50 Cal - Whate velocity are you getting?

[sniper20]

Hey guys,

I'm new to muzzleloading and have seen a wide range of velocities listed by different people. I wanted to put a poll up to see what loads people are getting their best accuracy and velocity from.

I know that in the world of metallic cartridges, there are nodes. Different powder charges with harmonics of barrels. I also know that many people don't have access to chronographs. So, I figured I would try to put something together to see if we might be able to help people find a node with their rifles, and others can see if something else might be better than what they use now.

If you can, please list the following on your post:

Rifle
Powder (pellets or loose and brand)
Bullet
Primer
FPS

 

[Caseknife]

Traditions Vortek, 290 Barnes T-EZ, 2 50 gr Triple-7 pellets, 1650fps, Garmin. Killed a 6 pt bull elk last fall just fine.

 

[sniper20]

Traditions Vortek, 290 Barnes T-EZ, 2 50 gr Triple-7 pellets, 1650fps, Garmin. Killed a 6 pt bull elk lastView attachment 975932View attachment 975933 fall just fine.

Awesome info! I added another category for the lower velocity. Thank you!

 

[cnelk]

CVA Accura
90GR Pyrodex
420gr No Excuses
1500fps

Shot this bull in 2024 at 70yds in near shoulder. Found the slug in opposite hind hip.

 

[Caseknife]

CVA Accura
90GR Pyrodex
420gr No Excuses
1500fps

Shot this bull in 2024 at 70yds in near shoulder. Found the slug in opposite hind hip.



View attachment 975964View attachment 975965

Was it such a steep quartering too angle that the bullet cut a slot in the hide as it appears in the picture?

 

[Hnthrdr]

Cva accura V2
340 grn eld-x
100 grn Blackhorn 209
1850 fps

Shot and killed a solid 6x bull this last season approx 50 ish yards, died about 12 steps from the shot location, lungs were liquid, no pass through

 

[cnelk]

Was it such a steep quartering too angle that the bullet cut a slot in the hide as it appears in the picture?

Yep

 

[Chris in TN]

Hey guys,

I'm new to muzzleloading and have seen a wide range of velocities listed by different people. I wanted to put a poll up to see what loads people are getting their best accuracy and velocity from.

I know that in the world of metallic cartridges, there are nodes. Different powder charges with harmonics of barrels. I also know that many people don't have access to chronographs. So, I figured I would try to put something together to see if we might be able to help people find a node with their rifles, and others can see if something else might be better than what they use now.

If you can, please list the following on your post:

Rifle
Powder (pellets or loose and brand)
Bullet
Primer
FPS

What is 'known' about 'nodes' in metallic reloading, is incredibly shaky 'knowledge' at very best. I'd call it more as-yet-unverified theory.

If 'nodes' are even a valid concept, it's certainly nothing to worry about with muzzleloaders at typical ranges involved in muzzleloader hunting, certainly not with open sights.

Source: I've shot muzzleloaders ranging from T7 powder and cast 450+ grain .50 caliber bullets in the 1400' range all the way up to smokeless guns with N120 or H4198/IMR4198 and speeds up to 2600' or so with sabots. At no point have I ever noticed a 'node' or speed that seemed to give better accuracy than any other speed, as long as I was within the pressures at which I could expect my sabots to stay intact, or my cast bullets to stabilize well given their length and MV and rate of twist.

If you want muzzleloader accuracy, the single easiest low-hanging-fruit I can suggest that you grab onto, is consistent seating pressure. Figure out what speed you want to shoot (hint: if you're hunting with open sights inside of perhaps 150 yards it doesn't take a lot of velocity to poke a big hole through an animal) and be sure you're shooting a bullet or bullet/sabot combo that fits your bore well (read: tight, especially with BH209), in an appropriately twisted barrel, keep the ignition channel consistently clean, don't let the bore get hot if you're shooting sabots, and USE CONSISTENT SEATING PRESSURE.

Everything else you do will be secondary to those things.

(And yes, I realize that there's probably some place on the internet where people will go on endlessly about 'nodes'. It's still an unproven theory at best and absolutely not something you need to focus on. I can't say definitively whether nodes exist or not. I can only say it's not something to worry about, or even think about. I've seen various guns shoot consistently well (or not) across pretty much the entire velocity spectrum)

ETA: And even if 'nodes' are a thing, don't expect two identical rifles to make the same velocity with the same load. Minor bore variances or seating pressure can make huge impacts on speeds)

 

[Caseknife]

As Chris said, uniform seating is the trick. Mark the ramrod with the load you are going to use after very firmly seating the load in a clean bore. My set up I can shoot three shots and then the 4th I have to work real hard to seat that last 1/8" and if it doesn't, can hear it in the report.

 

[ElDiablito]

“Nodes” are fiction.

In muzzys, every rifle is a little different.

Seating pressure is not a secret to consistancy.

Consistancy in everything is the key to smaller groups.

 

[ElDiablito]

Would be helpful if guys specified what their idea of “best accuracy” is.

Most don’t really do much load dev work. Lots of guys call their load gtg if they can hit a paper plate at 100 yards.

 

[Hnthrdr]

Diablo, in your opinion what is “good” accuracy, open sights, loose powder, at 100 yards?

 

[ElDiablito]

Diablo, in your opinion what is “good” accuracy, open sights, loose powder, at 100 yards?

Probably something like sub 3” groups.

 

[Live_weighT34]

My TC Omega Z5 is shooting the Hornady 340gr bore driver ELDXs right at 2000fps

Thompson Center Omega Z5
Hornady Bore driver ELDX 340gr
100gr Blackhorn 209 (by weight)
CCI magnum 209 shot shell primers

Consistently putting up 2-3” 5 shot groups at 100 with open sights

 

[Gone4Days]

1775 fps
300 gr Thor Hammers
100 gr/vol T7
Winchester 209 T7 primer

 

[tkhuntsman]

Hey guys,

I'm new to muzzleloading and have seen a wide range of velocities listed by different people. I wanted to put a poll up to see what loads people are getting their best accuracy and velocity from.

I know that in the world of metallic cartridges, there are nodes. Different powder charges with harmonics of barrels. I also know that many people don't have access to chronographs. So, I figured I would try to put something together to see if we might be able to help people find a node with their rifles, and others can see if something else might be better than what they use now.

If you can, please list the following on your post:

Rifle
Powder (pellets or loose and brand)
Bullet
Primer
FPS

54 cal pedersoli Hawken hunter
85 grn of goex 2F
485 grn no excuses conical
CCI #11 magnum
Garmin gave me an average of 1728
I've got lots of traditional sidelock rifles and the load data is different for all of them. This is the most recent I had data from ( last week ).

 

[tkhuntsman]

54 cal pedersoli Hawken hunter
85 grn of goex 2F
485 grn no excuses conical
CCI #11 magnum
Garmin gave me an average of 1728
I've got lots of traditional sidelock rifles and the load data is different for all of them. This is the most recent I had data from ( last week ).

My most recent trip with my 50 was in mid Nov.
50 cal CVA mtn rifle
80 grn of swiss 3F
325 grn home cast lee real bullet
CCI #11 magnum
1812 fps average
Same rifle
75 grn of pyrodex select 2F
.495 round ball .012 patch
CCI #11 magnum
1885 fps
This is probably my best grouping load at 100 yards and honestly the one I hunt with the most.
I just make sure not to take shots at over 125 yards.
My 54 is set up for long range and conical shooting with the fast twist barrel. And long range sight system (still considered open sights in all states). It also carries the largest amount of energy out to longer distances but it's still 200 and in for hunting. I have made shots on steel to 500. I really do like the tradition and challenge of hunting with round ball so I probably use it the most.