difference is negligible.

Over the life of the rifle you could be talking a difference of a couple of hundred dollars. Skip eating out a couple of times with the family and you are even.

 

[kickemall]

For an action take a look at the Bighorn Origin. Its hard to beat for the price.

 

[Gatorgrizz27]

How many elk have you shot with 6.5mm’s, what projectiles, what impact velocities, and what were the differences noted?

I haven’t shot “a lot” of elk. “A lot” to me means high three digit, low four digit numbers. I have shot a lot of 150-300lb mammals. I’ve shot a few elk. Some have been killed with 6.5’s at significantly more range than anything mentioned.





The PRC is not a good fit in most short actions, yes you can make it work but it really needs a medium length. It would be the choice of actions regardless, but the Tikka T3 makes the PRC easy.

As long as you keep impact speeds above what is required for good bullet upset, you can not tell the difference in any real terms between the CM and PRC.

Lots of practice and deer is an easy choice for the CM. One would have to question someone suggesting the PRC when “ton of rounds” is one of the main criteria.

Not negating your experience, and I agree that if a bullet is put where it needs to go with enough speed to expand it “will“ kill the animal, but shock still plays a big role in terms of how fast it goes down.

You’d say a 7mm-08 kills just as quickly as a 7mm Rem Mag at 300 yards?

I think a lot of people only focus on these extreme long range target benefits of said cartridges and lose sight of the closer hunting benefits.

So far I’ve only killed one animal with my 6.5, a 160 lb whitetail, but it ran about 50 yards with a “perfect” double lung, behind the shoulder shot.

In my 16 years of hunting, the furthest one has made it with my .30-06 is about 5 yards. Most don’t move.

That includes comparing a 143 gr 6.5 bullet at 2,750 fps to a 125 gr .30 reduced recoil load at 2,700 fps. The larger diameter bullet still seemed to kill faster.

 

[Formidilosus]

Not negating your experience, and I agree that if a bullet is put where it needs to go with enough speed to expand it “will“ kill the animal, but shock still plays a big role in terms of how fast it goes down.

What is “shock” in regards to terminal ballistics?

You’d say a 7mm-08 kills just as quickly as a 7mm Rem Mag at 300 yards?

Depends upon the projectile. With some, there is so little difference that it is not possible to know which one made which wound, and you you can not tell by seeing the animals reaction which shot which. With some bullets, yes- there is a difference in wound channels and therefor speed of incapacitation. However at 300 yards, it is way less a difference than people believe.

So far I’ve only killed one animal with my 6.5, a 160 lb whitetail, but it ran about 50 yards with a “perfect” double lung, behind the shoulder shot.

In my 16 years of hunting, the furthest one has made it with my .30-06 is about 5 yards. Most don’t move.

That includes comparing a 143 gr 6.5 bullet at 2,750 fps to a 125 gr .30 reduced recoil load at 2,700 fps. The larger diameter bullet still seemed to kill faster.

Unless a complete and total failure, samples of one mean absolutely nothing. Even with a total failure, samples of one don’t mean anything.

In .308 diameter bullets between 308, 30/06, 300 WM, PRC, Weatherby, RUM, Lapua, RUM Imp, 30/378, Warbird, etc. I have killed and seen killed hundreds of deer. With 6.5’s in CM, x47, 260, 6.5-284, PRC, 264 WM, 26 Nos, 6.5-300 Wearherby, etc. it is less, but still well over a hundred deer. Given bullets that maximize tissue destruction, the big 30cals do create more tissue damage and hence faster incapacitation. However I would wager a healthy bet that NO ONE wants what those bullets do to normal sized deer.

On deer sized game (sub 300lbs) maximized tissue destruction is the 178gr ELD-M/Amax for readily available bullets in .308. With bigger 6.5’s max destruction is between the 140gr and 147gr ELD-M, and 130-140gr Berger VLD’s.
A 30cal normal magnum producing around 3,000fps MV or a bit more from the 178gr ELD-M will produce permanent wound channels of 8-9” above 2,400fps impact speed. They look like this-










6.5’s look like this-











I don’t know anyone that eats their game that is really happy with the tissue destruction that either one produces. If you buy a 30cal (or any caliber) and then choose a harder bullet to reduce tissue/meat damage, you’re literally ripping out spark plugs on your V8 to reduce its power...

As for distance traveled- the 178gr ELD-M from a 30cal magnum is about as close as you can get to a near guaranteed immediate drop from soft tissue only hits forward of the diaphragm of any commonly available projectile. The first 120’ish deer with only rib shots killed with it, if I remember correctly; only 6-7 were not an immediate drop on impact. I’m not talking “stood there and then fell over”, I mean marionette strings cut at impact. This is due to the temporary stretch cavity being large enough to effect the spinal cord with a hit anywhere in the torso.

On 6.5’s around 5-7 out of 10 will be immediate drops from similar impacts.

 

[Formidilosus]

In comparison with bonded bullets, there is not really observable differences in wounds between 6.5’s and .308’s at like impact speeds. The difference is there, but it is small enough that it is hard to see, let alone quantify. With monos such as Barnes, GMX, E-Tips, etc. there is no observable difference in wound channels between them save slightly more penetration depth with higher weights.

 

[Woodrow F Call]

Not negating your experience, and I agree that if a bullet is put where it needs to go with enough speed to expand it “will“ kill the animal, but shock still plays a big role in terms of how fast it goes down.

You’d say a 7mm-08 kills just as quickly as a 7mm Rem Mag at 300 yards?

I think a lot of people only focus on these extreme long range target benefits of said cartridges and lose sight of the closer hunting benefits.

So far I’ve only killed one animal with my 6.5, a 160 lb whitetail, but it ran about 50 yards with a “perfect” double lung, behind the shoulder shot.

In my 16 years of hunting, the furthest one has made it with my .30-06 is about 5 yards. Most don’t move.

That includes comparing a 143 gr 6.5 bullet at 2,750 fps to a 125 gr .30 reduced recoil load at 2,700 fps. The larger diameter bullet still seemed to kill faster.

A non CNS hit will alow a deer to do what it wants for a limited time. I've tracked a couple of whitetails after a double lung behind the shoulder hit with .308. .30-06, .30-30.... some go 100 yards. Some drop right there, one ran up to me to expire.

 

[b_doornenbal]

I feel the advantage of going with a PRC in my humble opinion is the fact that you can maintain the velocity in a shorter barrel. I have a 22 inch barrel in my PRC and shooting 2985 with 156gr Bergers with RL-26. I would need at least a 26 inch pipe to even contend as my 22 inch Creed is 2650 with 143's. I personally like my hunting rigs light and short but that's my preference.